CAMERA CLUBS - update / review on ours

[DaveS2]

It's a hobby, not life or death and should be treated as such IMO. Yes, produce your best work for competitions, but don't get upset if you're a landscape specialist and the judge loves wildlife and judges accordingly

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Indeed, it is just that Sara, a hobby, and If competitions are your 'thing' then why not.. I suspect that in the majority of camera clubs, there is no mandate that says you have to enter them, so there is freedom choice. Albeit one local to me states that "members are expected to enter the competitions, both internal and external", albeit at least they are up-front about it, so prospective members know where they stand.

You say "Yes, produce your best work for competitions, but don't get upset if you're a landscape specialist and the judge loves wildlife and judges accordingly". This is precisely why I fail to see how they can be taken seriously.

An extreme example of course, but if wanted a professional opinion on a respiratory problem, I wouldn't call upon the services of an orthopedic consultant. Both he and the respiratory consultant are qualified medical experts, but in very different fields.

How can expert in wildlife, or portrait photography, sensibly judge landscapes. Of course he or she can see that the technical elements of an image are good, bad, or average, but when it comes to the subjective elements, he or she will invoke their own personal thoughts. Quite likely, these will be different to those of a landscape specialist.

Club level competitions can be good fun, give you the opportunity to see the work of others, and maybe learn something from the judges comments, but as for picking a "winner", that is just the opinion of a single judge, and his or her personal preference. Not something to get either excited or upset about, but unfortunately there are those that do.

Dave

 

[Bythesea]

I suspect that in the majority of camera clubs, there is no mandate that says you have to enter them, so there is freedom choice. Albeit one local to me states that "members are expected to enter the competitions, both internal and external", albeit at least they are up-front about it, so prospective members know where they stand.

While that is true, as most clubs seem to have competitions as the mainstay of their season, it begs the question why anyone who wasn't interested in them would join in the first place. Or perhaps you mean that the freedom of choice is whether to join or not.

And having said that, I have no interest in entering competitions but still joined my local camera club a couple of years ago (after studiously not doing so for the preceding 10 years). I stayed a member for one and a half evenings...

 

[DaveS2]

That's very easy to answer Brian.

I joined a club because I wanted to share my hobby with other like-minded people, and hopefully hear some interesting speakers. While one or two were quite boring (at least to me), others were very informative, and sometimes entertaining.

With its limited number of competitions (just 3 in a club year), it suited my needs nicely, and I enjoyed the whole club experience, especially the social element,

That is of course, until the competition fanatics took over (see my earlier post), and I left.

Dave

 

[Bythesea]

In that case then yes - but in the local clubs here it seems that at least 50% of all meetings are competitions, while a lot of the remainder had a competition aspect. Still wondering why I joined...

 

[DaveS2]

Unfortunately, all of the local clubs around here, and there are few, are more about competitions than amateur photography, which is why I never joined them.

Sadly the only one that wasn't obsessed with competitions, it being the one I joined, is now no different to all the others. Hence I am no longer a member.

Dave

 

[Ste Manns]

I made the mistake of popping along yo the local club a few weeks ago. Isay mistake because it was the most boring and, frankly uncomfortable three hours I had experienced for quite a while.
I don't wish to be unkind. It was only a small group, all well over retirement age and not a one was knowledgeable to any degree (please understand, I am not being snobby or unkind here) in photography. The head of the group was the only one there with any idea and I got the feeling he was 'king of the castle'. He spent the three hours trying to set up a water drop rig, but he couldn't get it to work. I tried to explain (carefully and subtly) where things were going wrong but was ignored and then glared at. The rest of the group chatted a bit but half of them were a bit deaf and it was very painful having to half shout so they could hear, me being the group newbie.
Anyway. I left and haven't been back since. This is the sole experience of camera clubs that I have, if they're all like this...

Anyway. I would much prefer just a small ish get together of like minded folk who can just have a chat about their mutual hobby. No pressure, no agenda, no competitions and activities and no slide shows! Photowalks and photo shoots can be arranged on a ad hoc basis. I have yet to discover such a group mind..

 

[Steve Smith]

I prefer a group of one.


Steve.

 

[DG Phototraining]

Best comment I ever got during normal club life (so no external judge, just all members commenting) was on a shot of a baby I'd taken

Now I know you're supposed to disassociate your feelings from the images you put up, but this was honestly THE BEST EVER shot I'd taken of a child, and I loved it

Our judging was bizarre in that although it went from 0-20 the lowest normal mark was 11; and a 10 meant - give a kid on the street your camera with everything in auto mode, he snaps a shot of you back and if the autofocus/exposure worked ok its a 10 !!!

Aside from a lot of 18s, a few 19s and a brace of 20s for my baby shot (18 was the lowest from almost anyone), one person gave it a 10

An f-ing 10 FFS !!!

When challenged, he merely replied... Cos I don't like babies

I can't type my reply

One of my fellow members thought it was so funny he had it printed on a t-shirt which he gave me a week later

Dave

 

[DaveS2]

Anyway. I would much prefer just a small ish get together of like minded folk who can just have a chat about their mutual hobby. No pressure, no agenda, no competitions and activities and no slide shows! Photowalks and photo shoots can be arranged on a ad hoc basis. I have yet to discover such a group mind..

After I left the my local club, for reasons explained in this 'thread', I tried to create such a group, so far it has failed to attract any interest, and I will now likely 'pull the plug'.

Firstly, I thought about using Facebook (something that I don't normally use), but given its "Jeremy Kyle's waiting room" reputation, I didn't think that anybody would take it seriously, so I decided to try Flickr.

Yep, I know that Flickr is now not much more than an 'image dumping warehouse' where people don't really talk to each other, and when they do comment on an image, its no more than meaningless 'back patting'.

However, I thought it worth a try, so I created a group called the 'South Suffolk Amateur Photography Group', with a description that reads:


"Not just another place to post your latest image, but a group for amateur photography enthusiasts, whether novice or experienced, to share their hobby with like-minded people. Discuss equipment, and techniques, both capture and image processing. Share images, and both give and receive friendly critique if required.

There are countless Flickr groups, but most all seem to be more about being just somewhere to post pictures, with little or no amateur photography discussion. So, I am hoping that this group will become more of a local on-line photographic community, as opposed to being just another photo storage site."

Two months on, and it hasn't attracted a single member, which has pretty much confirmed my thinking on Flickr groups. That is to say, that they are no more than an 'image warehouse' where people can display their work to the world, but have little or no desire to communicate with each other

I did join a Flickr wildlife photography group, and but as far as any discussion goes, its "as dead as a door-nail". I did try to stimulate some discussion, but nobody wanted to know. A reclusive lot!!

So, like Steve, and am now a group of one.

Dave

 

[DaveS2]

When challenged, he merely replied... Cos I don't like babies

I can't type my reply

One of my fellow members thought it was so funny he had it printed on a t-shirt which he gave me a week later

Dave

Dave

 

[Quicksnapper]

.

Indeed, it is just that Sara, a hobby, and If competitions are your 'thing' then why not.. I suspect that in the majority of camera clubs, there is no mandate that says you have to enter them, so there is freedom choice. Albeit one local to me states that "members are expected to enter the competitions, both internal and external", albeit at least they are up-front about it, so prospective members know where they stand.

You say "Yes, produce your best work for competitions, but don't get upset if you're a landscape specialist and the judge loves wildlife and judges accordingly". This is precisely why I fail to see how they can be taken seriously.

An extreme example of course, but if wanted a professional opinion on a respiratory problem, I wouldn't call upon the services of an orthopedic consultant. Both he and the respiratory consultant are qualified medical experts, but in very different fields.

How can expert in wildlife, or portrait photography, sensibly judge landscapes. Of course he or she can see that the technical elements of an image are good, bad, or average, but when it comes to the subjective elements, he or she will invoke their own personal thoughts. Quite likely, these will be different to those of a landscape specialist.

Club level competitions can be good fun, give you the opportunity to see the work of others, and maybe learn something from the judges comments, but as for picking a "winner", that is just the opinion of a single judge, and his or her personal preference. Not something to get either excited or upset about, but unfortunately there are those that do.

Dave

Yes, you're right. Some people do take the competition thing a little too seriously. We do have members who find out who's judging, research that person's preferences and submit their entries accordingly. But, to be fair, we recently had a judge who was a confirmed (and very talented) landscape photographer, who, none the less, gave a top 20 marks to a superb portrait based simply on its merit, so it's not always the case that judges favour their own interests.

Similarly, we have had a judge who clearly dismissed pretty much everything that wasn't a landscape. So it is a bit of a lottery.

Speaking personally, I enter competitions just to gain some experienced critique on my images and have learned a great deal (and hopefully improved) as a result. And much of that is down to the comments of judges regardless of their own preferences, so I will continue to enter.

 

[DaveS2]

so it's not always the case that judges favour their own interests.

I'm sure that can be case Sara, and as you say it is a bit of a lottery, so in the true sense of the word "competition", it is not a consistent, and 'level playing field'.

IMO, those who research a judges preferences, and then adjust their entries to suit are the fanatics, entering to win, by whatever means. They are taking photos, just to please a judge, rather than themselves, in order to be placed upon a meaningless pedestal.

As I said earlier, I entered competitions because they were good fun, I enjoyed seeing the work of others, found the judges comments interesting, and in some cases, learnt something from them. However, for me that was it, and I very quickly learnt how inconsistent the judging was, and that I couldn't take the competitions seriously because of this.

Dave

 

[Bythesea]

After I left the my local club, for reasons explained in this 'thread', I tried to create such a group, so far it has failed to attract any interest, and I will now likely 'pull the plug'.

Firstly, I thought about using Facebook (something that I don't normally use), but given its "Jeremy Kyle's waiting room" reputation, I didn't think that anybody would take it seriously, so I decided to try Flickr.

It might be worth having a look on Meetup - there are a groups local to me that are much more of a "go out and do it" type of thing - www.meetup.com. Facebook wouldn't have worked for me as I don't have an account!

 

[DaveS2]

Hadn't heard of that one Brian, I'll have a look.

Thanks

Dave

 

[DaveS2]

Hmmm!!, there are some very strange groups on there Brian

Including this one

View attachment 28334

Picture courtesy of www.meetup.com

However, there is a photography group registered there, and they do have 'meet-ups', albeit they are geographically very wide spread across the country.

Dave

 

[BBR]

Anyway. I would much prefer just a small ish get together of like minded folk who can just have a chat about their mutual hobby. No pressure, no agenda, no competitions and activities and no slide shows! Photowalks and photo shoots can be arranged on a ad hoc basis. I have yet to discover such a group mind..

Do what I did and set up your own.

There are only four of us. We do not do competitions although we do offer each other critique. We arrange trips and days out for photography, its very informal with no set meeting days as we are all so busy.

It works for us.

 

[Quicksnapper]

I'm sure that can be case Sara, and as you say it is a bit of a lottery, so in the true sense of the word "competition", it is not a consistent, and 'level playing field'.

IMO, those who research a judges preferences, and then adjust their entries to suit are the fanatics, entering to win, by whatever means. They are taking photos, just to please a judge, rather than themselves, in order to be placed upon a meaningless pedestal.

As I said earlier, I entered competitions because they were good fun, I enjoyed seeing the work of others, found the judges comments interesting, and in some cases, learnt something from them. However, for me that was it, and I very quickly learnt how inconsistent the judging was, and that I couldn't take the competitions seriously because of this.

Dave

I totally agree. I enter but don't take it too seriously and just see how it goes. At least they make me push myself, explore new themes or locations and try to come up with something I'm happy to be seen in public.