Bowens gemini 500R head has no fan?

levihaynes

levihaynes

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Considering the price/reputation of the Bowens kit I don't understand why the Bowens gemini 500R head has no fan?

Do they consider it a lower end of the market kit and hence see no need for one?

Are they that well made they don't need fans to keep them cool?

I just don't understand what I'm missing when I compare similar models of kit from elinchrom, Lencarta, and Interfit that all have fans?

Anyone have any bright thoughts??
 
nobody on this forum used this kit??

no ideas at all :shrug:

I'm looking to make a purchase and comparing the different options
 
I just don't understand why so many heads don't have fans. Surely it's the same stuff that goes into the back of computers? I can't imagine that's a major cost considering the sort of money you pay for say a bowens gemini 500R or a elinchrom D-lite (the earlier copies didn't have fan cooling). :shrug::shrug:
 
HarryL said:
I just don't understand why so many heads don't have fans. Surely it's the same stuff that goes into the back of computers? I can't imagine that's a major cost considering the sort of money you pay for say a bowens gemini 500R or a elinchrom D-lite (the earlier copies didn't have fan cooling). :shrug::shrug:
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You and me together!!
 
I haven't used this model myself so haven't said anything before.
But you're right, there is no mention of a fan in their selling blurb but their instruction pdf clearly states that there isn't one, even though it has a 250 watt modelling lamp. I doubt whether it would blow up, the overheat protection should cut it off when it overheats, but finding that a head can't be used for a while because it's overheated can be awkward.

Personally I would never buy any flashhead that doesn't have a cooling fan
 
Garry Edwards said:
I haven't used this model myself so haven't said anything before.
But you're right, there is no mention of a fan in their selling blurb but their instruction pdf clearly states that there isn't one, even though it has a 250 watt modelling lamp. I doubt whether it would blow up, the overheat protection should cut it off when it overheats, but finding that a head can't be used for a while because it's overheated can be awkward.

Personally I would never buy any flashhead that doesn't have a cooling fan
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Thing is its BOWENS!! Are they starting to loose their reputation in not keeping up or are they really ahead of the competition?? The R range isn't their entry level and in fact is just below the pro range. Surely its designed to be used constantly and maybe even hammered like the competition.
 
I have a few Bowens 500R heads and you are right, they don't have fans... however I also use them for hours at a time in a nursery and studio environment without any issues at all and would be happy to recommend :thumbs:
 
V8burble said:
I have a few Bowens 500R heads and you are right, they don't have fans... however I also use them for hours at a time in a nursery and studio environment without any issues at all and would be happy to recommend :thumbs:
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Cheers for that Andrew.

I had nearly ruled them out but its good to hear from someone who uses them.
 
I'll second Mr Burble's recommendation. I've used slightly earlier Bowens 500's for a couple of years with constant modelling lights and never any overheating issues. Just designed to withstand higher temperatures I guess.... good solid British quality :thumbs:
 
There are other ways of cooling, like a decent heat sink. I guess Bowens ought to know what they're doing. I don't think it's deal breaker.

I have the earlier Elinchrom D-Lite 2 without cooling fans. I had them over-heat and cut out a couple of times, but only when the head was upside down, sealed in a softbox, with the modelling light on high! Simple solution is to turn the modelling light down (you can do that with D-Lites, unlike some other entry-level kit ;) ) but current models are now fitted with fans.
 
Flashman said:
I'll second Mr Burble's recommendation. I've used slightly earlier Bowens 500's for a couple of years with constant modelling lights and never any overheating issues. Just designed to withstand higher temperatures I guess.... good solid British quality :thumbs:
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Thanks Keith. The advice always has more substance from people who have used them!
 
HoppyUK said:
There are other ways of cooling, like a decent heat sink. I guess Bowens ought to know what they're doing. I don't think it's deal breaker.

I have the earlier Elinchrom D-Lite 2 without cooling fans. I had them over-heat and cut out a couple of times, but only when the head was upside down, sealed in a softbox, with the modelling light on high! Simple solution is to turn the modelling light down (you can do that with D-Lites, unlike some other entry-level kit ;) ) but current models are now fitted with fans.
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Thats why I was so puzzled by it. The D-Lite range is entry level and they have put fans in the recent models. The 500R isn't entry level from what I see on their webpage.
 
The 500R has some nice features too, the PW or Pulsar card slot, remote control and Powerpak options for example.
 
You could argue that using a nice fat heat sink and good venting instead of a cooling fan makes the whole unit more robust and reliable - and of course cheaper (at least to manufacture ;) ). Fans are relatively delicate and suck in crap, and without it the head is effectively solid-state and should take a beating. If that's true, a properly designed fan-less unit would seem like a better idea actually.

The top end units have thermostatic fans which suggests that most of the time, unless you're banging away on max, they're not in fact needed much anyway, and with alternative heat dispertion techniques, maybe never? Maybe. Ultimately I guess it depends how you use/abuse them.
 
I have the 500R's and had them on ALL DAY and had no problems, I also have a couple of 500 Pro's and they are basically the same but with fans, I dont notice any difference between the two.
 
My Bowens Esprit 500 heads don't have fans either - been using the same ones for 12 years and I've had no problems with them overheating...
 
wow.. i go away for 5 mins and look at all the comments!

Adeyb: I've been looking at the pro range for the simple fact they have fans. In your opinion are they worth the extra. I think they recycle faster and the flash speed is quicker?? (I know its subject to ones photographic needs)

Thanks for all your contributions.. much appreciated :thumbs:
 
Isn't it interesting that different people have different opinions on the same subject - but that none of them could be said to be wrong? Horses for courses...

I don't know why they put fans in some models but not others.
It could be because they aren't needed (good heat sink)?
Maybe to save money or space, i.e. to get everything into an existing casing instead of pay the very high cost of producing a new one.
Maybe because they're a fairly large, fragmented multinational Company and maybe the decisions are taken by accountants instead of photographers
Maybe there's an assumption that the people who buy the non fan-cooled models are unlikely to use restrictive light shaping tools such as honeycombs, snoots, spotlights etc and it's assumed that the people who use this type of tool buy their pro models, which are fan cooled.

Lots of questions, no answers. All I know is that for what it costs to include a fan, I think it's a no-brainer and I wouldn't buy any mono head that doesn't have one.
 
Garry Edwards said:
Isn't it interesting that different people have different opinions on the same subject - but that none of them could be said to be wrong? Horses for courses...

I don't know why they put fans in some models but not others.
It could be because they aren't needed (good heat sink)?
Maybe to save money or space, i.e. to get everything into an existing casing instead of pay the very high cost of producing a new one.
Maybe because they're a fairly large, fragmented multinational Company and maybe the decisions are taken by accountants instead of photographers
Maybe there's an assumption that the people who buy the non fan-cooled models are unlikely to use restrictive light shaping tools such as honeycombs, snoots, spotlights etc and it's assumed that the people who use this type of tool buy their pro models, which are fan cooled.

Lots of questions, no answers. All I know is that for what it costs to include a fan, I think it's a no-brainer and I wouldn't buy any mono head that doesn't have one.
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Why add something that's not needed - like I said I've been using mine for 12 years and they never get too hot, no matter what I bung on them...
At the end of a day-long shoot, by the time I've packed-up the cameras and coiled the leads, they're barely warm to the touch...
 
Arkady said:
Why add something that's not needed - like I said I've been using mine for 12 years and they never get too hot, no matter what I bung on them...
At the end of a day-long shoot, by the time I've packed-up the cameras and coiled the leads, they're barely warm to the touch...
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Quite right.

In fact you could argue that those that rely on a fan for cooling are then at the mercy of the fan's longevety... I know it's the first thing that fails in most computer enclosures :shrug:

I for one would not put too much emphasis on the inclusion of a fan in my decision making, in fact I didn't ;)
 
V8burble said:
Quite right.

In fact you could argue that those that rely on a fan for cooling are then at the mercy of the fan's longevety... I know it's the first thing that fails in most computer enclosures :shrug:

I for one would not put too much emphasis on the inclusion of a fan in my decision making, in fact I didn't ;)
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I agree in fact I'd rather buy a mono light with a decent heat sink than rely on a moving part like a fan. I think the fan idea is a cheap addition to try and add perceived value. I've never used a light with a fan and never had anything overheat either :)
 
We've got the 3 x Bowens 500R kit at work. It's been transported around the place, used heavily for product shoots for 6-8 hours at a time over 5 days, and the only thing that's every gone recently is a modelling bulb £18 I think).

Excellent bits of kit.
 
Byker28i said:
We've got the 3 x Bowens 500R kit at work. It's been transported around the place, used heavily for product shoots for 6-8 hours at a time over 5 days, and the only thing that's every gone recently is a modelling bulb £18 I think).

Excellent bits of kit.
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Modelling bulbs are £3.99...I just bought three of them...lol
First consumable to go in 12 years...
 
Thankyou everyone for you opinions.. I think there are some very valid points been brought out. :thumbs:
 
levihaynes said:
wow.. i go away for 5 mins and look at all the comments!

Adeyb: I've been looking at the pro range for the simple fact they have fans. In your opinion are they worth the extra. I think they recycle faster and the flash speed is quicker?? (I know its subject to ones photographic needs)

Thanks for all your contributions.. much appreciated :thumbs:
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I got lucky, I bought an extra head on Calumets ebay store, they had no 500's and called me to see if I would mind the 500pro at the same price, I said YES....if you'll do me two at that price.

are they worth the extra? no, not really, I find I just use those ones with closed modifiers (not very well ventilated modifiers) like Gels, just in case.
 
try my tried and trusted method, go on calumet's ebay store, hit the best offer button, offer between 18 & 20% less than the buy it now, always works for me (until they read this 8o( )
 
Good to see the 500Rs coming recommended as I am just about to order 6x 500R/500R travelpack kits fitted with PW cards. Anyone used the travelpack kits? How good are the batteries? How long do they take to recharge?
 
Messiah Khan said:
Good to see the 500Rs coming recommended as I am just about to order 6x 500R/500R travelpack kits fitted with PW cards. Anyone used the travelpack kits? How good are the batteries? How long do they take to recharge?
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Does your bank manager know about this?? Or even your partner!!
 
When you say how long to recharge... do you mean between firing the head(s) as in the recycle time OR the batteries themselves? If the former, it obviously depends on the power setting of the head and if one or two heads but they are not quick, you can expect up to 4 or 5 seconds. Batteries recharge in about 6 hours. So for sustained studio work you should consider spare batteries. If the recycle time is important to you (depending on what you are shooting) you might be better off hiring or buying the likes of Profoto which recycle super fast and the heads are simply that heads not evrything else that is required for a mains powered head. Don't get me wrong, I love the 500R and have a few, but for 'normal' studio portrait work they are great but for very quick recycles they are not the kit to use.
 
levihaynes said:
Does your bank manager know about this?? Or even your partner!!
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Nope, but my manager does. ;) Don't worry, I'm buying them for work not for myself.

V8burble said:
When you say how long to recharge... do you mean between firing the head(s) as in the recycle time OR the batteries themselves? If the former, it obviously depends on the power setting of the head and if one or two heads but they are not quick, you can expect up to 4 or 5 seconds. Batteries recharge in about 6 hours. So for sustained studio work you should consider spare batteries. If the recycle time is important to you (depending on what you are shooting) you might be better off hiring or buying the likes of Profoto which recycle super fast and the heads are simply that heads not evrything else that is required for a mains powered head. Don't get me wrong, I love the 500R and have a few, but for 'normal' studio portrait work they are great but for very quick recycles they are not the kit to use.
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I was referring to the actual battery recharge time, not the recycle time between shots. The recycle time isn't a huge concern. We basically just need some lightweight, fully portable (so not mains powered) and fairly durable lighting kits. At the moment we have some Multiblitz 2 & 3 heads kits, but they are mains powered, so the new kit is to be in addition to theses.

Have put the order in now;

6x 500R/500R Bowens Travelpack kits
6x Canon Speedlights
15x Pocketwizards
12x Pocketwizard cards

Should provide a few options for lightweight wireless setups. :)
 
My set of 500R's is on route with DHL so glad to see it get's a thumbs up, also got the travel pack, I've used this set up before and the travel pack lasted well over 300 shots, the recycle time if I remember stayed constant throughout.
 
Has anyone heard that the 500R's aren't compatible with a Canon 580EX II. I was watching a You tube video on the new heads and someone posted that there was massive interference and that their images had patterns all over them. Here's the link here. I have a 5D Classic and 580 EX II and am looking to purchase the 2 head Gemini 500r kit...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtCYG9Z2irw&feature=related

any help appreciated!
 
carlie said:
Has anyone heard that the 500R's aren't compatible with a Canon 580EX II. I was watching a You tube video on the new heads and someone posted that there was massive interference and that their images had patterns all over them. Here's the link here. I have a 5D Classic and 580 EX II and am looking to purchase the 2 head Gemini 500r kit...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtCYG9Z2irw&feature=related

any help appreciated!
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That flash read beep would drive me seriously mad:'(
In fairness to Bowens, if there's a problem with radio interference (which wouldn't surprise me) then the problem is very likely to be with the camera - the 5D Mk11 has a known problem, denied by Canon, with interference from radio triggers, apparently caused by lack of screening on the camera.

A Lencarta customer told me that the only way around it is to operate the flash with Pocket Wizards
 
I'm not sure what's going on in that video. Is the flash firing or not? :thinking: And what's the banding issue? What, exactly, is the problem here? Why are Canon denying it? What's unique about the 5D2?

I have a 5D2, a few RF-602 triggers and 580EX guns, plus Elinchrom studio flash. I often use them together, never had a problem. Fiddling about just now, I can't find a problem.

What am I looking for? How can I recreate it? Do I have the 'right' equipment? Is it those those Cactus triggers?
 
HoppyUK said:
I'm not sure what's going on in that video. Is the flash firing or not? :thinking: And what's the banding issue? What, exactly, is the problem here? Why are Canon denying it? What's unique about the 5D2?

I have a 5D2, a few RF-602 triggers and 580EX guns, plus Elinchrom studio flash. I often use them together, never had a problem. Fiddling about just now, I can't find a problem.

What am I looking for? How can I recreate it? Do I have the 'right' equipment? Is it those those Cactus triggers?
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I'm not sure what the point of that video is, but if you look at the comment....
Just got these for my 5D and 580ex II's................what a mistake they cause interference via the radio signal which results in a zig zag noise pattern in all images!!!
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As I said, the problem seems to be radio trigger interference that doesn't get screened out by this particular model.
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Garry Edwards said:
I'm not sure what the point of that video is, but if you look at the comment....

As I said, the problem seems to be radio trigger interference that doesn't get screened out by this particular model.
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That's how I read it, so I set my my 5D2 to fire off the RF-602 trigger, 2 secs exposure time. During this two seconds I repeatedly fired two RF-602 triggers pressed up against the camera.

Nothing :shrug:

RF is funny stuff, often hard to replicate. I wonder if the guy in the video has a taxi firm next door or something?
 
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