Budget M43 kit choices

[Cagey75]

I will be buying an M43 body soon as a side kit, to experiment a bit. The stabilzation is what attracts me most, and I might dabble a little on the video side. I'd love a GH5 or EM1 mkii but, that's not happening anytime soon. So, I'm looking to the more budget end. The Panasonic GX80, and the Olympus OMD em10 mkii. With maybe a prime and a cheap tele.

Anyone happen to use both of these cameras? If you could only keep one, which would you choose and why?

4K video sounds sweet, but then it means buying a faster card, and well, my laptop is getting on a bit now - it is an i7 but a 4yr old model and it might struggle a bit processing 4K files. I imagine the Oly's 1080p is more than good enough for my needs.

Pros and cons for each? I have been doing research, but it's always better to hear from actual long term users.

Which has the better stabilization? Which is better for stills photography [colour rendering, mid range ISO handling ... ] which has better SP AF?

I fancy the G80, as it's close in size to my X-T1, but even used it's £200 more than the GX80 and I don't think it's £200 better?

Thanks for any input.

 

[Thunderbird010]

Ive had both in the past before I moved back over to Fuji. Handling wise I much preferred the EM10 ii as it felt better in my hands and the EVF was a
Iot easier to use than the GX80. Stabilisation on both cameras is good as Panasonic introduced the dual IS in the GX80 which has in Camera stabilisation as well as certain lenses. The Panasonic also has the 4K where you can take an 8mp still which is a handy feature. The Olympus menus are a pain in the backside but once you get used to them and set up the super control panel they are fine.

 

[maarten.dhaese]

Not using both but very happy with the E-M10II. Also for slightly more money (about £350 used), you could get an E-M1 MkI, which is still a cracking camera, although maybe not the best option for video. I prefer the colours from the E-M1 over the E-M10II.

For a cheap telephoto both the Panasonic 45-150 and the Olympus 40-150 kit lenses are very good.

 

[Cagey75]

Ive had both in the past before I moved back over to Fuji. Handling wise I much preferred the EM10 ii as it felt better in my hands and the EVF was a
Iot easier to use than the GX80. Stabilisation on both cameras is good as Panasonic introduced the dual IS in the GX80 which has in Camera stabilisation as well as certain lenses. The Panasonic also has the 4K where you can take an 8mp still which is a handy feature. The Olympus menus are a pain in the backside but once you get used to them and set up the super control panel they are fine.

The em10 is definitely the better looker, and does look ergonomically better, I do prefer a central EVF. I have heard mixed opinions on the Olympus menu system, some say it's really long winded and even confusing, others say it's simple to navigate. I guess more seasoned Olympus users would be better used to it.

Not using both but very happy with the E-M10II. Also for slightly more money (about £350 used), you could get an E-M1 MkI, which is still a cracking camera, although maybe not the best option for video. I prefer the colours from the E-M1 over the E-M10II.

For a cheap telephoto both the Panasonic 45-150 and the Olympus 40-150 kit lenses are very good.

I have thought on the EM-1, it looks like a more comfortable camera and very comparable in size to my X-T!, but I do kind of want decent video options on top. I've read that the em10-2 was slightly better for noise handling also? I don't plan to use it for really low light shooting so probably not a major factor.

 

[maarten.dhaese]

The menu system is long-winded and confusing but only if you need it. Most of the time I don't need to get into it because pretty much all of the critical settings can be made using the "Super Control Panel" that you can pull up by pressing the "OK" button. The good thing about the menu system is that it makes the camera very customisable.

 

[Cagey75]

The menu system is long-winded and confusing but only if you need it. Most of the time I don't need to get into it because pretty much all of the critical settings can be made using the "Super Control Panel" that you can pull up by pressing the "OK" button. The good thing about the menu system is that it makes the camera very customisable.

I tend to go by 'the more options the better' so I don't think it'll bother me personally That Olympus 40-150, does it hold up quality well towards the longer end? I would probably mostly use it for shooting birds in the garden, nothing crazy, but I do like a sharp image.

 

[Thunderbird010]

I’ve found one photo of birds in my garden on the em5. This will be more or less sooc [IMG bird2 by -Andrew Duxbury Photography-][/IMG]

 

[Thunderbird010]

If you decide you like the system and if you want longer reach I would recommend the Olympus 75-300 ii. It’s smaller and lighter than the Panasonic 100-300 I picked one up from mpb for around £230

 

[snerkler]

I still don't understand all these comments about the Olly menus, they're no more complicated to any other imo, and certainly better than Sony

 

[flashp]

I still don't understand all these comments about the Olly menus, they're no more complicated to any other imo, and certainly better than Sony

I agree, accepting that they seem to have adopted a different convention to Nikon and Canon, between which anyone can flit quite happily and work it out on the hoof.

 

[snerkler]

I agree, accepting that they seem to have adopted a different convention to Nikon and Canon, between which anyone can flit quite happily and work it out on the hoof.

I don't find it that dissimilar to Nikon tbh. Main groups down the left which then reveal the settings for that group. Obviously as with all these things YMMV, but to me the overall layout is pretty similar.

 

[gad-westy]

I still don't understand all these comments about the Olly menus, they're no more complicated to any other imo, and certainly better than Sony

I'm not a big fan of them. Never found them as straight forward as Nikon and some options seemed to need okay to confirm and some the right arrow to tick a box. It was also incredibly easy to accidentally overwrite a user profile instead of selecting it from the menu. It just seemed a bit clumsy at times. However I will say that part of the reason they're more complex is that the Olympus cameras have such an incredible breadth of customisation options. That is a good thing generally and it's kind of inevitable that the menus are going to end up a little heavy.

I would suggest when getting an Olympus camera, more than most, it's worth watching one of the many hour long youtube menu guides and getting the camera set up how you want it so that everything you commonly use is on an external control or in the quick menu. Well worth setting up the user profiles too so you can quickly switch between different sets of settings. Once that is done, the menu's become almost irrelevant. Until that is, Olympus bring out an update and it wipes all your settings Do they still do that? It used to drive me mad.

I've had a couple of Panasonic m4/3 cameras in the past too and I would say they do certain things a bit better, better menu system for starters and perhaps overall are a more sensible/value purchase but they don't have the same emotional appeal as the Olympus bodies which are just a delight to behold and use. I also didn't like the way there was no direct access to moving the focus point on Panasonic models although I think that has now been sorted. Panasonic always seem way better for video though. I don't think you'll see much difference in them in regards to image quality or focusing single point. With a decent lens on, both will be near enough instant focus for single point. Suspect the panasonic will be a little better for moving subjects.

 

[flashp]

I don't find it that dissimilar to Nikon tbh. Main groups down the left which then reveal the settings for that group. Obviously as with all these things YMMV, but to me the overall layout is pretty similar.

The Olly is more configurable I think which may muddy the waters for some. I transitioned without any bother also.

 

[Alexvs]

This is my first post as I found the forum after purchasing my G80 recently and I've come from a 11+ year old Nikon D50 which I only ever used on auto so from a beginners point of view I have to say I'm loving the G80. I opted for this over the smaller bodied M43's because it closely resembled a DSLR feel which I enjoy with my D50. I decided on the G80 over others due to it seeming like good value (so in budget), great 4k shooting modes which allow 8MP stills to be extracted, 5 axis IS and it's fast AF for what I needed with a new little one on the scene so wanted it to document his life. I'm now learning about the semi-auto modes and going on a couple of courses my better half purchased for me from Jessops to learn more. I've only got the 12 - 60 and 45 - 150 lenses for it so far but kind of regret not taking up the deal on the 25mm prime for £99 as dismissed me needing it like a beginner. All the photo's I've taken of the little man and our frenchie look great to me but I'm only just scratching the surface as there's so much on it I have to learn which I'm currently doing through trial and error.

So the G80 gets a big thumbs up from me if you do consider it as even a beginner like me is able to get through the menu system and use it.

 

[woof woof]

I fancy the G80, as it's close in size to my X-T1, but even used it's £200 more than the GX80 and I don't think it's £200 better?

Thanks for any input.

I have a GX80, I've never had a G80 just the previous G7 so the following comment is based on that.

The most obvious differences to me are the RF and mini SLR design but other than that I think that the GX80's EVF is relatively poor whereas I thought that the one the G7 I had was very good and I'd assume that the G80's is equally good if not better. Dunno if EVF quality could sway your decision but the GX80's must be one of the worst on a modern camera of this type. It is IMO relatively poor.

PS.
My G7 was one of the most uncomfortable cameras I've had to hold because of the shape of the grip. In fact I can't remember thinking any other camera was so uncomfortable, it just didn't fit my hand at all and it irritated me every time I picked it up. I've never held a G80 but after my experience with the G7 I don't think I'd buy a G80 without holding one first and thinking about comfort. My old G1 fitted me like a glove.

 

[Cagey75]

It's a tough one, I think it'll be between the em10-2 and G80. The latter option will probably mean me trading something extra, and getting only the one lens. Ergonomics are kind of important, but I can get used to any camera. The xpro1, which is going to be part of the trade, for me, was a pretty uncomfortable camera. I never bought a grip for it, but on its own I often found it slippery especially with a heavyish lens attached. This is my concern for the GX, and the VF doesn't sound too hot. Ive never been a big fan of range finder style in general.

 

[Cagey75]

I still don't understand all these comments about the Olly menus, they're no more complicated to any other imo, and certainly better than Sony

I've used Sony, Nikon and Fuji and though I shot Nikon the most, I hated their menus. They weren't complex or anything, just something about them I found fiddly, but I got over it I'm sure I can get the hang of Olympus's menus in time if I go with that option. I've seen there is a quick menu function on their cameras? That looks useful.

 

[woof woof]

I'm always baffled by all this discussion on menus as it doesn't seem to matter to me. I have Sony and Panasonic cameras and to be honest I see no difference between them menu wise. The menus are extensive... there's page after page of the things... but this is a good thing as it allows you to do so much or you can do like I do and ignore the menus and this must be possible much of the time.

I just can't imagine ruling a camera out because of the layout of its menu.

 

[Cagey75]

I'm always baffled by all this discussion on menus as it doesn't seem to matter to me. I have Sony and Panasonic cameras and to be honest I see no difference between them menu wise. The menus are extensive... there's page after page of the things... but this is a good thing as it allows you to do so much or you can do like I do and ignore the menus and this must be possible much of the time.

I just can't imagine ruling a camera out because of the layout of its menu.

I think it's more casual shooters that moan about it tbh. They want to just shoot without worrying about settings, and they get confused when things aren't going as expected. I have witnessed a near panic attack by someone because their images were coming out blurry and they didn't know how to correct it I've used enough cameras by now to not worry so much. I have to mention it because it tends to pop up in every other review I watch though.

 

[Mr Perceptive]

I think that most of the Olympus menu issues actually come from the multi function buttons, that do different things in different modes!!! Though by working through the menus you can set them up in simpleton form (i.e. For me!!) where they do the same thing independent of mode!!!!

 

[akr]

I think it's more casual shooters that moan about it tbh. They want to just shoot without worrying about settings, and they get confused when things aren't going as expected. I have witnessed a near panic attack by someone because their images were coming out blurry and they didn't know how to correct it I've used enough cameras by now to not worry so much. I have to mention it because it tends to pop up in every other review I watch though.

I might be one of those . Once you have the Super Control Panel up, most things are pretty simple to use and change - in fact I'd say very easy and it's brilliant. I don't find the settings intuitive outside of those on the SCP though and find my Canon 40D far easier to change, but I think the difference is that there is far less to change on my 40D, and I assume the same for many others, who possibly upgrade from older kit. I do find the general menu system morre confusing, but my only real point of reference is the Canon, which I in effect didn't change that much but was simpler (in my mind anyway) to change. I've found it's sometimes faster to just google how to change something than work it out, though that's not ideal in some situations!

 

[Cagey75]

I think it's going to be the OMD em10 mkii, I can always get a Panny body later on if I find I like the system. For lenses I'm looking at the Panasonic 25 1.7, and maybe a cheap tele or wider kit lens. I will also grab an M42 to M43 adapter as I have a couple of M42 lenses that I use on the Fuji also. I have a 200mm F4 and I'll be interested to see how that works with the stabilization. Because without it, it can be a tricky beast to tame unless you use very high shutter speeds.

 

[AMcUK]

The Panasonic 25mm f1.7 is a great lens for very little money though it can be a little bit tight (50mm FF equ field of view).
https://www.flickr.com/photos/amcuk/albums/72157683412383262
I find I'm using my Olympus 17mm f1.8 much more (and before that the cheaper Olympus 17mm f2.8)

If you want an inexpensive zoom the Olympus 14-42mm II R collapsible lens is IMHO as good as the EZ pancake - not as small but much cheaper used.
I have both but use the EZ on my E-M10 Mki because its smaller

The Olympus 12-50mm that came with the E-M5 are plentiful and cheap used - a bit bulkier but has a macro mode.

For longer reach the cheap 40-150mm plastic Olympus punches above it's weight.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/amcuk/albums/72157684003282764

 

[Cagey75]

I must have a better look that Olympus 17mm, it would certainly be better for indoor use. But it is twice the money

 

[snerkler]

I must have a better look that Olympus 17mm, it would certainly be better for indoor use. But it is twice the money

The Panny 20mm f1.7 is a nice lens and cheaper IIRC. Focus can be a little slow if going from near to far and vice versa, but a nice performer overall.

 

[gad-westy]

I must have a better look that Olympus 17mm, it would certainly be better for indoor use. But it is twice the money

The 17mm is very nice lens to use being metal bodied and has the lovely focus clutch mechanism. IQ and focus is good though it never did anything to blow me away, just a very solid performer. The Panasonic 20mm is nice too but slower AF and not nearly as pretty

If you like longer lenses, I think the real bargain is the 45mm. That is a really nice lens. Very cheap and a bit plastic but tiny and yet delivers gorgeous results. The 75mm is even nicer but a bit specialised and a bit pricey.

 

[Cagey75]

The Panasonic 25mm f1.7 is a great lens for very little money though it can be a little bit tight (50mm FF equ field of view).
https://www.flickr.com/photos/amcuk/albums/72157683412383262
I find I'm using my Olympus 17mm f1.8 much more (and before that the cheaper Olympus 17mm f2.8)

If you want an inexpensive zoom the Olympus 14-42mm II R collapsible lens is IMHO as good as the EZ pancake - not as small but much cheaper used.
I have both but use the EZ on my E-M10 Mki because its smaller

The Olympus 12-50mm that came with the E-M5 are plentiful and cheap used - a bit bulkier but has a macro mode.

For longer reach the cheap 40-150mm plastic Olympus punches above it's weight.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/amcuk/albums/72157684003282764

Some very nice examples of the 25 there, what do you use for noise reduction? Very clean for 1000+ on some of those images

 

[woof woof]

Whenever the Panny 20mm pops up in discussion I feel the need to mention the focusing speed which has already been mentioned and also possible banding issue at higher ISO's. This is a difficult thing to understand and you'd think it was the camera rather than the lens but it's the lens and I've seen it with both of the 20mm's I owned. Some people say they've never seen it though. Just another thing to throw into the balance.

I too have the 17mm f1.8 and I think it's lovely.

 

[Cagey75]

The 20mm looks to me very similar to the 27mm 2.8 for Fuji. I had that lens and didn't really like it, it was noisey, sluggish [though very sharp] and I actually prefer a bit of lens to 'cup' than pancake types. For that reason the 25 1.7 is probably the best option for me

 

[AMcUK]

Some very nice examples of the 25 there, what do you use for noise reduction? Very clean for 1000+ on some of those images

The 2015 cat photo you added as a favourite is JPG straight out of the camera just resized with a Windows 10 plugin. It was taken the day I got the lens
The later stuff like the ring workshop was processed from RAW in Lightroom but I'm no expert and rarely play with the noise reduction unless something is super messy.

I must have a better look that Olympus 17mm, it would certainly be better for indoor use. But it is twice the money

I got the 17mm f1.8 for £220 used - it's lovely to use, nicely constructed etc. before that I had the Olympus f2.8 17mm before which I used a great deal. Nice and compact, pretty bright I've read it's not desperately sharp but I never felt the lens was the weak point in my photography
https://flic.kr/s/aHsm1iKTF8

It's around £120 used e.g.
https://www.wexphotovideo.com/olymp...-micro-four-thirds-pancake-lens-used-1643973/


I've heard great things about the Panasonic f1.7 20mm but I was slightly put off by reports of slow autofocus.
As I have had a 17mm and the 25mm (which is cheaper and faster to focus) it's not an itch I've tried to scratch.
https://www.mpb.com/en-uk/used-equi...asonic-lumix-g-20mm-f-1-7-asph-ii/sku-695528/


Olympus 14-42mm at £64 used
Panasonic 20mm f1.7 at £185 used
Panasonic 25mm f1.7 at £150 NEW
Olympus 17mm f2.8 at £120 used
Olympus 17mm f1.8 at £220 used

Given the prices I'd take the Panasonic 25mm f1.7 new and a used 14-42mm over a used 17mm f1.8

https://www.mpb.com/en-uk/used-equi...zuiko-ed-14-42mm-f-3-5-5-6-ii-msc/sku-695086/

 

[Gary...LFC]

Hello mate I've just got into photography on a budget so purchased an omd EM5 mk1. I bought the Panasonic 14mm f2.5 used, panasonic 35-100 f4.0 used and a new panasonic 25mm f1.7 for a total of £300 for the lenses and I'm more than happy with all three as photos to me are excellent for a small handy camera.

 

[Cagey75]

Hello mate I've just got into photography on a budget so purchased an omd EM5 mk1. I bought the Panasonic 14mm f2.5 used, panasonic 35-100 f4.0 used and a new panasonic 25mm f1.7 for a total of £300 for the lenses and I'm more than happy with all three as photos to me are excellent for a small handy camera.

The 35-100 F4, that's the 4-5.6 I presume? the 14mm looks interesting, where did you buy from?

 

[Gary...LFC]

The the 35-100 Is 4-5.6 but for its size produces great images and more than adequate for what I need. I just hunted around and waited for bargain prices. The Pana 25mm f1.7 is a steal at £149 new. My neighbour has the Leica 25mm f1.4 and he can't believe how close mine is to his for quality.

 

[Gary...LFC]

I picked up the EM5 with the 12-50 lens with original receipt from November 2014 with 1200 shutter count with the full grip, a Nikon lens that didn't fit and some filters etc for £250, I sold the grip for £70 the filters for £60 the Nikon lens for £35. So for £85 I got a spotless quality camera with the 12-50 lens a bargain if I say so myself.

 

[Cagey75]

The the 35-100 Is 4-5.6 but for its size produces great images and more than adequate for what I need. I just hunted around and waited for bargain prices. The Pana 25mm f1.7 is a steal at £149 new. My neighbour has the Leica 25mm f1.4 and he can't believe how close mine is to his for quality.

Looks a tidy little lens the 35-100, but I want a bit more on the tele end. Might get a used 40-150. I think the 25 1.7 is a bit of a must for me though.

 

[Gary...LFC]

The 25mm is a bargain. I keep thinking about a longer telephoto but I can keep all three lenses I use in a coat pocket. I have the 12-50 but just don't get on with it as think I will get better shots with the 14mm or 25mm.

 

[dcash29]

I still don't understand all these comments about the Olly menus, they're no more complicated to any other imo, and certainly better than Sony

Cos its hard for some people to admit they're thick. Menus are what they are!

 

[Cagey75]

Cos its hard for some people to admit they're thick. Menus are what they are!

People aren't "thick" for not liking a certain layout, it's call personal preference. Some see quicker access menus as important as ergonomics. That's their call, when there's other options available they have the right to chose.

No difference to me personally though, spend a couple of days playing around with any menu and you'll get the hang of it.

 

[Cagey75]

Damn it this is harder than I thought, every time I look on MPB I keep veering to the G80 .... gotta slap myself. I thi9nk it's the dslr-like style of the camera maybe, looks like it has nice chunky grip, also the articulating LCD interests me a little.

Here's something useful, and a positive for me personally too: http://stats.ghusse.com/

Input your Flickr name into that engine and it will scan all of your Flickr images exif data. It'll give you results on your most used aperture, ISO, SS, focal length and tell you which were your most used cameras. Very handy when deciding on gear. We tend to imagine we 'need' certain capabilities but if we look hard at our actual usage over the years it might be a different story. Like I always worry on high ISO performance - well, this tells me my preferred ISO range is 200-400 and I rarely go above 1600. That should cut out any major concerns when choosing cameras, even older models. Thinking on it, I know this is because I like to use off camera flash for macro and portraits, though I do love natural light, I'll make best use of decent light when available.

 

[Mr Perceptive]

Damn it this is harder than I thought, every time I look on MPB I keep veering to the G80 .... gotta slap myself.

Here's something useful, and a positive for me personally too: http://stats.ghusse.com/

Input your Flickr name into that engine and it will scan all of your Flickr images exif data. It'll give you results on your most used aperture, ISO, SS, focal length and tell you which were your most used cameras. Very handy when deciding on gear. We tend to imagine we 'need' certain capabilities but if we look hard at our actual usage over the years it might be a different story. Like I always worry on high ISO performance - well, this tells me my preferred ISO is 200-400 and I rarely go above 1600. That should cut out any major concerns when choosing cameras, even older models. Thinking on it, I know this is because I like to use off camera flash for macro and portraits, though I do love natural light, I'll make best use of decent light when available.

Lightroom Analytics will do this as well, and you can specify time periods https://www.lightroomdashboard.com/app#/load