Affordable Flash solutions..

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rob200sx

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Just wondering, I have a 430EX II & a 580EX II and I want add at least another 4 flashes and run the setup as two bunches of 3 flashes. Right now, I don't have the budget for another 4 430's or 580's. Are there any suitable alternatives? I'm not looking for power over long distances, these will be max 10 meters from the subject (cars)

I'm aware of other makes, Metz etc that are cheaper but I have no idea how good they actually are.

Cheers,
Rob
 
why not get studio flash, probably cheaper!
 
I would, but I need a truly portable system, which means something like the Ranger Quadra etc, that then puts the budget at around the £1500 mark which I am more than happy to spend, except the Mrs is not.
 
rob200sx said:
I would, but I need a truly portable system, which means something like the Ranger Quadra etc, that then puts the budget at around the £1500 mark which I am more than happy to spend, except the Mrs is not.
Click to expand...

Or the Lencarta Safari, with more power for a lot less money and with much cheaper accessories
 
Lencarta are very nice, but:

Flash and head are £750. Quadras start at about 1150.
Safaris are 600w/s, elis are 400w/s
The head is full sized, the quadra head is tiny and very light weight.
The battery pack weighs 4.7kg alone on the safari, the quadras weigh 1.4.
Remote power control on the quadra via skyport.
LED modelling light for video on the quadra that is usable from a battery.
Lencarta only goes down to one eight power.
Its an elinchrom made in switzerland, rather than a Chinese made and imported flash.

Having said that, they arent really comparable items to be honest, with widely differing specs.

I know where my money would go.
 
Kris said:
Lencarta are very nice, but:

Flash and head are £750. Quadras start at about 1150.
Safaris are 600w/s, elis are 400w/s
The head is full sized, the quadra head is tiny and very light weight.
The battery pack weighs 4.7kg alone on the safari, the quadras weigh 1.4.
Remote power control on the quadra via skyport.
LED modelling light for video on the quadra that is usable from a battery.
Lencarta only goes down to one eight power.
Its an elinchrom made in switzerland, rather than a Chinese made and imported flash.

Having said that, they arent really comparable items to be honest, with widely differing specs.

I know where my money would go.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't have said that the Safari head is full sized, it's about the same size as any of the Elinchrom studio generator heads, and weighs very little. The Quadra head is smaller but once you've bought and put on their adapter so that you can actually use it...

Safaris are a true 600Ws from either head, the Quadra is 2/3 - 1/3, so can only output 270Ws from one head

The Safari is limited to 3 stops adjustment to maintain colour temperature accuracy.

Is the Quadra actually made in Switzerland? And does it even matter?
Elinchrom is a reputable Swiss Company that makes many of its products abroad, to their own quality standards. Lencarta is a reputable English Company that does the same. What matters IMO is not where the products are assembled, but who designs them and the quality of the componants used.

See this photo and comments by Jonathan Ryan. It seems to me that for every happy pro using Elinchrom, you have another using Lencarta or Bowens, and vice versa.
 
You really cant compare the sizes of the Quadra and lencarta, as they are in totally different leagues. The Eli head weighs less than an sb900 for instance and fits in your pocket, or under a jacket if it starts to rain. If you are comparing a ranger with a lencarta, then maybe their sizes are comparable, but the ranger goes up to 1200w/s.

The OP said "but I need a truly portable system". My assistant can handhold the head with the battery over her shoulder quite comfortably, she couldn't do that with a safari.

The 1/8 power of a 600w/s would be too powerful for me in many instances, but could pull out a speedlite for that I guess.

Nope, the Eli gives a full 400w/s through one head. Only asymmetric if you have two heads.

The quadra is Swiss made. I have much cheap excellent Chinese stuff, but I can import that myself rather than through a UK distributor and their mark up.
 
Weight isn't an issue for me, when I said portable, I really meant that I need a lighting setup that doesn't rely on mains power, so I can take and use it anywhere.

And this is where the unknown comes into play, if I go all strobist and use a bunch of flashes mcNally style, then how many flashes at full power compare to say using the Lencarta system, it's 600w but with two heads the power is split, so 300w per head. Can 3 flashes compare to that?

Light output on the flashes is my concern
 
Doubtful.

More reliable sources than me tend to argue that speedlites are at the very most about 100w/s at full power, but then you cant use them continuously at full power cos they take too long to recharge, overheat and shut off. I don't think they are even that powerful. You also have the problem of fitting them inside a modifier.

Zack Arias did an interesting comparison recently:

http://www.zarias.com/where-hot-shoe-flashes-dare-not-go/
 
well for my two peneth, here an image i shot on saturday using just two sb600 flashheads. no big expensive items, and i'm happy with the outcome.

no doubt someone will tell me everything thats wrong with it, but given my limited budget it's the best i can do

I used some quadras and yes they were great, but i can't afford them so this is the best i can do

4468065558_d2b2fa8a27.jpg
 
Nothing at all.

But I assume this was taken in fairly subdued lighting? Maybe later in the day? Or in heavy shade?

If you want a more commercial, background underexposed look in sunlight, then you need the watt/secs for something like this...

http://www.flickr.com/photos/8279638@N05/4434787730/

Not everybody likes this look however, so horses for courses.
 
Have you thought about Canon 540EZ's? Don't have all the bells and whistles but a fairly respectable unit, shouldn't cost too much off eBay. Think I paid about £60 or something for my one. That's assuming you're going full manual rather than ETTL groups of course.
Pip
 
yep, i used the sun as the back light, and the heads from the front, with the model stood off slightly to the side, it's just all about planning.

agreed i'll never be able to take these to out power the sun, except for about 15mins during the rise and fall of the sun, but i have to work with what i have.

unless anyone wants to offer me a job! lol
 
The 540ez is a cracking unit.

Takes the powerpack from Pixel and yongnuo.
128th power.
head can tilt downwards for umbrella swivels that hold the umbrella straight.
Built like the proverbials.
Power saving mode wakes up with an rf602.
 
Pippy_Neville said:
Have you thought about Canon 540EZ's? Don't have all the bells and whistles but a fairly respectable unit, shouldn't cost too much off eBay. Think I paid about £60 or something for my one. That's assuming you're going full manual rather than ETTL groups of course.
Pip
Click to expand...

ahh good idea, thanks!

Hadn't given much thought to the pre-digital flashes. Yes, I'll be using them manually rather than relying on ETTL
 
Ok, I've decided to go studio lighting route with power supply.

I was set on the Safari 600 until I saw the Bowen's 400 kit which comes with....2x Flash Heads, 2x Reflectors, 2x Umbrellas, 2x Light Stands, 2x Power Leads, Sync Lead, Travelpak, Kit Bag

any reason why I shouldn't go for this? It's about £40 less than the safari
 
rob200sx said:
Ok, I've decided to go studio lighting route with power supply.

I was set on the Safari 600 until I saw the Bowen's 400 kit which comes with....2x Flash Heads, 2x Reflectors, 2x Umbrellas, 2x Light Stands, 2x Power Leads, Sync Lead, Travelpak, Kit Bag

any reason why I shouldn't go for this? It's about £40 less than the safari
Click to expand...
But how many flashes will you get from the Bowens?
 
Here's the info from their spec sheet

Typical Flashes (recycle time)

Ws 1 Head 2 Head
200 375 (2. sec) 185 (4 sec.)
250 300 (2.5 sec) 150 (5 sec.)
400 185 (4 sec.) 95 (8 sec.)
500 150 (5 sec.) 75 (10 sec.)
750 110 (7.5 sec.) 55 (15 sec.)
800 95 (8 sec.) 45 (16 sec.)
1000 75 (10 sec.) 38 (20 sec.)
1500 50 (15 sec.) 25 (30 sec.)


I couldn't find the equivalent info on the Safari though, it just says upto 1150 flashes.
 
My question was how many flashes to a charge, not the recycling times. A customer told me yesterday that he gets 40 flashes from the Bowens with his flash, which from the figures above I assume to be an 800 head, but I don't pesonally know whether that's right or not. That's why he's now bought a Safari, which produces 1150.

The Safari recycling times are on the website, 2 - 3.5 seconds
 
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