An Independent Scotland?

dejongj said:
Actually, and it seems like I'm talking to the stars as everyone keeps on ignoring the distinction.
Scotland using the pound will still be a currency union. It is technically called an informal union. We cannot stop it, there is no reason to stop it. And it is likely the only sensible option a to possible iScotland for the foreseeing future. To all intend and purposes this can be labelled as a currency union.
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This is not the union i'm talking about and while it may technically use the same term i don't consider it any kind of union.

It's also flawed and may not work that well for Scotland from what i've read. No lender of last resort, no monetary policy control, no EU membership(?), a need for large cash reserves(?), etc.
 
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ST4 said:
Long term rUK will benefit without Scotland and the politics it contributes to the UK. No doubt Scotland would get EU membership and it should adopt the Euro rather than share the currency it divorced itself from (in the event of a yes vote). That makes sense of sorts and opens up trade for Scotland.

Why would scotland want to use a currency it has no input into?
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I agree, although realistically before they can ready themselves for Euro entry they may have to have an informal credit union with the pound. However this then becomes a barrier for Euro entry. There was an interesting article about aligning to the US dollar which is another option. However to create their socialist nirvana they need their own currency.
 
dejongj said:
I agree, although realistically before they can ready themselves for Euro entry they may have to have an informal credit union with the pound. However this then becomes a barrier for Euro entry. There was an interesting article about aligning to the US dollar which is another option. However to create their socialist nirvana they need their own currency.
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A lot of EU countries are socialist. They will have time to sort EU membership and currency in the hand over phase from vote to independence day
 
To be honest, in the unlikely event this becomes a real concern, as long as it does not adversely effect the UK I could not really care how and what they will establish.

On a micro scale it will affect small business in the border region, but I suspect there will be plenty of entrepreneurial opportunity as well :)
 
dejongj said:
Actually, and it seems like I'm talking to the stars as everyone keeps on ignoring the distinction.

Scotland using the pound will still be a currency union. It is technically called an informal union. We cannot stop it, there is no reason to stop it. And it is likely the only sensible option a to possible iScotland for the foreseeing future. To all intend and purposes this can be labelled as a currency union.

Scotland sharing the pound will also be a currency union. It is technical called a formal union with common policy. Scotland will require agreement from the UK for that type of a currency union. And I cannot see the UK agree to that at all since there is no benefit to is at all and will give away control over our own currency. We may as well join the euro. However to all intend and purposes this can be labelled as a credit union.

So in typical AS clever way he could win either way and say that he has established a currency union. Both types are good for Scotland in the short term. One is bad for UK in the short term and long term. And one is bad for Scotland in the long term. It is political brilliance in my opinion and I can appreciate it. Doesn't help informing the voters though.
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The white paper has listed this Sterlingisation option and explained it. The key features would be:

- Limited role for central bank
- No change in currency
- Would not require a formal agreement with the UK
- Limited opportunity to provide liquidity to the financial system
- Full fiscal autonomy - alongside other economic levers (e.g. regulation)

A monetary union that is informal is most likely what would happen if there was a yes but you don't go into a negotiation arguing for second best from the start.
 
Laudrup said:
The white paper has listed this Sterlingisation option and explained it. The key features would be:

- Limited role for central bank
- No change in currency
- Would not require a formal agreement with the UK
- Limited opportunity to provide liquidity to the financial system
- Full fiscal autonomy - alongside other economic levers (e.g. regulation)

A monetary union that is informal is most likely what would happen if there was a yes but you don't go into a negotiation arguing for second best from the start.
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Yet they refer to it as sharing the pound which is very disingenuous and not correct. They should just use simple recognisable terminology for it.

And to be fair, it is not just the yes campaign that is guilty. The no campaign is just as bad as they use silly arguments that an independent Scotland can't use the pound which is just not true.

Neither help in bringing clarity to it.
 
You might find the bullying and intimidation is what helps to swing a no vote in the end with people who haven't made up there minds . I have a question where do the people of Scotland stand on nuclear PowerStation's and if they are in favour how are they going to get rid of the waste as I believe at the moment it comes back over the border from the 2 PowerStation's that are there.:naughty: I can't really see that happening after a yes vote :D
 
Ecuador, East Timor, El Salvador, Marshall Islands, Micronesia, Palau, Turks and Caicos, British Virgin Islands, Zimbabwe all 'use' someone elses currency. May be adding Scotland to that list soon.
 
I was going to suggest that Scotland should get its own language to... but sometimes, I think they already have!


Steve.
 
Police Scotland have just released a statement criticising the media coverage as portraying an image of Scotland as a country which is about to fall apart at the seams. They stated that whilst the debating had been robust, the vast majority of it has been good natured. They also criticised the no campaign for exaggerating claims of aggression.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics...-condemns-no-campaign-exaggerating-aggression
 
fracster said:
what has Hungary got to do with Russia anymore?
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Russia is Hungary's main trade partner and is their major source of energy.
They were one of very few countries that stood out against the EU sanctions against Russia.
The clearly feel tied to russia.
 
who will be invading them shortly, just as soon as they get done with ukraine (worryingly finland and alaska are also on that list)
 
Laudrup said:
The white paper has listed this Sterlingisation option and explained it. The key features would be:

- Limited role for central bank
- No change in currency
- Would not require a formal agreement with the UK
- Limited opportunity to provide liquidity to the financial system
- Full fiscal autonomy - alongside other economic levers (e.g. regulation)

A monetary union that is informal is most likely what would happen if there was a yes but you don't go into a negotiation arguing for second best from the start.
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So who is the Scottish lender of last resort in this hypothesis?
 
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I had a letter from some one in Scotland, which caused me to think about the future of Royal mail there.
The royal mail would love to be rid of the the obligation to meet the unitary pricing of mail to the highlands and Islands.
The population density in much of Scotland is so low it will never support an economic mail service.

Most of the private delivery services use royal mail to cover the "last mile"

It seems that this is one area where a divorce will greatly favour England.
 
Laudrup said:
The International Monetary Fund is one solution I've seen discussed.
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Does the IMF know? A quick bit of research would seem to show that would go against Article VI of the IMF's Articles of Agreement.
 
Dave1 said:
Does the IMF know? A quick bit of research would seem to show that would go against Article VI of the IMF's Articles of Agreement.
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From The Times:

The International Monetary Fund could become the lender of last resort should an independent Scotland adopt its own currency, according an eminent panel of economists.

Members of the Royal Society of Edinburgh and the British Academy considered options for the finance sector, assuming a ‘Yes’ vote in next September’s referendum.
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The Independent:

The IMF is the world's lender of last resort, where governments go when they cannot pay their debts. At one time or another most countries have been there - Britain knocked on the door of its smart Washington headquarters in the Seventies.
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Dave1 said:
Ah, the famous Yes "could" syndrome, but have you ever heard of a failing bank go knocking on the door of the IMF?
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Well you used the word 'hypothesis' so the best you can expect is what could happen not exactly what will happen. Looking at recent past examples like in Ireland the Bank of England would most probably have to step in someway as a lender of the last resort whether it wanted to or not if the Scottish economy was in trouble.
 
Bobsyeruncle said:
Police Scotland have just released a statement criticising the media coverage as portraying an image of Scotland as a country which is about to fall apart at the seams. They stated that whilst the debating had been robust, the vast majority of it has been good natured. They also criticised the no campaign for exaggerating claims of aggression.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics...-condemns-no-campaign-exaggerating-aggression
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That is a bit disingenuous. Since when does the police federation make statements on operational matters in behalf of the police. As far as I understand that was not the police saying that, it was a union member speaking on behalf of the federation.

The federation that loves to hate the Tories. They are not the same as the police.
 
dejongj said:
That is a bit disingenuous. Since when does the police federation make statements on operational matters in behalf of the police. As far as I understand that was not the police saying that, it was a union member speaking on behalf of the federation.

The federation that loves to hate the Tories. They are not the same as the police.
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He's not just a union member though, he's the Chairman. I'm sure he will be in touch with what the general feelings of police Scotland are.
 
Bobsyeruncle said:
He's not just a union member though, he's the Chairman. I'm sure he will be in touch with what the general feelings of police Scotland are.
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But he is not making an police statement, that was not the view of the Scottish police. That is the point. Whether he is or isn't in touch with general feelings is totally subjective. He is entitled to his opinion, however I'd never take a federation members opinion as an objective view. Remember pleb gate?
 
Police Scotland have just released a statement criticising the media coverage as portraying an image of Scotland as a country which is about to fall apart at the seams. They stated that whilst the debating had been robust, the vast majority of it has been good natured. They also criticised the no campaign for exaggerating claims of aggression.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics...-condemns-no-campaign-exaggerating-aggression
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Police Scotland didn't make any such statement. The Scottish Police Federation did. They are 2 different things.
 
Bobsyeruncle said:
Police Scotland have just released a statement criticising the media coverage as portraying an image of Scotland as a country which is about to fall apart at the seams. They stated that whilst the debating had been robust, the vast majority of it has been good natured. They also criticised the no campaign for exaggerating claims of aggression.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics...-condemns-no-campaign-exaggerating-aggression
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Of course as we all know the police never tell porkies

Oh wait is that not what happened recently at Westminster

Did they fail to see child abuse

Most police are fine but not all
 
Bobsyeruncle said:
Police Scotland The Scottish Police Federation have just released a statement criticising the media coverage as portraying an image of Scotland as a country which is about to fall apart at the seams. They stated that whilst the debating had been robust, the vast majority of it has been good natured. They also criticised the no campaign for exaggerating claims of aggression.
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Corrected that for you.

I have seen and personally been subjected to racism, intimidation & aggression over the last few weeks, I have also witnessed and seen other incidents - so no I do not feel it is exaggerated, it is very real and sad to say is likely to get worse
 
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Keith W said:
Corrected that for you.

I have seen and personally been subjected to racism, intimidation & aggression over the last few weeks, I have also witnessed and seen other incidents - so no I do not feel it is exaggerated, it is very real and sad to say is likely to get worse
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I really hope not

I am having a weeks Holiday from Saturday really wanted to go back too Scotland but very worried about the after effect either way

Keep safe :woot:
 
Just about to head into Perth City centre - to take my daughter to an appointment.

I've now discovered Salmond and the Yes mob are also here tonight at the concert hall

I'll need to hang about for an hour so may take the camera.
 
dinners said:
Just about to head into Perth City centre - to take my daughter to an appointment.

I've now discovered Salmond and the Yes mob are also here tonight at the concert hall

I'll need to hang about for an hour so may take the camera.
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Tonight would be a good opportunity to learn all about street photography :-)
 
I really should of taken this week off and gone to Scotland with my camera(s) "7 days" lost opportunity for a photobook. I've been that busy on other projects I couldn't of fitted it in.
 
I wonder what will happen about the security services- MI5, MI6 etc
Would Scotland do without?
What will happen about protecting the country from cyber threats?
What about extremists? Jihadists?
 
kendo1 said:
I wonder what will happen about the security services- MI5, MI6 etc
Would Scotland do without?
What will happen about protecting the country from cyber threats?
What about extremists? Jihadists?
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That's a very interesting one actually...to my mind nothing will happen to them as it would be to big of a risk and there's too much nationally sensitive information that such an organisation could ever be split up...lets face it you also need to look at some other specialist parts of the MOD such as Royal Marines, SAS and such, there not going to get split up either the Scotish would have to form their own departments and with the form of intelligence services develop there own relationships
 
kendo1 said:
I wonder what will happen about the security services- MI5, MI6 etc
Would Scotland do without?
What will happen about protecting the country from cyber threats?
What about extremists? Jihadists?
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We've got John Smeaton on standby.
 
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