Arthritis and Copper!

The23rdman said:
What about the lack of cancer cells in those who use non allopathic means? Oh, but they're written off as spontaneous remission or just completely ignored. That is the big pharma bias.
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Whut? Where did this suddenly come from? I though we were talking about contraceptives. Do I take it that you accept that IUD and other LARC methods are highly effective, or are you going to offer some contrary evidence? (Non-'testimonial', obviously). Let's get this sorted before changing the subject, hmm?
 
Jon, I just missed you reply re "Bad Science". I consider Ben Goldacre to be full of himself and a classic example of a pseudo-skeptic. His narrow-mindedness knows no bounds. I see you are in the same place and that's fine. I'll be sure to tell the people I've talked to over the years who were cured of cancer and other conditions such as M.S. that they couldn't possibly have been because there is no evidence or the evidence that is there doesn't fit the allopathic model.
 
purplepleaser said:
If it helps the pain, which most people can not even begin imagine then thats all that matters. I should take more care of myself , if a simple change of diet can help then bring it on.
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I believe it is more a major change of diet,(Lifestyle).
 
The23rdman said:
Jon, I just missed you reply re "Bad Science". I consider Ben Goldacre to be full of himself and a classic example of a pseudo-skeptic. His narrow-mindedness knows no bounds. I see you are in the same place and that's fine. I'll be sure to tell the people I've talked to over the years who were cured of cancer and other conditions such as M.S. that they couldn't possibly have been because there is no evidence or the evidence that is there doesn't fit the allopathic model.
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OK by me. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. You mention people you know who were cured of cancer and MS. Were they cured, or was it spontaneous remission? Medical science records many episodes of spontaneous remission, but this is not a cure. A cure requires some sort of intervention. Do you think it is possible that some cancers can be cured by intervention?

And what is your answer on the IUD/LARC matter, or are you dodging this one?
 
Did you not read my post re spontaneous remission? I am pretty sure that many cures by alternative intervention are classed as spontaneous remission simply because they do not fit the rigid system and are refuted without follow-up by medical doctors. One of my examples of a friend cured of testicular cancer by a herbalist fell into this category.

Of course cancers can be cured by intervention.

Oh, regarding the IUD/LARC. I wasn't responding directly to that at all at any point. I have no knowledge on the subject so cannot comment.

The important thing is this: we have a medical system that is brilliant when it comes to fixing broken things, but poor at best when it comes to healing diseases because it's answer is always to add more toxicity to the ailing system. Unless we get to a point where money isn't the driving force behind health care we will always flounder. I would LOVE some of the most likely non-allopathic healing methods to be properly studied so they can be either vindicated or discarded, but there is no money for true long-term work in this field for the reasons stated before. Big pharma runs the show and always will at our present stage of evolution.
 
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So we'll take it as established fact that IUD/LARC devices work and move on. Good.

I'm really pleased that your friend was cured of cancer by a herbalist. What is your proof of this?
 
Proof? I have no scientific proof. He got cancer, the oncologist wanted to operate and he didn't. A friend of his suggested seeing someone they knew who treated him herbally and the tumour shrunk to nothing.
 
The23rdman said:
Proof? I have no scientific proof. He got cancer, the oncologist wanted to operate and he didn't. A friend of his suggested seeing someone they knew who treated him herbally and the tumour shrunk to nothing.
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So this could have been spontaneous remission, not cure by herbalist?
 
Of course it could, but that is exactly the point. Whenever anyone is cured of anything that isn't an allopathic intervention it has to be spontaneous remission because it doesn't fit your reality tunnel to entertain the possibility that the herbs cured him?
 
Is it spontaneous remission if someone has an awful diet full of sugar, trans-fats and booze, get's cancer and refuses treatment, but instead changes their lifestyle so the crap is replaced by nothing but fresh juices and whole foods?
 
I'm quite prepared to accept that herbs can cure. After all, many herbs are used to great effect in mainstream medicine and have been for thousands of years (aspirin, digitalis - it's a long list). But you said:

One of my examples of a friend cured of testicular cancer by a herbalist fell into this category.
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(post #85 - my bold), leading me to think that you were claiming that this particular cancer had been cured by a herbalist and was not one of many spontaneous remissions. But you now accept that it may well have been. Glad this has been clarified.
 
I accept it may well have been, but it makes much more sense that it was the herbs as they have a record of healing such things.

My friend with MS was given no hope by allopathic medicine and had all but given up when she tried a naturopathic nutritionist who treated her for two years using diet and techniques such as juicing and various enemas. She is now one of the most vibrant human beings I know and is setting up a drumming and healing center in South America.

Again, could have been spontaneous, but the improvement was marked when she started the regime.
 
The23rdman said:
I accept it may well have been, but it makes much more sense that it was the herbs as they have a record of healing such things.
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Please expand on this claim. Why does it make much more sense? Where is this record of which you speak? Can you supply a link, please?

My friend with MS was given no hope by allopathic medicine and had all but given up when she tried a naturopathic nutritionist who treated her for two years using diet and techniques such as juicing and various enemas. She is now one of the most vibrant human beings I know and is setting up a drumming and healing center in South America.

Again, could have been spontaneous, but the improvement was marked when she started the regime.
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Can conventional medicine make any similar claims, or are such cures limited to alt meds?
 
Jon, I'm off to bed now, but I'll respond properly tomorrow.
 
Al1944 said:
I suffer with aches and pains in my neck and shoulders - and I avoid going to the doctor like the plague!

I wondered if anyone has had any experience of copper bracelets etc. I have come across a copper curb chain which I thought I might try, but not sure whether the copper/arthritis claims are a lot of hooha?

Thanks,
Al
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Go to your doctor
 
sturisoma said:
ok, so point me to the research carried out for using copper as an IUD - surely, like ECT doctors used it because it seemed to work, rather than following the findings of scientific research which showed that a) it would work and (most important) b) why it would work
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Lynch, Catherine M.. "History of the IUD". Contraception Online. Baylor College of Medicine - look for the entry about Dr. Jaime Zipper ;)
 
The23rdman said:
What about the lack of cancer cells in those who use non allopathic means? Oh, but they're written off as spontaneous remission or just completely ignored. That is the big pharma bias.
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I don't have cancer cells and I annoy marcel and hacker on a regular basis therfore annoying marcel and hacker prevents cancer :eek:
 
I've been suffering from arthritis for many years. I'm also a scientist who used to work in drug development. I've been wearing copper rings for the last dozen years or so. My response, when asked if they work, is to say that I didn't notice any difference when I started using them but that they don't do any harm so I may as well keep them on. I prefer rings to bracelets as the green staining isn't so obvious.

In the past I also tried stuff like glucosamine and found it made absolutely zero difference. Nor does weather have any influence.

Indeed, the only thing that does make a difference is exercise. Taking up birding (after a 30-year break) has dramatically reduced the problems in my knees.
 
My arthritic knee is far better at forecasting the weather than the Met Office!
 
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