Anyone ventured into the dangerous world of weddings??

[msc83]

Has anyone (non-professional) been brave enough to do a wedding?? How did it go? Any advice?

Mark

 

[AliB]

I know you are new here Mark so I will just simply suggest you do a quick search.

Probably THE biggest contentious subject around here otherwise known as a can of worms.

Other that that, I'm keeping my head down.

 

[hepburn]

i was brave enough to do a wedding once. Have regreted it ever since and soon divorced her...

 

[EdinburghGary]

I have mark, it went very well but I would probably try and get as much practice in before you actually do any shoot. The most important thing is that you manage expectations. If your bride and groom are WILLING to take the risk after you tell them about your lack of experience and potential of wrecking the shots, then there is no come back.

For me, well over a year ago, I just wanted to try it. I advertised as a free beginner with a keen eye, and found a couple with ZERO wedding photography budget.

G.

 

[Bendihossan]

Yup like Ali said it's the biggest can of worms in the tog world! Gary is right too and is what I was about to say: be completely honest to the couple about your abilities and your experience. If they have any doubts show them some portrait shots and candids you've taken at other events or something to rest aside any worries they may have

 

[msc83]

Thanks for your replies. I have contacted someone who was advertising on my works intranet for a tog and told her my lack of experience etc and she still seems to be interested, so I'm trying to open my eyes a little before any commitment!

Ever get the feelings that some of these professional/anti beginner wedding photographers forget that once upon a time they had to start somewhere?!

 

[EdinburghGary]

Thanks for your replies. I have contacted someone who was advertising on my works intranet for a tog and told her my lack of experience etc and she still seems to be interested, so I'm trying to open my eyes a little before any commitment!

Ever get the feelings that some of these professional/anti beginner wedding photographers forget that once upon a time they had to start somewhere?!

There are several ways to start though, & I don't think the PRO's here are anti beginner. I think they simply try to remind the beginners that it's not an easy gig, and there are certain ways to make your entry into the profession easier / safer for your couple....being a second shooter for example. I think a lot of the debates come from the feeling that people are ready to emerge as a pro wedding photographer with a cheap body and one bit of glass, zero experience.....regardless of advice....maybe....

G.

 

[msc83]

There are several ways to start though, & I don't think the PRO's here are anti beginner. I think they simply try to remind the beginners that it's not an easy gig, and there are certain ways to make your entry into the profession easier / safer for your couple....being a second shooter for example. I think a lot of the debates come from the feeling that people are ready to emerge as a pro wedding photographer with a cheap body and one bit of glass, zero experience.....regardless of advice....maybe....

G.

Lol I can understand that. There's a lot of dreamers out there!

 

[EdinburghGary]

Lol I can understand that. There's a lot of dreamers out there!

Nice to meet you Nowt wrong with having high hopes!

G.

 

[AliB]

Yup, from small acorns and all that.

But that is exactly my take on it. It's a seed and needs proper care and attention to grow. I've seen people go off to shoot weddings based on a few landscape shots, I've seen people post saying they are pooping themselves because they have never shot people before, never mind a wedding. Sorry but that is pure madness and without any skills and experience is a receipe for a disaster.

It's the skills and experience that should be put in place BEFORE going to market and charging. There are many ways to do that, courses, seminars, internet training, second shooting, getting a friend in a wedding dress.

There are also things you can do to practice that don't need a live wedding. Have a look here for some advice http://www.weddingphotographyadvice.com/2010/02/bridal-preparation-photography-by-alison-bailey/

Whatever you do, don't just dive in thinking it's an easy gig. It's not. You need to know the different parts of the day and you need to understand your must have shots and know how to get them. From bridal prep in natural light to a first dance using cross lit flash. Know what you are doing and practice first.

 

[Brooksy]

I would try to do it as a 2nd for a good while before I did my own! I was asked by a friend to shoot his, but I declined politely. He knew it was something I do not normally do, so he was fine (also I did want to have a pint or ten!). I recommended a friend of mine who does do it, and the day went perfectly.

 

[POAH]

don't understand why, its only taking pictures of people :shrug:

weddings are not hard nor should they be stressful. so long as you are organised and have had good discussions about what the bride wants you'll be fine. So long as the pictures are well exposed, in focus and show the bride in a good way they will be happy.

If you can take a good picture of a person you can do a wedding

Probably THE biggest contentious subject around here otherwise known as a can of worms.

Other that that, I'm keeping my head down.

 

[cowasaki]

don't understand why, its only taking pictures of people :shrug:

weddings are not hard nor should they be stressful. so long as you are organised and have had good discussions about what the bride wants you'll be fine. So long as the pictures are well exposed, in focus and show the bride in a good way they will be happy.

If you can take a good picture of a person you can do a wedding

Things happen that you don't expect. You get ill, two cameras fail, it rains, it is the brightest sunniest day on record, the bride gets drunk, you get hay fever etc etc. If it was a family day out taking photos it does not matter but when it is someones wedding it does as you can't just do it again tomorrow. Weddings are just a lot of photographs of people but you want them as good as possible without turning the whole day into a photo session. I did my first on Saturday and because of meticulous planning it all went quite well but I still had a problem with it being the brightest day that I can remember! It is the responsibility of getting it right first time.

But I now have the bug and want to do more

 

[AliB]

don't understand why, its only taking pictures of people :shrug:

and show the bride in a good way they will be happy.

Could you give us the benefit of your wisdom on that point then?

Wedding photographers that I know spend years training to do just that. Knowing how to shoot people with certain facial features, knowing how to take inches off certain areas of the body with not a photoshop tool in sight........

 

[POAH]

same as a lot of other photography though

Things happen that you don't expect. You get ill, two cameras fail, it rains, it is the brightest sunniest day on record, the bride gets drunk, you get hay fever etc etc. If it was a family day out taking photos it does not matter but when it is someones wedding it does as you can't just do it again tomorrow. Weddings are just a lot of photographs of people but you want them as good as possible without turning the whole day into a photo session. I did my first on Saturday and because of meticulous planning it all went quite well but I still had a problem with it being the brightest day that I can remember! It is the responsibility of getting it right first time.

But I now have the bug and want to do more

 

[POAH]

fairly simple concept to grasp I would have thought TBH - you are not going to give the couple pictures where they are looking odd. you can't make a fat person slim nor an ugly person beautiful but you can help not to make them look as bad by taking pictures at certain angles etc.

Could you give us the benefit of your wisdom on that point then?

Wedding photographers that I know spend years training to do just that. Knowing how to shoot people with certain facial features, knowing how to take inches off certain areas of the body with not a photoshop tool in sight........

 

[chris321]

I heard it's not that hard



(runs for cover )

Seriously, set aside several days, type "wedding" into the search box, and read thread after thread descend into anarchy, bannings etc . Then you'll realise what you're letting yourself in for!

Chris

 

[cowasaki]

I heard it's not that hard

 

[Jayst84]

I heard it's not that hard



(runs for cover )

Seriously, set aside several days, type "wedding" into the search box, and read thread after thread descend into anarchy, bannings etc . Then you'll realise what you're letting yourself in for!

Chris

What, it's not really. There's a lot of photography out there that's a damn site harder than weddings. Unless you're aiming to be the cream of the crop, then of course it is... just like in any other field.

I've only shot a couple, it's all the faffing about afterwards with albums and that whole rigmarole that puts me off. If you speak to people beforehand, and plan what you want, it doesn't have to be that stressful. Of course from time to time you will get brides, families, dogs, priests, etc, who are going to make it harder.

 

[AliB]

fairly simple concept to grasp I would have thought TBH - you are not going to give the couple pictures where they are looking odd. you can't make a fat person slim nor an ugly person beautiful but you can help not to make them look as bad by taking pictures at certain angles etc.

So how do you avoid them looking odd then?

How do you manage someone with a large nose, one eye larger than the other? How do you shoot a larger bride in the most flattering way? How about couples with a big height difference? What are you going to do with that one at the first dance? How do you light for a couple of different races and therefore skin tones?

 

[Paul Male]

i was brave enough to do a wedding once. Have regreted it ever since and soon divorced her...

 

[chris321]

What, it's not really. There's a lot of photography out there that's a damn site harder than weddings. Unless you're aiming to be the cream of the crop, then of course it is... just like in any other field.

I've only shot a couple, it's all the faffing about afterwards with albums and that whole rigmarole that puts me off. If you speak to people beforehand, and plan what you want, it doesn't have to be that stressful. Of course from time to time you will get brides, families, dogs, priests, etc, who are going to make it harder.

For me, it's the pressure aspect that makes it all the more difficult. For example, I shoot a variety of stuff for my uni paper (sport, the occasional portrait, stage productions), and if I mess up a shot, it doesn't matter in the slightest. I'll just wait for a few minutes, and take another.

You can't really do the same at a wedding (well, not at the crucial bits anyway), so the shot has to be nailed. I don't have that confidence in my ability, which is why I wouldn't even consider it......(yet )

Just out of curiosity, what do you consider harder? (not starting an argument, just a genuine question)?

Chris

 

[Wobbler]

don't understand why, its only taking pictures of people :shrug:

weddings are not hard nor should they be stressful. so long as you are organised and have had good discussions about what the bride wants you'll be fine. So long as the pictures are well exposed, in focus and show the bride in a good way they will be happy.

If you can take a good picture of a person you can do a wedding

Yeah, that's all there is to it...

 

[Jayst84]

For me, it's the pressure aspect that makes it all the more difficult. For example, I shoot a variety of stuff for my uni paper (sport, the occasional portrait, stage productions), and if I mess up a shot, it doesn't matter in the slightest. I'll just wait for a few minutes, and take another.

You can't really do the same at a wedding (well, not at the crucial bits anyway), so the shot has to be nailed. I don't have that confidence in my ability, which is why I wouldn't even consider it......(yet )

Just out of curiosity, what do you consider harder? (not starting an argument, just a genuine question)?

Chris

The pressure's there for sure, but then it's there in a lot of other shoots as well, with clients looking over your shoulder / at your raw files on a screen you're tethered to. Or on a press job where you have 3 seconds to take a shot of someone who doesn't want their photo taken (and you have to make them look good). If you're confident with your gear and abilities, then you deal with the pressure (if not, then you possibly shouldn't be shooting for anyone, never mind weddings). EDIT: That should be 'one' not 'you' not aimed at you of course Chris.

Maybe I've just been lucky with the weddings I've shot so far (not maybe, I have ). I have a job on Thursday, from about 5.15pm, to possibly around 5am Friday morning, shooting a 700 person event in 3 locations. I also have to manage the State Premier and celeb guests into various photo ops in-between covering the rest of the event. If there's more than a 5 minute 'break' at any point during the night then I have to be uploading/editing/captioning shots to send to media. (With the client sat next to me as always).

I'm anticipating that'll be a lot more stressful than the wedding I shot (with an assistant, won't get one of those on Thursday) on Sunday. Get paid more for weddings too.

 

[petersmart]

If you attempt to do a wedding unprepared it will be chaos!

I don't mean your gear (though that's important) but how YOU organise the wedding!

When I first started I made out a list of pics I had to take - there were about 30.

I organised the list to cause as little disruption to my flow as possible by just moving 1 or 2 people into and out of the pics eg:

After the wedding:
1.Bride
2.Bride and groom
3.Bride and groom and HER parents
5.Bride and Her parents.
6.Bride and HER mum

etc.

This is necessary because at a busy church on a Saturday you may only have 15-30 mins before the next couple roll up (check with the vicar about this)

I also asked the priest in charge what pics he permitted and I NEVER broke his rules.

After a while all the priests and vicars knew I could be trusted to never disrupt the ceremony.

Also I decided before my first wedding that I was in charge - imagine a combination of a photographer and Hitler!

I was never rude to people but always firm.

You must establish from the word go that you're in charge.

After the wedding you'll have everyone milling around so I used to get all the important people in a single group at the side and just moved them into and out of shot as required.

If you don't do this they'll get lost in the melee and you'll waste time trying to get them back.

And DON'T whisper - use a loud commanding voice as if disobeying you was not something that ever occurred.

If it's raining then you have a prob as getting good pics in pouring rain is a real challenge.

What I used to do was ask the vicar if I could take pics in the church after the ceremony.

Once they knew me and knew thay could trust me to work quickly the answer was usually "yes."

Otherwise you have to hope they have a real nice reception room.

Good luck!

EDIT:

BTW I would sometimes have 3-4 weddings to cover on a Saturday so usually started out by taking Anadins to stop myself ending up after a possible 12 hour day with a real bad headache!

I'd take 1 for every wedding - 3 weddings, 3 Anadins!

Once again Good Luck!

 

[bomberman]

I can imagine the bride and groom would like a good record of their big day so as much planning as possible is needed. Talk to them and find out exactly what the order of the day is, go along to the rehearsal and check out the church for lighting and places to shoot from, have a look at the reception venue - is there a nice ceiling you can bounce a flash off? The more you plan this kind of thing the more chance you will have of nailing all the key shots and the happier they will be.

Also, it might be a good excuse to hire some nice fast glass for inside the church? lensesforhire.co.uk are very good.

 

[chris321]

Cheers for that, always good to have a bit more insight into these things! However this bit...

I have a job on Thursday, from about 5.15pm, to possibly around 5am Friday morning, shooting a 700 person event in 3 locations. I also have to manage the State Premier and celeb guests into various photo ops in-between covering the rest of the event. If there's more than a 5 minute 'break' at any point during the night then I have to be uploading/editing/captioning shots to send to media. (With the client sat next to me as always)

...further reiterates that to be a successful photographer, you've got to have something not quite right in the head

Good luck mate, rather you than me

Chris

 

[petersmart]

don't understand why, its only taking pictures of people :shrug:

weddings are not hard nor should they be stressful. so long as you are organised and have had good discussions about what the bride wants you'll be fine. So long as the pictures are well exposed, in focus and show the bride in a good way they will be happy.

If you can take a good picture of a person you can do a wedding

 

[POAH]

if people look odd they look odd you can't help that you also can't help someone blinking or making a face but what you can do is to reduce the chances of this happening like not taking a shot when somoene is eating. Not sure why you are being so aggressive in your questioning, like I said if you can shoot people you can shoot a wedding there is no wonder in it.

So how do you avoid them looking odd then?

How do you manage someone with a large nose, one eye larger than the other? How do you shoot a larger bride in the most flattering way? How about couples with a big height difference? What are you going to do with that one at the first dance? How do you light for a couple of different races and therefore skin tones?

 

[petersmart]

Things happen that you don't expect. You get ill, two cameras fail, it rains, it is the brightest sunniest day on record, the bride gets drunk, you get hay fever etc etc. If it was a family day out taking photos it does not matter but when it is someones wedding it does as you can't just do it again tomorrow. Weddings are just a lot of photographs of people but you want them as good as possible without turning the whole day into a photo session. I did my first on Saturday and because of meticulous planning it all went quite well but I still had a problem with it being the brightest day that I can remember! It is the responsibility of getting it right first time.

But I now have the bug and want to do more

Add to that 2 families who HATED each other - a mother who had refused to come to the wedding but turned up as I was taking pics and SCREAMED at the groom "I hope you're satisfied now you b*****d" and had to be dragged away still screaming - a beautiful bride whose groom and best man had got drunk the night before nad got into a pub fight and came with black eyes and bruised faces (no photoshop then!) - and many many other "interesting" ones!

Good luck!

 

[Wuffstuff]

I trained for many years unpaid with a senior press photographer who did wedding at a weekend and then set up on my own as wedding photographer.

I lasted about a year before I realised that I wasn't making a lot of money and it was taking up all of my time. In the end I gave up as it wasn't my main business.

Taking the photos wasn't the real issue. Post processing to achieve the results you want (not what the customer wants) takes a lot of time.

If I was younger though I might have done it again so don't be put off - do a few with someone experienced.

 

[AliB]

if people look odd they look odd you can't help that you also can't help someone blinking or making a face but what you can do is to reduce the chances of this happening like not taking a shot when somoene is eating. Not sure why you are being so aggressive in your questioning, like I said if you can shoot people you can shoot a wedding there is no wonder in it.

Not being agressive at all, I'm asking a direct question which I can answer.

You say there is no wonder in it but there is a heck of a lot of knowledge and experience.

If you have someone with a large nose, make sure it does not break the profile of the face...... if you have someone with one eye larger.... shoot them with the larger eye further away. If you have a larger bride, don't have her standing square on, have her standing 3/4 (group shots too) and where possible shoot from above.......

I could go on....and on.... and on. But then that's all so simple that anyone knows it the minute they pick up a camera and cross the threshold of a church.

So come on, join in and share some of the wonderment

 

[madhouse]

I shot my sisters wedding 9 days ago, in Cornwall on what turned out to be the best day of the year, it was for nothing as they were on a budget and it was money that could be spent elsewhere - the album will be their wedding present from me.

It was my first wedding and was quite a day! I was surprised at how quickly time can pass but I guess that was because I was helping set up etc. After researching here I remembered to do things like check out locations, speak to the registrar, get a list of must have shots etc and it all went off without any disasters. I'd definitely say preparation is key as knowing location layouts, what you want to shoot and when, also where light is best and when will all give you added confidence on the day.

Just the processing to finish before I show them the 100 or so good pics I've whittled it down to.

What did I learn? well, a hell of a lot more about fill flash (turned out well too), how people don't mind if the photographer's a bit bossy and that my sis and her hubby are rubbish at organisation! Oh and to keep an eye out on what everyone else is doing, great for those candid shots and also the fun ones messing about not to mention poaching other peoples ideas!
If you can get someone else to work as a 2nd it'd help you a lot and would probably reduce the pressure a bit.
It might take 6 hours to take the photos but it'll take a lot longer than that to finish the job, the work involved is a bit like an iceberg - everyone sees the little bit but there's a lot more to it in reality.
I have a greater understanding of a wedding photographers world now, I have the photographer booked for my wedding and I certainly don't mind paying him what I am, in fact chatting to him was a great help!

Would I do it again? possibly. It was fun in a weird way and so far out of my comfort zone it was unreal but I proved to myself I could do it and most of all helped my sis to have a really memorable day and got to record it for her forever - not to mention getting a ringside seat at the alter! (well table, it was a civil ceremony after all).

If you're doing a wedding for someone you don't know make sure they know your limits, get a contract in place so everyone knows what's going on and if you do charge make sure you're insured.

Oh and one other thing - enjoy it!

 

[Syx]

Forward planning is key. I'm shooting a wedding in June for a good friend - I did some candids at her brother's civil ceremony, she liked what I'd done and asked me to do her wedding. I'm not charging her for it, but I'm still taking an approach as if she were someone I did not know; meeting with her and the groom to agree and list of shots that they want, visiting the church and reception venue, discussions with the vicar etc, taking photos of the locations at the correct times to judge lighting/angles etc in advance...

Just do as much pre prep as you can. I'm not at all worried about doing the wedding, it's going to be a lot of fun. The reason being that all the expectations and concerns are out in the open, and the B&G know what to expect from my previous shots.
And most of all, try to enjoy it!

 

[Dave Pickett]

I did a big budget wedding with a Fuji 9500 bridge camera (enough to strike the fear of God into the pros here!) The B&G did not want formal shots and I thus had to work around that request, although I did do a group shot that went very well. They were very pleased with the results and whilst the Fuji may not have given the ultimate IQ (which they didnt notice) it was very fast to work with, no lenses to change etc - went very well.

These days people want different things so the most important part is listening to the B&Gs requirements.

Best advice I have seen is to do the first group shot with everyone in then take away those not needed as you work down to the smaller groups. If you start with the B&G and then add people its like herding cats, people wander off and are reluctant to join in....takes ages!

 

[G2EWS]

Hi Mark,

You have received some great advice, now you will receive mine!

I was asked to be the official photographer at two of my Children's wedding one in Cyprus and one in Wiltshire. The reason for me doing them is not relevant to this discussion.

Most importantly whatever people say on here who are obviously wedding photographers it is a very skilled job and will take a lot of time for you to study all that is necessary. I spent about 6 months of almost all of my spare time reading and practicising before my first one. As someone who has worked in big business at Director level and own my current company I am used to stress and how to deal with it. But this was something different. You cannot go back and re take the shots, so you need to get it as near to correct as possible. I did say as near to because you can obviously manipulate in ps.

The pros' will probably take their shots in jpeg because they know they will be right. You and me however MUST take our shots in RAW, because if you get it wrong you at least have all of the information required to make a shot as good as possible!

Find out where the Church and reception is and go and have a play in different weather/light conditions. You may never have taken a shot in a Church. It is very different than anything you may have done before. Lots of light coming in the windows and possibly dark inside! Were is the best place for you to be if the Church allows you to take shots during the service. If the couple say they don't want pics during the service, remind them of how great a shot of the first kiss or passing of rings can be! In my limited amateur opinion these are must haves and will always be cherished. Go and chat with the Vicar rather than hearing what they have to say second or third hand. It will pay off.

Learn your camera inside out. Find out what is the highest iso you can set and still get a good picture.

Have two bodies. Enough cards to take thousands of pictures if need be. Make sure your routine takes a full card and stores it SAFELY. Somewhere it won't get lost or written over. Make sure you format every card before you arrive. Keep an eye on what shots you have left on a card. It is no good missing an important shot because you wanted to get the last out of a card, change early if necessary.

Plenty of battery power, tripod for some of the shots could be useful, flash with plenty of batteries.

I could go on, but these are the bits I found most important.

As to what pictures to take, have a search of wedding photos and you will easily work out what is important. But try and be inventive. You will have already looked at where you want to take shots inside the Church if it is raining or outside if fine. Same for the venue. Well get ideas of what would look really good. Ask the couple, after all they are likely to have seen what a friend has and want the same or similar.

Finally what worked for me as an amateur was to ask both couples to decide who they wanted in what shots and I got them to call the necessary people together. I know to those that are professionals this would seem wrong, but this is your first time and worrying about who the people are and if they are there will cause you a headache. If you ask them and they miss someone off it is their problem!

I suggest you arrange to meet them before the wedding or soon after and take some shots of say walking down the street, sitting in a park. Natural candids.

Make sure you get some pictures of the Bride and Bridesmaids getting up and ready in the morning, they will be the most looked at ones in the future. If you can get some of the lads to do the same for the boys these will be good as well.

Finally it may interest you to know that when I photographed my Children's weddings I had virtually all of my information and advice off this site! So do a search and you will be pleasantly surprised at what you can find.

If you plan right it will be great fun, enjoy it.

Best regards

Chris

 

[POAH]

you are being particularly aggressive in your approach I suspect because you think wedding photography is something special when its not.

I never said "that anyone knows it the minute they pick up a camera and cross the threshold of a church" just like I would not expect someone that has never been in a studio before or shot motorsport or shot pets etc etc to be able to do it straight away. just like with every other branch of photography you need to have an understanding of photography to do. I see no wonder in wedding photography it ain't anything special

Not being agressive at all, I'm asking a direct question which I can answer.

You say there is no wonder in it but there is a heck of a lot of knowledge and experience.

If you have someone with a large nose, make sure it does not break the profile of the face...... if you have someone with one eye larger.... shoot them with the larger eye further away. If you have a larger bride, don't have her standing square on, have her standing 3/4 (group shots too) and where possible shoot from above.......

I could go on....and on.... and on. But then that's all so simple that anyone knows it the minute they pick up a camera and cross the threshold of a church.

So come on, join in and share some of the wonderment

 

[AliB]

I'll repeat it again, I'm not being agressive. I asked you a question which you still won't answer choosing instead to say that you don't think it's anything special. You are not contributing anything useful at all but choosing to denegrade those of us who do care, do think it is a bit special (after all does the bride not?)

So if you don't think it requires any skill or particular thought that's fair enough, there are those of us who do.

That does not make me agressive it just means I don't agree with you.

 

[Dave Pickett]

Post processing to achieve the results you want (not what the customer wants) takes a lot of time.

The objective of being in business is to make money, not to produce an artistic masterpiece. As long as your work meets the clients requirements then you have done enough. Chances are the client wont even notice the hours you have spent in PP so why do it?

There seems to be a state of mind amongst pros that they know what the client wants and charges and produces the images accordingly. The world has changed and many these days are satisfied (and only prepared to pay for) a more basic service, hence the rise of the £300 "quick and dirty" set of photos with little if any pp.........

Just my thoughts!!!

 

[POAH]

again you are twisting my words - skill yes you need to be able to take pictures but it is not some weird art that requires special powers like it is made out to be (which you are contributing). its no wonder people don't want to do it because they are scared when there is no reason to be.

I'm contributing to the denigration of the myth.
the OP asked "Has anyone (non-professional) been brave enough to do a wedding?? How did it go? Any advice"

I posted "weddings are not hard nor should they be stressful. so long as you are organised and have had good discussions about what the bride wants you'll be fine. So long as the pictures are well exposed, in focus and show the bride in a good way they will be happy.

If you can take a good picture of a person you can do a wedding"


to help alivated any stress or worries the OP may have about wedding photography. clearly this is another case of a so called professional thinking his job is above what it actually is.

I'll repeat it again, I'm not being agressive. I asked you a question which you still won't answer choosing instead to say that you don't think it's anything special. You are not contributing anything useful at all but choosing to denegrade those of us who do care, do think it is a bit special (after all does the bride not?)

So if you don't think it requires any skill or particular thought that's fair enough, there are those of us who do.

That does not make me agressive it just means I don't agree with you.