Angry driver let off after attacking cyclist

kiteninja said:
I may start using my helmit cam for road use as I would have hundreds of hours of footage of **** drivers overtaking me on blind corners, narrow roads etc....
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Maybe car drivers who get so wazzed by inconsiderate cyclists should use a dash-cam too,glasss houses and stones spring to mind.
 
mex said:
Maybe car drivers who get so wazzed by inconsiderate cyclists should use a dash-cam too,glasss houses and stones spring to mind.
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Feel free it'll be good too have 2 different angles of you being a dick on the road :).
 
All the differing opinions on the page are pretty funny. I spent most of my high school years on a bike 6 days a week as I used to race regionally and very occasionally nationally too. Even riding on my own against the kerb I would have people driving aggressively towards me.

There are only so many times that you can take a wing mirror to the arm or you can narrowly miss somebody opening their door on you before you have a serious accident. Since giving it up I know of at least two young lads that were my age that have died on the roads, would you want that to be your 18 year old son?

I think sometimes unless you have actually ridden on the roads you won't understand just how dangerous it is out there. In this case the driver was being an absolute ****, cutting him up within a foot or two could have easily caused a serious accident. Trying to open the door on him which could have killed him and then when his first two attempts failed he decided he would go and physically assault him. Anyone condoning that needs their head checking...
 
crofter said:
Cyclists certainly don't like being hooted at when they are riding 3 abreast and you can't get past them on a narrow road, they don't pay any road tax either.
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I was staying clear of this thread because it was always going to degenerate into ignorant bashing of cyclists but I can't ignore these posts so let's just clear a couple of things up:

1. Road tax hasn't existed since 1937. The tax disk is Vehicle Excise Duty (VED), and the price is calculated from the emissions of the vehicle. Cyclists are 0 emissions (and no, farting doesn't count!)

2. VED doesn't pay for the roads. Roads are funded from general taxation such as income tax and council tax. Something almost all of us pay.

3. 87% of cyclists are car owners and so most cyclists pay VED for their vehicle(s), and have passed their theory and practical tests.

crofter said:
Cyclists don't fart then ? The tax is for wear and tear
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Wear and tear on the roads is primarily determined by the weight of the vehicles travelling on it. A fully-loaded, 5-axle articulated lorry weighs 80,000 lbs (40 tonnes - legal limit). That's approximately 20 times that of a usual car. Despite only weighing 20 times more, the wear and tear that lorry creates is the equivalent of 9600 cars, because with increased weight there's an exponential increase in wear. (http://archive.gao.gov/f0302/109884.pdf, p.23)

That same logic works in reverse for cyclists relative to cars. My bike and I weigh 60kg, which is approximately 1/20th the weight of a car. As we've seen, 1/20th the weight does mean 1/20th of the wear. Now I don't know the exact formula to calculate this, but it's fair to assume one car is equivalent to several thousand bicycles.

Edit - On the topic of cyclists causing congestion, how about this:

Q43 Chair: Do cyclists cause the congestion? Mr Peck, do you have a view on that?

Christopher Peck: We would certainly argue they don't. Evidence from Holland suggests that you can carry 14,000 cycles per hour per lane, as opposed to 2,000 per hour per lane for a car. As we have already heard, the average loading of a car is between 1.2 and 1.6, depending on the time zone and the type of trip.

Additionally, Transport for London have done some recent research which suggested that the value of a bicycle was 0.2 of that of a car when they do their traffic modelling of roads in London. Certainly, it has a much lower impact on congestion than personalised motor vehicles. Of course, the other benefit of cyclists, which has been outlined in the previous session and was picked up by Transport for London, is that they can filter through traffic. Of course, they can be grouped in very large numbers at the front of traffic and there are advanced stop lines that are now used in many places. This keeps them out of the way of motor traffic, allows them to filter through it and doesn't cause a problem to other road users.

I would very much suggest that cyclists do not contribute to congestion. Indeed, they are a major solution to it. In places where congestion has got very bad, we noticed that cycling levels have increased. A lot of people have moved from car to bike as a means of reducing their own susceptibility to congestion and delays that are caused to their trips.
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http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201012/cmselect/cmtran/872/11032903.htm

That's just one of a myriad of links I could share that demonstrate the positive effect cycling has on reducing congestion.
 
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I think all cyclists should have some sort of third party insurance.
As for congestion, they do certainly add to it because they disrupt traffic flow where there isn't room to pass them safely.
 
nilagin said:
I think all cyclists should have some sort of third party insurance.
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As most people tend to bash cyclists who ride in groups I would presume 99% of them are members of a club in some form. Most clubs (and definitely if you race) expect you to have 3rd party insurance

nilagin said:
As for congestion, they do certainly add to it because they disrupt traffic flow where there isn't room to pass them safely.
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I presume you can get past a car in traffic easier then? :bonk:
 
nilagin said:
I think all cyclists should have some sort of third party insurance.
As for congestion, they do certainly add to it because they disrupt traffic flow where there isn't room to pass them safely.
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Can you cite any hard evidence to support that? I've never seen a single piece of credible evidence to suggest that cyclists worsen traffic flow. In fact, increasing the number of cyclists is seen as a solution to congestion the world over and is supported by a wealth of studies.
 
there are 2 sides to this

As a cyclist and a driver I see it both ways

Some cyclists act like knobs and so do some car drivers. However cyclists are LOT more vulnerable, and really ought to be given a wider berth when being overtaken. Some cars have awful blind spots and some cyclists do insist of creeping into them up the inside

This really comes down to everyone acting to treating everyone else in away that you would like to be treated yourself if the roles were reversed
 
Richard King said:
there are 2 sides to this

As a cyclist and a driver I see it both ways

Some cyclists act like knobs and so do some car drivers. However cyclists are LOT more vulnerable, and really ought to be given a wider berth when being overtaken. Some cars have awful blind spots and some cyclists do insist of creeping into them up the inside

This really comes down to everyone acting to treating everyone else in away that you would like to be treated yourself if the roles were reversed
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:plusone:

Cyclists aren't perfect road users by any means, but to suggest they're worse than other road users is just prejudice.
 
Agree with Richard, one thing that annoys me though is, when you're in your mobile traffic-jam-causing-mobile, or car, sitting in a mile long queue of traffic on your way home, you can choose your position in the road before you come to a stop:

a] to pull into the left a bit so the motorcyclists trying to beat the traffic can get past you on the outside

b] to pull out to the right a bit to allow that cyclist youve recently passed to be able to get past you on the inside.

Whichever one you select, invariably one of the other 2 wheeled persuasion then comes along and thinks you are a berk for not positioning yourself to let them get past. :bang:
 
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Nikon Man said:
As a car driver I loath cyclist's

As a motorcyclist I loath cyclist's and car drivers

.....

I change my attitude to other road users depending on my mode of transport.:lol:
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So, so true. :lol:
 
jacob12_1993 said:
I presume you can get past a car in traffic easier then? :bonk:
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Not taking sides here, given that I also hink there are knobs on bicycles as well as cars, but generally, cars are doing a similar speed to eachother so there's no need to overtake. If there is a regular stream of traffic coming the other way, the traffc can get extremely congested if cars can't get past a cyclist safely.

That said, it normally only delays people by a couple of minutes at most anyway.
 
Gary Coyle said:
Cyclist was a nob in the first place for using his horn when clearly nowhere near the van
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id say the rear quarter of the van was about a foot from the cyclist as he proceeded to cut across. thats far too close.

it was aggressive, intimidating driving. the van driver clearly already had issues with the cyclist (the driver was leaning forward to look around the passenger as he went by) probably going back to where the car was parking.

if you got cut up like that in your car you wouldn't like it, and you're tucked up nice and safe in a metal cage with airbags. if you get clipped like that on a bike you're going down, potentially under someones wheels.

quite frankly im disgusted that people seem to be adopting the "oh well most cyclists are idiots" attitude like the guy deserved it.

anyway, im out. OOF strikes again.
 
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neil_g said:
id say the rear quarter of the van was about a foot from the cyclist as he proceeded to cut across. thats far too close.

it was aggressive, intimidating driving. the van driver clearly already had issues with the cyclist (the driver was leaning forward to look around the passenger as he went by) probably going back to where the car was parking.

if you got cut up like that in your car you wouldn't like it, and you're tucked up nice and safe in a metal cage with airbags. if you get clipped like that on a bike you're going down, potentially under someones wheels.

quite frankly im disgusted that people seem to be adopting the "oh well most cyclists are idiots" attitude like the guy deserved it.

anyway, im out. OOF strikes again.
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Hi Neil, has anybody suggested he deserved a beating? In my quick scan through the posts i couldn't see that.

I see a few posts where people say the cyclist was riding aggressively (as when he tried undertaking a queue of cars and came across the focus attempting to parallel park), but none condoning the van draiver.
 
My 2p worth on this subject

I see pedal bike riders every day , 95% are a law unto themselves

Riding through red light is normal , the law does not apply to them

Riding the wrong side of traffic islands !

Riding over zebra crossings with people on them !


I often wounder why pedal bike riders need to record the ride ? I drive a car , Van . Lorry , and ride a Harley and have never recorded any journey

It would be good to see a recording of the pedal bike riders actions and hand gestures prior to ending up being confronted
 
F1.2 said:
My 2p worth on this subject

I see pedal bike riders every day , 95% are a law unto themselves

Riding through red light is normal , the law does not apply to them

Riding the wrong side of traffic islands !

Riding over zebra crossings with people on them !

I often wounder why pedal bike riders need to record the ride ? I drive a car , Van . Lorry , and ride a Harley and have never recorded any journey

It would be good to see a recording of the pedal bike riders actions and hand gestures prior to ending up being confronted
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That's funny because 95% of Harley riders are terrible on the road. And don't get me started on the appalling driving I've seen by 93% of van drivers. In fact I'd go as far as to say everyone in a van behaves like the guy in this video.

Yeah, I can make up wildly inaccurate figures as well.

No one is trying to defend cyclists wholesale. The red light and zebra crossing jumping cyclists probably annoy law abiding cyclists more than anyone else because we're the ones who have to put up with the abuse and intolerance as a result of the bad name they give us.

Anyway, I knew this thread would turn from a demonstration of one instance of appalling aggression on the roads towards a cyclist, and pathetically weak sentencing, into an opportunity to cry out that cyclists have no place on British roads, despite all the evidence and reasoning to the contrary.

On that note I give up. I don't even know why I bothered trying to put forward a reasoned case against the usual criticisms.
 
This morning I had a wierd experience when a cyclist got aggressively angry when I didn't overtake him. I was driving to work along a narrow country lane and came up behind the cyclist. There wan't room to overtake safely IMO so I just sat back and drove slowly about 10 feet behind him. I knew the road widens about 200 yards ahead so was happy to wait. The cyclist didn't stop but kept waving me to pass him, wobbling around as he waved his arm. It would have been a real squeeze to get past him so I just hung back. He got more and more angry, waving his arm and shouting. When I eventually passed him I got a stream of swear words and more waving of the arm.

The whole road rage thing really amazes me :cuckoo:
 
F1.2 said:
My 2p worth on this subject

I see pedal bike riders every day , 95% are a law unto themselves

Riding through red light is normal , the law does not apply to them

Riding the wrong side of traffic islands !

Riding over zebra crossings with people on them !

I often wounder why pedal bike riders need to record the ride ? I drive a car , Van . Lorry , and ride a Harley and have never recorded any journey

It would be good to see a recording of the pedal bike riders actions and hand gestures prior to ending up being confronted
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That is a minority of cyclists and they pee off us law abiding cyclists. Don't tar us all with the same brush.
 
jacob12_1993 said:
I presume you can get past a car in traffic easier then? :bonk:
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If a car is travelling at the speed limit why would you need to overtake it. Cyclists don't travel at the speed limit. So if you can't overtake them due to oncoming traffic, they cause a hold up.
 
TriggerHappy said:
Can you cite any hard evidence to support that? I've never seen a single piece of credible evidence to suggest that cyclists worsen traffic flow. In fact, increasing the number of cyclists is seen as a solution to congestion the world over and is supported by a wealth of studies.
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I can only cite what I've seen. If a cyclist is overtaking a line of parked cars and there is no room to overtake because of oncoming traffic then the cyclist is causing congestion as the traffic has to slow until as such time they are out of the way and it's safe to overtake them.
If the roads are predominantly used by cyclists then yes there would be no congestion, but roads are predominantly used by vehicles able to travel at the speed limit. The second a cyclist prevents traffic moving fast enough that is congestion, no matter the length of time.
 
Try living in the village where I live, the A road that runs through it is a scenic route from South Wales to Brecon and the Beacons national park. Most,and I mean most, weekend days there is a plethora of lycra clad numpties who are intent on plodding along sometimes as many as 4 or 5 abreast, chatting as they go, at way less than the 30mph limit and really not giving a toss for anyone or anything that is jammed behind them and if a driver of any other vehicle has the audacity to want to carry on their journey rather than get jammed behind them and dare to overtake them,the string of obscenities and hand gestures is quite staggering.
 
menthel said:
That is a minority of cyclists and they pee off us law abiding cyclists. Don't tar us all with the same brush.
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This ^

Also, any driver that ever breaks the speed limit, can't really comment on a cyclist breaking any road traffic laws.
 
nilagin said:
If a car is travelling at the speed limit why would you need to overtake it. Cyclists don't travel at the speed limit. So if you can't overtake them due to oncoming traffic, they cause a hold up.
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the speed limit for whichever road you are travelling on is a maximum.
so what if you can't overtake slow moving traffic! just wait till you can! some people are so impatient, and too selfish.
 
Carlo said:
the speed limit for whichever road you are travelling on is a maximum.
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We need a yawn icon. Im so tired of seeing this "argument" that I hear it an a sanctimonious, health and safety geek type voice every time I read it.

Yes its a maximum and Id say 90% of the time most motorists are going along at or near that maximum and not dawdling along ****ing everyone else off. Knackers all to do with being impatient or selfish, more the accepted wisdom on how to drive. See Institute of Advanced Motorists driving test for further details.

Goes without saying (or does it?) of course that, should the conditions not allow it then fair enough you slow down, fog, heavy rain, lycra clad numpties cycling 5 abreast or whatever, but in general, travel at or near the limit.
 
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Carlo said:
the speed limit for whichever road you are travelling on is a maximum.
so what if you can't overtake slow moving traffic! just wait till you can! some people are so impatient, and too selfish.
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There's a hell of alot of speed difference between a slow vehicle and a cyclist that is probably doing 1/3 of the speed limit at the most. It's nothing to do with being impatient or selfish.
 
Carlo said:
the speed limit for whichever road you are travelling on is a maximum.
so what if you can't overtake slow moving traffic! just wait till you can! some people are so impatient, and too selfish.
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I'll remember that the next time I have a client to see, or a deadline to meet...
 
MWHCVT said:
I'll remember that the next time I have a client to see, or a deadline to meet...
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Good. Perhaps it'll make you manage your time more effectively by leaving a few seconds earlier (if cyclists really do cause you any delay at all) and prevent you being one of those nobs that think it's acceptable to pass within inches of a cyclist.
 
TriggerHappy said:
Good. Perhaps it'll make you manage your time more effectively by leaving a few seconds earlier (if cyclists really do cause you any delay at all) and prevent you being one of those nobs that think it's acceptable to pass within inches of a cyclist.
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I doubt you've got any idea how I manage my time, show the mentality of most cyclist that you cannot communicate without resorting to use of "nobs"

What about the cyclist that took my wing mirror clean off a few years back while I was stationary in traffic, did he stop to give me he details so I could reclaim the cost of making my car road legal again?

Or the one a couple of weeks ago merrily riding about a foot off the centre of the road for 1/2 a mile because he was going to turn right, ensuring that no one could pass him...that was a nice delay for a few minutes there, that one made me late getting to see my dad in hospital...okay so only five minutes late but still late...

Or how about the pair of cyclist that stopped on the T Junctions at the end of my lane totally blocking me from getting past with out going right into the other side of the road which then if there were a car wanting to come into the lane would then result in me being in there way, so if I did that I would be considered driving dangerously, and what were they doing, well they were either messing with a satnav or mobile looking device....so why didn't they go onto the grass which at this particular junction is about 10m wide on each side and well cut so nothing to stops them...

This simple answer to this is that they're all self absorbed in there own little world that or they're just simply arrogant, I've got dozens of other examples but those are just ones that spring to mind
 
MWHCVT said:
I doubt you've got any idea how I manage my time, show the mentality of most cyclist that you cannot communicate without resorting to use of "nobs"

What about the cyclist that took my wing mirror clean off a few years back while I was stationary in traffic, did he stop to give me he details so I could reclaim the cost of making my car road legal again?

Or the one a couple of weeks ago merrily riding about a foot off the centre of the road for 1/2 a mile because he was going to turn right, ensuring that no one could pass him...that was a nice delay for a few minutes there, that one made me late getting to see my dad in hospital...okay so only five minutes late but still late...

Or how about the pair of cyclist that stopped on the T Junctions at the end of my lane totally blocking me from getting past with out going right into the other side of the road which then if there were a car wanting to come into the lane would then result in me being in there way, so if I did that I would be considered driving dangerously, and what were they doing, well they were either messing with a satnav or mobile looking device....so why didn't they go onto the grass which at this particular junction is about 10m wide on each side and well cut so nothing to stops them...

This simple answer to this is that they're all self absorbed in there own little world that or they're just simply arrogant, I've got dozens of other examples but those are just ones that spring to mind
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No the simple answer is to clarify that we're all road users, and all human, and as such there's a mix of good and poor in every category.

You want me to list the instances I've been nearly been knocked off my bike by terrible driving? I could, but I won't because I'm not sufficiently prejudiced to believe that the bad drivers (of which there are many) are representative of all drivers.

And for the record, I have NEVER demonstrated any type of road rage. I've never waved my arms furiously at anyone who's endangered my life. Never yelled expletives at anyone whilst riding my bike. I always stay to the left of my lane when remotely possible, often stopping entirely and stepping onto the grass verge if there's insufficient space for a safe pass and no passing places within a hundred yards or so, and always raise a hand in thanks to anyone who passes me well. Consequently I've not once found myself in a confrontational situation with other road users, so you have no idea of the type of cyclists I am.
 
Carlo said:
like it or not, cyclists have just as much right to be on the road as you in your car, motorcycle, bus, truck...
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I never said I didn't like it, someone said they relieve congestion. I said they can also cause congestion, which they do.
 
Also, how do you propose a cyclist delayed you by 5 minutes over half a mile? That would mean he was going at a pace of 10 minutes a mile, or 6mph. No one cycles that slowly, and certainly no one does it for 5 minutes in the right of a lane with a queue of angry traffic behind!
 
London in particular seems to have two special breeds of cyclists. Those who have just got out of their BMW X5 jeeps and who are thus still invincible and bully all other traffic and those who bounce onto the pavement scattering pedestrians and then back off the pavement scattering cars when it suits them.

But if you want a specific instance of cyclists slowing traffic, visit Highgate West Hill in the evening rush hour. The lycra warriors exercise their legal right to grind up the hill at 4 or 5 mph. Meanwhile the queue of cars behind does the shunting train stop-start and burns five times more fuel than it would otherwise have to.

Indeed, the queue of traffic goes a mile back down the road to Kentish Town and creates a traffic jam where none needed to exist.

In environmental terms, there would be less fuel used and less pollution caused if some kind environmentalist put the cyclists into hired limousines and gave them all lifts up the hill!
 
TriggerHappy said:
No the simple answer is to clarify that we're all road users, and all human, and as such there's a mix of good and poor in every category.

You want me to list the instances I've been nearly been knocked off my bike by terrible driving? I could, but I won't because I'm not sufficiently prejudiced to believe that the bad drivers (of which there are many) are representative of all drivers.

And for the record, I have NEVER demonstrated any type of road rage. I've never waved my arms furiously at anyone who's endangered my life. Never yelled expletives at anyone whilst riding my bike. I always stay to the left of my lane when remotely possible, often stopping entirely and stepping onto the grass verge if there's insufficient space for a safe pass and no passing places within a hundred yards or so, and always raise a hand in thanks to anyone who passes me well. Consequently I've not once found myself in a confrontational situation with other road users, so you have no idea of the type of cyclists I am.
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I wouldn't dare to suggest I knew what type of cyclist you are, I'm sure your perfect in every way, I can admit I'm a flawed driver, I'm not a patient person and if someone cause me delay it winds me up...poor drivers also wind me up just as much as poor cyclists, I also maintain a stance that cyclists should be required to maintain an insurance policy and display a identification plate on the bike that they're riding..so that in the instance of the first example I can reclaim my £200+ that it cost me to have a new colour coded electric wing mirror on my car
 
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