Calais - Serious intervention required

boyfalldown said:
not quite sure I get your meaning ?me being a bit slow and all that
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Not your slowness my not reading the link properly, thought it was about Libya, although Syria is a diplomatic disaster that all western countries share responsibility.
 
jakeblu said:
Its not like we don't have any responsibility over that!
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Let me give you a very simple example of the French "benefits" system compared with the UK

France - Medical Treatment - You are a French resident and registered - you visit the Docs - you pay Euros 23, cash - you then go to the Chemist, you pay for what he has prescribed - if you are a member of the French health system you get circa 60% back - the same at a French Clinic or hospital.

If you are not a member of the French health system - you pay or you don't get treated unless it is very serious


Walk into a UK doctor off the street, anyone non UK Resident from anywhere, rich or poor, and what happens ........ you get your own private suite, a translator and they take you to the Chemists in a Taxi, FOC ... exaggerating of course
 
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BillN_33 said:
I am not talking about asylum seekers ....... are you saying that all the people in Calais are asylum seekers?

As I said "genuine asylum seekers have nothing to fear in either country"

I can comment of both systems as I have lived and "live" in both countries and am aware of what the French think .......... I have not met anyone who wants them in France ....... maybe there are but I have not spoken to any
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Apparently 170,000 refuges arrived in italy in 2014, there are estimated to be 5000 in calais. Where do you think the rest of them are?
 
Cobra said:
As I've said before, I think that's fairly obvious, free health care, free living accommodation..


Yes, but you work hard, play hard & fit in. Many are not even prepared to do the 1st thing,
As above they know that we hand out money and accommodation ;)
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Not sure about the fitting in :p although my wife doesn't complain :eek:
 
Cobra said:
I was in Kent this morning, and no one contacted me :(


Speaking from a trade mission in Vietnam, Mr Cameron said the situation in Calais was "very concerning" and that Theresa May will chair the Cobra meeting in his absence.
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It's about you...
 
jakeblu said:
Apparently 170,000 refuges arrived in italy in 2014, there are estimated to be 5000 in calais. Where do you think the rest of them are?
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Most of them are probably still in Italy as the French and the Austrians, (not sure about the Germans), have closed their borders to "migrants"

But it is irrelevant to the discussion about what is happening in Calais, these people are breaking the law and are not wanted in the UK, (or in France), they should be dealt with in accordance with the law, as any other person would be, otherwise chaos will occur......... what should or can happen to the 170,000 or indeed 500,000 can be discussed but it is a separate issue, including if any EU member state has any responsibility for this situation.
 
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Cobra said:
Ah OK so even the government are talking behind my back now :(
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Can you liven up the "Bird Section" as it is dying and has become, so so boring, but I did see a little light, (owls can see it the dark), this morning
 
jakeblu said:
Really guys you should look into the problem more rather than listen to what the papers tell you. Most asylum seekers do stay in other countries, in fact far more than come here. Also access to benefits and housing is easier in france than the UK.
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that's very true, all we see is the couple of thousand trying to get through the chunneel.
 
Cobra said:
Ah OK so even the government are talking behind my back now :(
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Well, trying to put it into scale, shed some light onto it, they'd adder nuff you see. Viper your tears away and we'll see what comes out of it.
 
BillN_33 said:
Can you liven up the "Bird Section" as it is dying and has become, so so boring, but I did see a little light, (owls can see it the dark), this morning
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Maybe if "you lot" stopped squabbling and played nice more people would be inclined to post in there?
But thats Waaaaaaaaaaaaaay off topic ;)

Byker28i said:
Well, trying to put it into scale, shed some light onto it, they'd adder nuff you see. Viper your tears away and we'll see what comes out of it.
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And so is that, maybe we should let both just ♪♪slip slide(ing) away?♪♪ ;)
 
Cobra said:
Maybe if "you lot" stopped squabbling and played nice more people would be inclined to post in there?
But thats Waaaaaaaaaaaaaay off topic ;)

And so is that, maybe we should let both just ♪♪slip slide(ing) away?♪♪ ;)
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Ooooooh. Who rattled your cage?

:coat:
 
Cobra said:
Maybe if "you lot" stopped squabbling and played nice more people would be inclined to post in there?
But thats Waaaaaaaaaaaaaay off topic ;)
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That's why it's dying, not many "nice people" and not many posting and when someone nice posts no one answers, because?........ we never squabble, we just argue and insult ...... much nicer
 
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BillN_33 said:
What type of immigrants are being discussed, the type that are sitting in Calais, I don't think so?

I can talk to quite a few "immigrants" 5 mins from my door, they are Portuguese, registered, go back to Portugal for the winter and then come back when they are needed in the vines

but you can argue over stats for ever and a day
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Well not those ones as they have remain to leave. We are talking about asylum seeks of which undoubtedly once processed a percentage will not be granted asylum and will be deported.
 
For what it is worth... I think we need to step back and look at the issue in hand....
1. We have border controls for a reason....
2. Unless you have a visa, you don't get in.
3. If you get caught entering without a visa, you get fecked straight back down the tunnel.
4. Stop free health treatment to non UK citizens.
5. Stop benefits to non UK citizens.

I might sound harsh but it is what I believe should happen to ease the immigrant problem and strain on the NHS...


...and just to add...there are approx 3600 lorries in the M20
 
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dejongj said:
Well not those ones as they have remain to leave. We are talking about asylum seeks of which undoubtedly once processed a percentage will not be granted asylum and will be deported.
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I think we're actually talking about asylum seekers and illegal economic migrants. Some (most?) of those attempting to board at Calais may not apply for asylum when reaching the UK is they expect their application would be rejected.

There is, as far as I can tell, no official data regarding the dispersion of illegal economic migrants throughout the EU. I suspect even if estimates are produced, it would be too politically sensitive to distribute widely.
 
archangel said:
For what it is worth... I think we need to step back and look at the issue in hand....
1. We have border controls for a reason....
2. Unless you have a visa, you don't get in.
3. If you get caught entering without a visa, you get fecked straight back down the tunnel.
4. Stop free health treatment to non UK citizens.
5. Stop benefits to non UK citizens.

I might sound harsh but it is what I believe should happen to ease the immigrant problem and strain on the NHS...
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So asylum seekers get sent home? They don't have visas.
 
archangel said:
For what it is worth... I think we need to step back and look at the issue in hand....
1. We have border controls for a reason....
2. Unless you have a visa, you don't get in.
3. If you get caught entering without a visa, you get fecked straight back down the tunnel.
4. Stop free health treatment to non UK citizens.
5. Stop benefits to non UK citizens.

I might sound harsh but it is what I believe should happen to ease the immigrant problem and strain on the NHS...


...and just to add...there are approx 3600 lorries in the M20
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1. Agreed
2. Agreed
3. Agreed
4..Can't agree with that, behaving decently to people has to come before money, and it isn't the job of medical care services to act as police. Also, the amount involved is insignificant
5. Benefits to new immigrants are already severely restricted - and as for stopping benefits to non citizens - how can that be the right thing to do when there are massive numbers of non-citizens who are here perfectly legally and who contribute to our economy?
 
Llamaman said:
I think we're actually talking about asylum seekers and illegal economic migrants. Some (most?) of those attempting to board at Calais may not apply for asylum when reaching the UK is they expect their application would be rejected.

There is, as far as I can tell, no official data regarding the dispersion of illegal economic migrants throughout the EU. I suspect even if estimates are produced, it would be too politically sensitive to distribute widely.
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Agreed but you wont know that unless you process them ;) Until such time they are seeking asylum, I never disagree that a large number will not pass the tests, are lying through their teeth, and will attempt to disappear.
 
archangel said:
They should be interviewed on the French side and if accepted detained in a buffer zone with no access to benefits.
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Don't forget that by law they are not allowed to work, how are they supposed to live when we don't help and feed them? And yes in theory you should claim asylum at the first safe port, but they don't so it is a futile point.
 
Garry Edwards said:
1. Agreed
2. Agreed
3. Agreed
4..Can't agree with that, behaving decently to people has to come before money, and it isn't the job of medical care services to act as police. Also, the amount involved is insignificant
5. Benefits to new immigrants are already severely restricted - and as for stopping benefits to non citizens - how can that be the right thing to do when there are massive numbers of non-citizens who are here perfectly legally and who contribute to our economy?
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Indeed. I'm not a citizen, I do pay a s*** load into the system....Why wouldn't I be allowed to have access to benefits?
 
Watched the news tonight - Politicians are a load of crap - far worse than some of the images posted in the bird section, and that's saying something

areU.jpg




yes I bloody am
 
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dejongj said:
Much stronger decisive action and control is required in my opinion. It will be interesting to see what the leaders come up with.

.
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I say we invade - the Pas de calais is strictly speaking ours anyway so lets take it back

This will have four benefits

a) most of the immigrants currently in calais will get caught in the crossfire and 'shot in the face' ftw
b) once we've taken it back we can establish a cordon sanitaire
c) a good war with the french is long overdue and we can use it to thin out our own unemployed chavs by using them as canon fodder
d) it will also bring national unity and stimulate our arms manufacturing industries

(no i'm not serious)
 
dejongj said:
Indeed. I'm not a citizen, I do pay a s*** load into the system....Why wouldn't I be allowed to have access to benefits?
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I am talking about non citizens who don't contribute or those who are in detention..:)
 
Garry Edwards said:
4..Can't agree with that, behaving decently to people has to come before money, and it isn't the job of medical care services to act as police. Also, the amount involved is insignificant
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there is also the self interest side as well. As well as for common decency my self interest suggests people should be treated. I don't want people with (for example) TB wondering round because they have no access to medical help
 
Garry Edwards said:
4..Can't agree with that, behaving decently to people has to come before money, and it isn't the job of medical care services to act as police. Also, the amount involved is insignificant
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I am not talking about stopping emergency care...but stopping those who are on holiday or illegally in the UK from getting basic non emergency care...if I go to Canada, Australia etc I have to have medical insurance to receive care.this should also be the case here...not that long ago, my local surgery was treating a non national(walk in from street) for non emergency care, while those registered citizens have to wait for up to 3 weeks to see a doctor...and before you ask, I was in the surgery at the time waiting to be seen, so I saw it first hand...
 
archangel said:
I am talking about non citizens who don't contribute or those who are in detention..:)
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But that is the thing, you don't just get something. However if they have claimed asylum then they will.
 
dejongj said:
But that is the thing, you don't just get something. However if they have claimed asylum then they will.
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So instead of cash, give them vouchers which can only be redeemed at large supermarkets, which have been government approved, so that fraud can be kept to a minimum.....
 
archangel said:
So instead of cash, give them vouchers which can only be redeemed at large supermarkets, which have been government approved, so that fraud can be kept to a minimum.....
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What instead of the £5 per day ;) the cost to administer, approve, artificially enrich certain retailers and not others. It is a pointless exercise and you aren't going to gain anything.
 
dejongj said:
What instead of the £5 per day ;) the cost to administer, approve, artificially enrich certain retailers and not others. It is a pointless exercise and you aren't going to gain anything.
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They get a hell of a lot more than a fiver a day.....:eek:
 
dejongj said:
What instead of the £5 per day ;) the cost to administer, approve, artificially enrich certain retailers and not others. It is a pointless exercise and you aren't going to gain anything.
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I have a property which I let out to tenants, I could easily get another £150 a month by taking in immigrant families, but on principle, I chose not too, I would rather have a lesser amount of rent from a private employed renter, rather than some unemployed lay about or an immigrant family being paid for by the state... Or should I say the working man's taxes....this country is all wrong from the top to the bottom and we are too much of a soft touch...we should be looking after those who want to and cancontribute to the economy, without bleeding the system dry...
 
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