Banding on Background

C

cargo

Suspended / Banned
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6,645
Name
Gary
Edit My Images
Yes
Hi

Is there any go to way to remove banding in a background. I took some photos of our cat yesterday. Images are ok but I have some terrible banding on the background. I am wanting to print this so would like to have it gone.
So I am hoping there is a preffered method. A method of seeing it first would be an advantage too.

Gaz

Image below.

Hope you can see it.

IMG_6797_Bobina_9x6_web.jpg
 
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Nope . All down to bit size , check what bit size when editing
 
The usual way is to add noise. I'm sure there was a tutorial on phlearn but I can't find it. There's plenty others on YouTube. You can add noise from the filters menu in photishop. To get more control create a layer and add the noise on it then you can mask fade and change blend mode till it looks right. the noise doesn't really fix it but breaks up the clean lines so it's not noticeable. Make sure you're working in 16bits in Photoshop to reduce banding appearing.
 
CraigDHD said:
The usual way is to add noise. I'm sure there was a tutorial on phlearn but I can't find it. There's plenty others on YouTube. You can add noise from the filters menu in photishop. To get more control create a layer and add the noise on it then you can mask fade and change blend mode till it looks right. the noise doesn't really fix it but breaks up the clean lines so it's not noticeable. Make sure you're working in 16bits in Photoshop to reduce banding appearing.
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Thanks Craig. Yes I am in 16bits. Not sure why this as happened. I wouldnt mind if I had done a bunch of whacky editing to the image.
Will look on youtube and Phlearn "Aron must have the answer" :-)

Gaz
 
Thats posterisation. Does it occur on full quality images for printing or is it simple there on reduced quality for web display? Try saving your files for printing is a lose less format (like TIFF) rather then a lossy format if thss is a problem on full quality images
 
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boyfalldown said:
Thats posterisation. Does it occur on full quality images for printing or is it simple there on reduced quality for web display? Try saving your files for printing is a lose less format (like TIFF) rather then a lossy format if thss is a problem on full quality images
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Hi Hugh.
I only seen it because I had some small 6x4 instant prints done of this as a test at maxspielmans today I was having some Christmas cards done at the time. I intend to have this done on a acrylic block at Dscl "Manchester"
I digress! Yes the banding was very noticable on the full file printed.
After Craigs comments above I looked on Phlearn and couldnt find a banding video but I did find a video I had followed to clean up the paper floor. Did a great job but in the comments below one user reckoned the method introduced a lot of banding. I can't say it did or not as I didnt notice at the time.
If I cant fix this the easy way would be to create a new document with a fill layer same colour as background and drop the image on then mask out the original background. Add some shading too.
Would rather fix if poss though.

Gaz
 
cargo said:
Hi Hugh.
I only seen it because I had some small 6x4 instant prints done of this as a test at maxspielmans today I was having some Christmas cards done at the time. I intend to have this done on a acrylic block at Dscl "Manchester"
I digress! Yes the banding was very noticable on the full file printed.
After Craigs comments above I looked on Phlearn and couldnt find a banding video but I did find a video I had followed to clean up the paper floor. Did a great job but in the comments below one user reckoned the method introduced a lot of banding. I can't say it did or not as I didnt notice at the time.
If I cant fix this the easy way would be to create a new document with a fill layer same colour as background and drop the image on then mask out the original background. Add some shading too.
Would rather fix if poss though.

Gaz
Click to expand...


Try the full quality loose less file thing printed one. It normally works for me when I'm doing pets on a dark background like your photo.If you have another 6 x 4 print done as a test to see then you shouldn't lose more then a few pence,
 
boyfalldown said:
Try the full quality loose less file thing printed one. It normally works for me when I'm doing pets on a dark background like your photo.If you have another 6 x 4 print done as a test to see then you shouldn't lose more then a few pence,
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Do you think the machines in Spielmans will print a tiff ? Will try it.

Gaz
 
cargo said:
Do you think the machines in Spielmans will print a tiff ? Will try it.

Gaz
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Max spielmans won't print a tiff file, at least the one local to me won't. I do get the impression from them that it's a bit over their heads though
 
nickjohnwatson said:
Max spielmans won't print a tiff file, at least the one local to me won't. I do get the impression from them that it's a bit over their heads though
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Thansk Nick.
boyfalldown said:
I also wonder if their machines perform some kind of additional compression
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Hmmmm. Not sure. Obviously the quality is no where near the lab quality but a good cheap way to get a quick feel of a print. Glad I had thought to get a test done whilst I was there doing other things. The blocks are around £40 delivered so I would have been miffed.
minnnt said:
Hi @cargo if you add +5 grain in Lightroom it will vanish. Not sure if this translates through to prints aswell as i have never done it but it definitely works for screen.

HTH's.
David.
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Thanks David. I have added some noise as Craig says so will see if that cures it.

Gaz
 
Hi all. Just repoprting back as everyone was soooooo helpful.
First off MaxS instant print machines do not print tiff's just to clear that one up.
I did the add noise thing all be it with way higher settings that any video suggested. Which did work, printed out fine. I also got up this morning and thought why not go back to the raw and start again.
The banding is not in the raw (or I cant see it). The re edit also printed fine. What became apparent was that any time I tried to adjust the background brightness or darker, by any method it introduced banding.
I have no idea why this is happening. Could it be anything to do with the paper used or the lighting. That may sound daft but I have no idea.Or is it purely an editing thing based on the colours in the image ?

Thanks again to everyone any more advice on this would be great.

Gaz
 
It's in the editing where it appears. It usually happens if you try and lift the shadows/blacks. You can also get 'blocking' if you have a big areas of black. Then there is jpeg compression aswell! The +5 grain should remove the banding altogether.

Tagging @sunnyside_up as I seem to recall that she also raised a similar question once upon a time.
 
minnnt said:
It's in the editing where it appears. It usually happens if you try and lift the shadows/blacks. You can also get 'blocking' if you have a big areas of black. Then there is jpeg compression aswell! The +5 grain should remove the banding altogether.

Tagging @sunnyside_up as I seem to recall that she also raised a similar question once upon a time.
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Thanks Dave. Really strange this is. It seemed to appear with very slight/minor adjustments up or down.No matter if you used curves levels or any other means.
Good to know it's an editing thing though.

Thanks for the help.

Gaz
 
Deffo in the editing and compression. Never had it show up in full resolution print.

By the by, I tend to get it when I add in a vignette in combo with the grey bg.
 
sunnyside_up said:
Deffo in the editing and compression. Never had it show up in full resolution print.

By the by, I tend to get it when I add in a vignette in combo with the grey bg.
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Thanks for the reply Beth. You must be onto something there re the grey background which is what I use. It is the first paper roll I have bought and is a lighter grey than I thought it was going to be. Will take me ages/years to use it up as I only take photos for a bit of fun. Maybe I will get the darker grey next time that may help with this. That said this is the first time it as shown up. Darker would be better as I have a small working space so getting distance from the back is hard work.

Gaz
 
Anything which stretches or compresses the tones of a continuously graduated background can cause it - curves, levels, vignettes etc, especially if the background is dark. And if you use Gaussian blur to clean up a background - like you have on the floor, maybe? - that can cause significant problems.

It's made worse in 8 bits, worse again when converting to jpg and worse still when displayed on facebook.

Adding some noise or fake grain helps - this is one method:
http://jakehicksphotography.com/lat...n-to-a-digital-image-to-reduce-colour-banding
Lightroom or Analog Efex Pro 2's grain filters can help too.
 
And, just as an aside....

..... I would love people who say that JPG is no different from RAW straight from the camera to read this and appreciate it for what it is!

You cannot compress smooth continuous tones into an 8 bit format without some degree of image compromise - the smaller the file/print the greater the issue as demonstrated here!

An object lesson in image quality and 8bit imaging :)
 
juggler said:
Gaussian blur to clean up a background - like you have on the floor, maybe?
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Hi Simon. Thanks for the link and info I used the Median filter https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jn7KcpHpAlE
Only used it as I had been watching something else unrelated and that video poped up next. I would have just healed/patched cloned bad marks out normaly. That said I'm not that sure it was the cause as I said earlier any minor adjustments made it apear.

Gaz
 
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