Another "Which DSLR for beginners" thread.

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Blaque

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Hi guys. :)

My needs are simple I would think, after using my fuji film s9600 for sometime now, I am starting to feel there is just too much limitations on it. So, the plan is to upgrade to a DSLR. I am after something that I can use for outdoor and indoor photography and something to cover weddings, church events, indoor use etc. I have a budget of 300pounds ish

Sony A200 is something I am keen on, but my friend think the lens are limited.

Olympus E510 is another one, that seems to have good reviews but I dunno anything about it.

Oh I forgot, something with live view will be nice as well - this can come in handy. Thanks.
 
Nikon D40 leaves you £60 or so change.
Dunno how much a canon 1000D is, if you want to stretch a bit canon 450D is about £390 (after cashback)
 
Blaque said:
Hi guys. :)

My needs are simple I would think, after using my fuji film s9600 for sometime now, I am starting to feel there is just too much limitations on it. So, the plan is to upgrade to a DSLR. I am after something that I can use for outdoor and indoor photography and something to cover weddings, church events, indoor use etc. I have a budget of 300pounds ish

Sony A200 is something I am keen on, but my friend think the lens are limited.

Olympus E510 is another one, that seems to have good reviews but I dunno anything about it.

Oh I forgot, something with live view will be nice as well - this can come in handy. Thanks.
Click to expand...

hi,my advice would be go to somewhere like jessops etc..and try them all out,canon,nikon,sony,olympus.....and see which you prefer.i'm relatively new to photography,and have only had the sony alpha's(on my second due to upgrading from A100 to A350).sony's lens range is nowhere near the likes of canon and nikon,but they're catching up slowly,but sigma and tamron to name but two cover lens that you could ever need,plus minolta's AF lens fit the sony's(A mount)and can be had quite cheaply on e-bay.another plus is that the sony alpha's have image stabilisation built into their body's,so this is effectively available on any lens,but with canon and nikon,you have to buy lens with the image stabilisation built in,which aren't cheap.also think about where you intend to go with your photography,remember...you are buying into a system.......
 
Its true, go to jessops and play with them. They have all the cameras charged up, and let you stick memory cards in them so you can review the pics.

tbh, having read many many reviews, people seem to say the 450d is the best. With the lowest noise, 14 bit processor, mirror lockup etc etc. But the sony kit lens is comparable to the canon one by the looks of the pics. So you can save money and get the sony alpha series. After cashback the a200 is £212 from amazon!! Or get the a300 (with live view) for £290 after quidco and cashback from jessops!

If you're tempted by the a350, its £350 after cashback from jessops. But then the 450d can be got for around 370-390 after cashback and quidco from jessops. So go play with them, and see what fits best in your hand!

Not looked into Nikon. For my hands the canons and sony's fit best and felt best for my grip. yours might be different!
 
Garnock said:
Can you be more specific, Blaque.
What,exactly, is limiting you with this camera.
That way we can figure out what might suit your needs.
Click to expand...

I find it to have a complicated learning curve. Dont get me wrong, it takes some nice photos but the fact that it is a bridge type camera means there will be limitation to some things it can do when compared to a DSLR.
 
Thank you guys for your inputs. I will have a go in Jessops tomorrow. I must say am leaning towards the Sony side of things now. [Not sure if this is a good decision though.]
 
Can't help thinking you're rushing into this.
You will get loads of people suggesting one camera or the other.
Have they asked what you intend to shoot, etc, etc.?
Take your time, mate.
Think about it.
I know you've set yourself a limit of £300 ish but, believe me, when you get into DSLR you will spend a helluva lot more.
Again, take your time and think about what you want to shoot.
 
Or pop into Jessops and have a play around with a few, decide which one(s) you like and keep your eye out on here for a secondhand example ;)
 
As well as going into Jessops and trying every conceivable model in every conceivable configuration with and without battery grips, do your research !!

Read as many reviews on each model and weigh up the pros and cons of each model to your requirements, including lenses, flashguns and any other add ons that you visualise you may need in the future. Also factor in the possibility that at some stage you may want to upgrade the body whilst retaining the lenses so what would your options be there too.

HTH
Gary :)
 
Blaque said:
I find it to have a complicated learning curve. Dont get me wrong, it takes some nice photos but the fact that it is a bridge type camera means there will be limitation to some things it can do when compared to a DSLR.
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are you sure? DSLRs are if anything an even steeper learning curve. The S9600 is a great camera, I don't see how it could be limiting you.
 
Yantorsen said:
are you sure? DSLRs are if anything an even steeper learning curve. The S9600 is a great camera, I don't see how it could be limiting you.
Click to expand...

I dunno how to explain this, but it appears to take noisy photos at high ISO, anything above 200 is my observation.

While it is packed with so much features, it sometimes feel like it is trying to do many things which can get confusing. I have had it for over a year now [or so] and some of the function is still something I have to battle with and check the manual every now and then.:p [Partly my fault]

I covered some church event photos and I wasn't too pleased with some of the result. Instructions was followed and did loads of practice shot, still it feels like the end result wasn't what I will call excellent. Also I am noticing a strange line running vertically in the middle of my shots:gag:...Perhaps my camera is now becoming faulty? :thumbsdown:

I'm off the Jessops now, but like you guys have mentioned. I am not looking to rush anything. End of this month will be the decision time.:)
 
Well, the sony and canon cashback offers are on until early january. And they said the busiest internet shopping day of the year will be december 8th (who works this stuff out?!), i expect a few more offers in the comiung weeks!

After all, after an RAC 5% voucher and sony cashback, you can now get the a200 for £198!! This was £226 cheapest only 2 weeks ago!!
 
Yantorsen said:
are you sure? DSLRs are if anything an even steeper learning curve. The S9600 is a great camera, I don't see how it could be limiting you.
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Maybe a learning curve yes, but to the OP... those who tell you to think about perhaps using a bridge camera before diving into purchasing a DSLR for reasons of 'learning curve', 'beyond ability' et al, well that's just total rubbish, very patronising and extremely condecending. Anyone would think using a DSLR is totally beyond the capabilities of the majority of people, well you will be pleased to know it isn't, and you will soon learn to get the best out of your kit regardless of which model/make you go for. Most around here (on talkphotography) will suggest Nikon or Canon, but take a look also at Sony, Olympus and Panasonic, they are excellent value for money and very often you get a much better features/pound ratio.

Sure, best not to go for top of the range model from any manufacturer just yet - but not for reasons of 'learning curve' or 'too difficult for a learner to start on', more for reasons of cost/use/benefit etc.

tP is a great place to start learning once you have made your choice. Ask away, read and learn... you'll soon be taking great shots.
 
Blaque said:
I dunno how to explain this, but it appears to take noisy photos at high ISO, anything above 200 is my observation.

While it is packed with so much features, it sometimes feel like it is trying to do many things which can get confusing. I have had it for over a year now [or so] and some of the function is still something I have to battle with and check the manual every now and then.:p [Partly my fault]

I covered some church event photos and I wasn't too pleased with some of the result. Instructions was followed and did loads of practice shot, still it feels like the end result wasn't what I will call excellent. Also I am noticing a strange line running vertically in the middle of my shots:gag:...Perhaps my camera is now becoming faulty? :thumbsdown:

I'm off the Jessops now, but like you guys have mentioned. I am not looking to rush anything. End of this month will be the decision time.:)
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Tbh a DSLR isn;t going to be easier, a better camera isn't going to make you a better photographer.
 
But a worse camera will make you think you're being a bit crap when the bridge camera's optical and functional limitations are holding you back. What sort of shots do you intend to take with it?
 
Whatever you choose, know for sure you will be disatisfied with it very soon if you compromise.

I have, in an expensively short space of time made numerous mistakes. Don't go for the 450D for one :)
 
toonamp said:
Whatever you choose, know for sure you will be disatisfied with it very soon if you compromise.

I have, in an expensively short space of time made numerous mistakes. Don't go for the 450D for one :)
Click to expand...


Very true, buy the best body and lens you can afford. I'm now itching to buy a 40D or 50D to replace my 8 month old 400D, as I've learnt so much about photography this year. A new lens is more important though, so I'm spending my cash on that.
 
theMusicMan said:
those who tell you to think about perhaps using a bridge camera before diving into purchasing a DSLR for reasons of 'learning curve', 'beyond ability' et al, well that's just total rubbish, very patronising and extremely condecending.

Sure, best not to go for top of the range model from any manufacturer just yet - but not for reasons of 'learning curve' or 'too difficult for a learner to start on', more for reasons of cost/use/benefit etc.

tP is a great place to start learning once you have made your choice. Ask away, read and learn... you'll soon be taking great shots.
Click to expand...

I suppose I ought to interject at some point being 'the friend' mentioned earlier.

The reason i've suggested to him not to go for a DSLR, whilst partly do with the learning curve, as he's suggested he still finds his bridge confusing to use isn't entirely to do with that.

He's expressed to me he wants a complete system. Something he can buy, that will work, do everything he wants and last him without major extra expense. In my opinion, this directly opposes half the point of a DSLR. You buy them not only for quality but for the expandability and customisability.

In general he's levelled complaints at the general expense of the DSLR system and 'having to much to fiddle with' on his S9600.

After everything he's said to me, I honestly feel he would be far happier with a good quality all in one instead of an SLR and see no reason just to get an SLR for the sake of it, just because it's 'better'.
 
Yantorsen said:
Tbh a DSLR isn;t going to be easier, a better camera isn't going to make you a better photographer.
Click to expand...

It depends on one's approach I guess. Having a good camera, will go a long way in helping my skills.

RichardC27 said:
But a worse camera will make you think you're being a bit crap when the bridge camera's optical and functional limitations are holding you back. What sort of shots do you intend to take with it?
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True.

Outdoors - wild life, landscapes, etc. Perhaps a few sporting events or two.
Others - Like church event and studio photography. ** I have a few props for this already]

toonamp said:
Whatever you choose, know for sure you will be disatisfied with it very soon if you compromise.
I have, in an expensively short space of time made numerous mistakes. Don't go for the 450D for one :)
Click to expand...

It is one of the reasons I'm seeking advice from the Grand Wizards on this part of the web.:)
 
toonamp said:
Whatever you choose, know for sure you will be disatisfied with it very soon if you compromise.

I have, in an expensively short space of time made numerous mistakes. Don't go for the 450D for one :)
Click to expand...

Interested to know why a first time DSLR buyer shouldn't buy a 450D ?
 
As a first time buyer i was looking at the 450d...
 
Craft said:
Interested to know why a first time DSLR buyer shouldn't buy a 450D ?
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Because it's aimed at the first time buyer, and it's a first time buyers camera.

Enough whistles and bells to look and sound right, without any confusion, but leaving you, whithin a short while, with the realisation the money you saved by not buying that 50D was money well wasted :D


The difference in price between a standard entry level camera and a decent one is'nt a lot, and as it's the platform for the vast range of lenses out there, you may as well start with a decent base.


Mind it depends what your aspirations are.
 
Blaque said:
Outdoors - wild life, landscapes, etc. Perhaps a few sporting events or two.
Others - Like church event and studio photography. ** I have a few props for this already]
eb.:)
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the s9600 is fine for landscapes, take a look at these shots of mine taken with it:

http://www.joshuathomson.co.uk/landscape/photos/DSCF2225_2.jpg
http://www.joshuathomson.co.uk/landscape/photos/DSCF1836_2.jpg
http://www.joshuathomson.co.uk/landscape/photos/DSCF1966_2.jpg

I think you should at the very least learn to understand and use your s9600 first.
 
toonamp said:
Because it's aimed at the first time buyer, and it's a first time buyers camera.

Enough whistles and bells to look and sound right, without any confusion, but leaving you, whithin a short while, with the realisation the money you saved by not buying that 50D was money well wasted :D


The difference in price between a standard entry level camera and a decent one is'nt a lot, and as it's the platform for the vast range of lenses out there, you may as well start with a decent base.


Mind it depends what your aspirations are.
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So you are saying ANY SLR user should immediately go and buy at least a 50D or D90 or they are wasting their time ? A 50D is nearly three times the price of a 450D, the D90 is three times the cost of a D40.
Any canon can use any lens, the Nikons almost any lens, I don't see your logic Im afraid.

What exactly is (say) a 50D going to give someone who is 6 months in that the 450D wont give (same can be asked of D90 / D40). From reading alot of stuff the main reason for upgrading the body is 1) gone pro 2) new toy syndrome.
 
Craft said:
So you are saying ANY SLR user should immediately go and buy at least a 50D or D90 or they are wasting their time ? A 50D is nearly three times the price of a 450D, the D90 is three times the cost of a D40.
Any canon can use any lens, the Nikons almost any lens, I don't see your logic Im afraid.

What exactly is (say) a 50D going to give someone who is 6 months in that the 450D wont give (same can be asked of D90 / D40). From reading alot of stuff the main reason for upgrading the body is 1) gone pro 2) new toy syndrome.
Click to expand...

As I said it depends on your aspirations. I can only asume the majority of people move into the relm of SLRs because they want to improve the image quality they're getting, or to take advantage of a wide selection of lenses. If it's the new toy syndrome, I don't know, sorry.

I've no idea where you get your info about the main reason for upgrading the body is because of going proffesional, but it's definitly not the biggest reason by far.

The people that post on here are continually striving to improve their photographic skills, it's the nature of the game. As any musican or painter worth their salt will continually seek higher things. There comes a point when the only way to do that is to upgrade their camera. That's not to deny the fact that the really skillfull out there could turn out sheer beauty on any point and shoot. I'm a mere mortal though and need help.

To be more practical and to address the point about the 450D, it is very noisy at 400 ISO, perhaps there are other cheap entry level cameras that are'nt.

As I have found that there are more occasions when I'm shooting in poor light conditions than in good, it's important to me to have a camera that at least works well at 400 ISO. If I use 800 ISO the photos are too noisy for any real use. As it only goes up to 1600 in jumps of 100, 200, 400, 800, 1600 it hasn't even got the scope I need let alone the quality.

Using, for instance the 100-400 or the siggy 50-500, my shutter speed is reduced to useless, unless I boost the ISO and therefore the noise. Another small point is the size of the thing, on these lenses it virtully disappears. I'd like something that feels a tad more substantial.

This is my personal experience, and my particular needs from this camera. Yours may well be different.
As you are likely to spend twice or three times as much eventually on lenses as you do for the body, why buy a camera because of price as the main consideration.

As you say any Canon can use most lenses, some are designed to use them better than others is the logic I'm using.
 
Yantorsen said:
the s9600 is fine for landscapes, take a look at these shots of mine taken with it:

http://www.joshuathomson.co.uk/landscape/photos/DSCF2225_2.jpg
http://www.joshuathomson.co.uk/landscape/photos/DSCF1836_2.jpg
http://www.joshuathomson.co.uk/landscape/photos/DSCF1966_2.jpg

I think you should at the very least learn to understand and use your s9600 first.
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Those look lovely!:)

I open to advice, but believe it or not. The vertical line running in some of my shot suggest it is time for an upgrade. Another bridge type is an option, but I would say at this stage my eyes and sight is set on a dslr of some kind.
 
I started off with a Pentax K100D. Great camera for the price and easy to understand. I havn't used a K200D, but I think its still under £300 too, and if its anything like the K100D, I'd say its well worth a look.
 
Hi.

I am looking at Pentax 200d with quite an interest..Not thinking about 100d super as it has just 6 mega pixels which is not sexy though I am not going to print large size almost never...

I like Pentax built in shake reduction and dust cleaning.and ability to use any lens..

pentax 200 d lacks Live view though but can any one shed some light on its depth of field preview???

sadly its not available under 300 with kit lens...cheapest reputable deal is from Jessops / currys at 379.99..with additional GBP 50 cash back..making it 329.99

At this price I can get canon 1000 d give or take a few quuids...

http://www.camerapricebuster.com/Pentax_Pentax_K200D_+_18-55mm_Lens_pc.html

Any pointers as regard to K200d performance , view finder as it lacks live view...and to best price are most welcome..
 
just googled your camera and the lens is an equivilant to 28-300 f2.8-f4.0 (i think). to cover this lens range at those f stops you are looking at about 3 ish lenses(24-70, 70-200 and something to cover the last 100 if needed)low light you would want f2.8 fixed f stop. which would equate to just under a £900 ish using sigma lenses(closer to £1000 each lens for canon and nikon versions). this is on top of your camera. perhaps something to consider. i have no idea what the cameras your looking at are like though
 
@Ajex, what do you mean by "ability to use any lens?" please :)
 
Hi Blaque,

I mean any Pentax lens manufacured for last 10-20 years as the shake reduction is built in the body and not the lens...Same for Sony a300 , it will support old Minolta lenses..

Nikon and Canon have shake reduction on the lens making the lens more expensive.


Can experts opine on Pentax k200d

Ajex
 
Oh I see. Thanks. I thought so as I went to check the camera spec out. It will be something to consider when am buying one. It will be nice to hear people's opinion about this camera though.
 
Never used the K200D, just the K100D. I've have the K100D for a year and a half now and its done me well, I'm only just considering moving up to a K20D now. If the K200D is any better than the K100D, you'll definitly love it.

The lens that comes on it (the Pentax DA SMC 18-55mm) is a great lens too, I've taken some very clear shots with it and the autofocus is great. The whole camera has a great feel to it, everything is just where I'd like it to be when I was just starting off with photography. The only other lens I have for it is a Sigma 18-55. Its quite loud and slow to focus, but its not very expensive (I've seen it online for around £110) if you want it purely for the focal length. Still, it takes some nice pictures and for a person new to a DSLR theres nothing wrong with it.
 
As was mentioned early on in the post, go and try the various makes and se which feels the most comfortable to you, to hold and, if the layot of switches and buttons is mopst intuitive. The posters here are telling you THEIR favourite. Only you can pick yours.

Also remember lenses are important, you will keep good lenses longer than the body.
 
PsiFox said:
As was mentioned early on in the post, go and try the various makes and se which feels the most comfortable to you, to hold and, if the layot of switches and buttons is mopst intuitive. The posters here are telling you THEIR favourite. Only you can pick yours.

Also remember lenses are important, you will keep good lenses longer than the body.
Click to expand...

I have done that and am still in my quest to find something I will not regret. It is one of the many reasons, I am asking of people's views etc. It can go a long way you see.:)
 
Olympus 410 ,the only thing it lacks is shake reduction and a bit dated...

But I think its a steal with twin kit lens and if you are not too fusy about having everything latest then its would be good..

check this link for all the reviews...

http://myolympus.org/E410/#Reviews

and also check amazon user reviews both US and UK..

Good luck

Ajay
 
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