Are photographers really a threat?

Spot on!

and as we've said a million times on here, IF you are a terrorist doing a bit of recon, you're going to be the guy with the most inconspicuous camera and gear, blending into the tourist crowd, not the guy with 1 series canon and some seriously long lens.
 
Very good read, apart from the last line, (Eventually sanity will be restored, but it may take a while.) As long as we have politicians, sanity in this country will never be restored.
 
Excellent article, thanks for bringing it to my attention.
 
Best article I've read in a long time, and make some very good points, lets just hope every police officer and PCSO reads it.
 
PapaLazarou said:
If every camera was a gun then yes.
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This is pretty much how cameras are seen these days by the paranoiac.


gun-camera.jpg



Damn, I want one of those, even if I couldn't use it...
 
I refrained from commenting on the article in my original post, partly because I've never heard of Bruce Schneier before and partly because I was interested to see the reaction from others here without a "photography is [/is not] illegal" type post to accompany it.

I think he makes some very good points. Especially:
1. There is no link between known terrorist attacks and photography. No known terrorist has been found with "incriminating" photographs.
2. We're afraid of perceived risks as opposed to real ones. We're quite happy to cross the road without looking, but we're afraid of flying.

The man appears to me to speak a lot of sense.

I don't do a lot of street photography and I've never been stopped (despite trying) but this is a good, intelligent, contribution to the debate.

MV
 
JasonRS said:
Unlikely since it's not printed in a red top.
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You just prove the point of why articles like this have to be written with that comment.
You stereotype a group of people, whoever they are, and you play into the hands of the controlling scaremongerers.
Nevermind eh.
Anyhow, who needs to photograph anywhere these days with the internet and stuff like Google Earth.
 
a good articale however the last line is rather poinient !
 
Wayned said:
You just prove the point of why articles like this have to be written with that comment.
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Why, because the majority of serving Police Officers and PCSO's are more likely to consume tabloid material than spend the time reading a broadsheet? That's not stereotyping, it's a simple truth.

Whilst senior officers may well read this article, by having it pointed out to them by their wider staff, media team or whatever the regional force has, it's unlike that the majority of serving police officers will read it, hence my response to the comment from whiteflyer as below.

whiteflyer said:
Best article I've read in a long time, and make some very good points, lets just hope every police officer and PCSO reads it.
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It's also highly unlikely to have any impact on their staff briefings, as I'm sure they've got plenty of other things to be concerning themselves with and this will have little impact on their targets from crime reduction.

Even statistically speaking, with the difference in distribution figures for a single tabloid vs the guardian, it is unlikely that every Police Officer and PCSO will read it. However, had it been published in a red top, the likelihood of them reading it would have increased dramatically.

So, my comment was neither playing into the hands of scaremongerers, or incorrect, but based in a much wider view of the likelihood of the comment to which I responded happening. I just distilled it down somewhat.
 
I like the article, and I'm glad big papers are taking notice of this. The problem as I see it is that the Police and PCSOs (and private security guards) interpret the laws as they see fit. So no amount of clarification in Parliament or with local MPs is going to do much. However, articles like this show that more attention is being paid to this issue. My main concern is that I can't see any of this trickling down to the officials on the street that are causing the problems.
 
I am tempted to print it and take it with me to London this weekend :D
 
All the paranoia is doin is lettin the stupid terrorists win! For as long as people continue to live their lives in fear and suspicion of everyone from a minority group, different country or now even walking around with a camera then the terrorists are going to be in control by changing how people live their lives and treat each other.

I may only be young but even i can remember being younger and greetin people you pass in the street or smiling at someone on a train, do that now and you get glared at suspiciously! aargh! ridiculous! if people are in a public area then they are putting themselves at risk of so many things, getting run over by a bus, muggings, stabbings, attacks, really the least and most trivial of their concerns should be a little geek like me wanderin around with a camera!
sorry, rant over!
article really good!
 
JasonRS said:
Why, because the majority of serving Police Officers and PCSO's are more likely to consume tabloid material than spend the time reading a broadsheet? That's not stereotyping, it's a simple truth.

Whilst senior officers may well read this article, by having it pointed out to them by their wider staff, media team or whatever the regional force has, it's unlike that the majority of serving police officers will read it, hence my response to the comment from whiteflyer as below..
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Sorry I've not been able to reply for so long. I've been trying to do the Star crossword and I'm stuck on 3 down. The clue is, 'Profanity relating to male genitalia' First letter is 'B' and it ends with 'CKS' Eight letters. Any ideas?

I'm sure many people on this site and others have been hassled by the Police et al. I wholly disagree with this policy as do most reasonable people within and without Law Enforcement.

It is a sign of the times which will go away sooner rather than later.

You make it sound like as soon as you leave your house with your kit you are jumped on by some kind of SWAT team. It's utter rubbish.
How would half of these wonderful images posted on this site ever make it here if this was the case.
You think it's your devine right to go into a busy town centre and expect complete strangers to allow you to take their pictures without at least someone kicking up a stink.
It's not Terrorism that scars people. Who cares in reality. That's something which only happens to other people.
It's more everyday concerns which bother joe public.
Identity theft,
Paedofilia,
or just a wish not to be photographed.
You have to balance your right to take pictures with everyone elses wish for anonymity. Who'se right is right?
In my view it is just another way of bringing conflict within the masses.
Whilst everyone is fighting eachother they are not concentrating on the real issue; In this country we have a corrupt, Quango lead, self-satisfying bunch of ineffective morons who 'CLAIM' to represent us, when all they are doing is feathering their nests at our expense.
Do you really think they gave a rats ass about this issue or any other which does not directly benefit themselves?
Wake up and smell the coffee, we are seen as plebs who fill the tax coffers for them to have fun spendng.
All public services are now, from the top, infected with this same filthy disease.
Do you think command teams around the country will read this and care?
Don't make me laugh. They are all Public Relations tools who claim to support the public. They are watching their backs for people wanting their jobs and have knives in readiness for those ahead of them.
Cynical, illconceived and uneducated as this rant may be, I guarentee it is the truth.
Orwell will be nodding sagely at what he sees. He was just a few years out that's all!
 
Wayned said:
You think it's your devine right to go into a busy town centre and expect complete strangers to allow you to take their pictures without at least someone kicking up a stink.
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Ahm......it is.

It's my devine right to do anything I want that doesn't break the law.
 
Strange that the powers that be seem so worried about photographers. I thought they enjoyed the hobby. Maybe instead of wandering round the streets with our camera's we should sit in the back of vans at the bottom of hills taking pictures of cars like they do?

Wonder if there is a photo of the month competition in the traffic division of the local force?
 
MG TF 135 said:
Strange that the powers that be seem so worried about photographers. I thought they enjoyed the hobby. Maybe instead of wandering round the streets with our camera's we should sit in the back of vans at the bottom of hills taking pictures of cars like they do?

Wonder if there is a photo of the month competition in the traffic division of the local force?
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Typical good comeback. It aint Cops in those vans it's civvies just like you. They only put the stickers on to stop idiots wrecking them.
 
If you take a photograph of a security-sensitive site and publish it, then a terrorist could exploit the photograph. Isn't that the reason they stop it?
 
Yammer said:
If you take a photograph of a security-sensitive site and publish it, then a terrorist could exploit the photograph. Isn't that the reason they stop it?
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:thinking:
 
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