Where do the advanced go for higher learning

More on Tom Hunter
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00zt7ky

15 minute audio talk.

Tom Hunter's most famous image is of a young woman by a window, reading a letter. An infant in a bright red pullover lies nearby. It is called 'Woman reading a Possession Order'. Anyone who who has seen Vermeer's 'A Girl Reading at an Open Window' will recognise the composition immediately. It shares something of Vermeer's stillness and light, too. Yet Hunter's picture is that rare thing, a work of art that has caused something to happen. Or, rather, caused something not to happen. The young woman was a neighbour living in a squat, who had received an eviction order. The response to Hunter's photograph was so strong that the eviction did not take place. In this essay Hunter considers how his art, influenced by the old master Vermeer, can focus on real people and the issues affecting their lives.
 
Byker28i said:
Shame, because he is an advanced educator in the field. You might not like what he says or take his advice, but if you are interested in advanced courses these are generally the pointers you will be given. You won't have smoke blown up your backside, or just be praised which seems to be what you want, but you will be criticised, challenged, pushed to improve, directed and assisted.
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That is not the case at all. You see regardless of his experience he has a nasty habit of trolling my threads and being extremely disrespectful. His whole motive is to side track my thread as he has done once again as you all can see. Now my tread has turned into a personal attack on me and that is what he does every time. Please dont fall for his crap. I took all of the advice given here so I don't see how anyone could turn that around to where I am looking for praise or picking and choosing the advice I take. For these reasons he is the only one I do not want to hear from. But of course he can't just walk away and has to attack more as you see.
 
TheBigYin said:
Shayne, if you have an issue with David's post, that's what the forum's ignore function is for. But in my own personal opinion you'd be missing out, because his advice was absolutely "on the money". I've seen LOTS of your threads degenerate into slanging matches because you fail to approach things with an open mindset. Why have I seen them, when you mainly shoot "street" and I've very little interest in that genre... mainly because either you have reported someone for disagreeing with you "Quelle horreur !" - OR because you've descended to personal insults or name calling and been reported for it. If you ARE going to try for some form of advanced mentoring though, you're going to have to grow a far thicker skin and be ready to deal with far harsher criticism than you get on here - as it WON'T be tempered by the presence of the "nice shot" brigade.



Exactly - David's no-nonsense and forthright tone may not win him friends in certain parts, but, as a straight talking Northerner myself I find it refreshing - he's got nothing to prove, and nothing much to gain really by repeatedly trying to get you to open your mind - but he still trys... As I said earlier, if you really don't want to see his replys to your post, put him on ignore... but you'd do yourself a big favour if you'd drop the ego, open your mind, and actually listen and perhaps take on board or try and work with some of his points.

Either way, STOP THE FEUD, and THE RTM's of him. Ignore or Embrace, but the slanging matches stop.



@Pookeyhead - David - I think this may be a lost cause I'm afraid... maybe it's for the best to just not bother in certain cases.
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I appreciate your help but this is so one sided and if look at the threads he is in you will indeed see a pattern, a pattern of rude baiting comments from him that are in no way constructive. They are meant to start trouble with me and I fell for the bait more than once which I do realize and apologize. This is why I reported it but it seems that that isn't going to help here because of a preconceived idea of me and without looking at the facts (the actual comments) of the thread.
The rules clearly state that we should not be rude and be constructive with our comments so why do these rules not apply to him. I did nothing wrong here and only ask for help yet I become the one who once again gets attacked and belittled by even you, why because I have had enough of his bs and won't him to stop and play by the rules as everyone else does. Again, I did nothing wrong here and you should stick to the facts of this and only this thread before making such a harsh judgement. Thank you.
 
Ed Sutton said:
If you think you are beyond the beginner stage then you've probably got a good handle on the technicalities of making pictures. That's pretty simple. Progressing as a picture maker is more difficult because it's about understanding what you are trying to show and say. Figuring out where your vision lies and the best ways to get it across in photographs. One thing's for sure it isn't a steadily rising curve, it's a series of steps. Minor breakthroughs are made followed by periods of stagnation where you repeat what you have discovered followed by breakthroughs etc.

The advice offered here has been good. Look at as many good pictures of all sorts as you can, analyse them to see why they are good, what makes them work, how the 'golden rules' fit them (or not). But most of all you have to keep on taking lots and lots of pictures. You have to take pictures just to see what happens. Don't be afraid to make s*** pictures, because some of those might have a small something in them which you can pick out and develop to help you take the next step upwards.

The only way to improve your pictures is to make more.You don't take better photos sitting on your arse thinking about it or watching Youtube videos. You might get lots of ideas by looking at other people's pictures, by reading about the thought processes (rather than the techniques) of other photographers, artists, musicians, writers. But only by clicking that shutter will you really understand how and why it is important. Learning by doing. There's no other way. Painters don't just paint their masterpieces. They are forever sketching, doodling, playing around with visual ideas. Why? Not just to practice technique, but to keep their eyes and mind working.

Most importantly, as has already been advised, you have to learn how to dissect and analyse your own pictures. To find the weaknesses and strengths and work on them. If you can't be self-motivated, self-critical and self-reliant as an image maker then you're stuffed.
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Great advice, thank you. I think that I am at the point where I need really balance the studying with the technique to move past the point I am in now.
 
Byker28i said:
More on Tom Hunter
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00zt7ky

15 minute audio talk.

Tom Hunter's most famous image is of a young woman by a window, reading a letter. An infant in a bright red pullover lies nearby. It is called 'Woman reading a Possession Order'. Anyone who who has seen Vermeer's 'A Girl Reading at an Open Window' will recognise the composition immediately. It shares something of Vermeer's stillness and light, too. Yet Hunter's picture is that rare thing, a work of art that has caused something to happen. Or, rather, caused something not to happen. The young woman was a neighbour living in a squat, who had received an eviction order. The response to Hunter's photograph was so strong that the eviction did not take place. In this essay Hunter considers how his art, influenced by the old master Vermeer, can focus on real people and the issues affecting their lives.
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Wow I love it. You see this is the kind of learning that I really like. I did see the wonderful light here but did not see the significance of how she seems to be stopped in time.
I can look at art and see some of what makes it great but what I really need is for someone to explain it to me so that I see the whole situation.
So not only do I need to study art I need to do it with an educated person or in a course of some type.
Thanks again for all the help. Other than one negative this thread has been super helpful.
 
Byker28i said:
This is going the same way of many of his requests, where he has an idea of what he wants to hear and will dismiss anything outside that narrow criteria.

"We have moved past..." Comes across as very pretentious.
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Please refer to post 11. It is really not going that way. I politely disagreed with one persons opinion and when he didn't understand me I explained and ask another to please reframe from commenting because of how rude and personal they were being. If you look past the rude comments that are there to steer you away from the constructive conversation you will see that there is nothing pretentious about it and I took everyone's advice especially yours.
Again thanks for all the help I'm excited to put it to work.
 
Byker28i said:
This is going the same way of many of his requests, where he has an idea of what he wants to hear and will dismiss anything outside that narrow criteria.

"We have moved past..." Comes across as very pretentious.
Click to expand...

Please refer to post 11. It is really not going that way. I politely disagreed with one persons opinion and when he didn't understand me I explained and ask another to please reframe from commenting because of how rude and personal they were being. If you look past the rude comments that are there to steer you away from the constructive conversation you will see that there is nothing pretentious about it and I took everyone's advice especially yours.
Again thanks for all the help I'm excited to put it to work.
 
shaylou said:
I appreciate your help but this is so one sided and if look at the threads he is in you will indeed see a pattern, a pattern of rude baiting comments from him that are in no way constructive. They are meant to start trouble with me and I fell for the bait more than once which I do realize and apologize. This is why I reported it but it seems that that isn't going to help here because of a preconceived idea of me and without looking at the facts (the actual comments) of the thread.
The rules clearly state that we should not be rude and be constructive with our comments so why do these rules not apply to him. I did nothing wrong here and only ask for help yet I become the one who once again gets attacked and belittled by even you, why because I have had enough of his bs and won't him to stop and play by the rules as everyone else does. Again, I did nothing wrong here and you should stick to the facts of this and only this thread before making such a harsh judgement. Thank you.
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Shayne, It's pretty clear in the forum rules that moderation decisions are not open for discussion in the thread, but as you've taken the step to place them here, allow me to reciprocate.

let me make this very simple for you... USE THE IGNORE FUNCTION BECAUSE THE GENERAL CONSENSUS OF THE SITE STAFF IS THAT HE'S DONE NOTHING WRONG, AND THAT YOU NEED TO GROW A THICKER SKIN AND STOP OVER-REACTING AT EVERY PERCEIVED SLIGHT.

I have looked at many, many threads where you've over-reacted, spat your dummy out, had a childish temper tantrum and generally thrown your toys out of the pram because someone disagreed with you, or questioned your particular methods of working. I also refered to post 11, and post 12 that you decided to remove (yes, we get to see edited posts, so you cant behave like a tool, then hide it!). We HAVE read the comments in this thread (and others) and frankly, agree with them. We have also read threads where you have resulted to foul language and personal insults rather than either rational argument or reporting the transgressor.

And to be honest, we haven't made a harsh judgement yet. A harsh judgement would be to give you a couple of weeks holiday from the forum. Please don't make the situation escalate to this point. Again, I say, Use the Ignore Function, and address any further complaints about moderation decisions via the "contact us" option at the bottom of the screen.
 
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shaylou said:
That is not the case at all. You see regardless of his experience he has a nasty habit of trolling my threads and being extremely disrespectful. His whole motive is to side track my thread as he has done once again as you all can see. Now my tread has turned into a personal attack on me and that is what he does every time. Please dont fall for his crap. I took all of the advice given here so I don't see how anyone could turn that around to where I am looking for praise or picking and choosing the advice I take. For these reasons he is the only one I do not want to hear from. But of course he can't just walk away and has to attack more as you see.
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Do yourself a favour... put me on ignore before you have some kind of embolism. I'm not trolling you. I reply to threads I find interesting regardless of who authored them.

Take the moderator's advice... use the ignore function.
 
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Advanced photography is hard to define. What's perceived to be a simple technique by one individual may be more complex for someone to understand. In short take your knowledge from many sources and bind them together. It's the assembly of knowledge that combine to make an image, not all of it is relevant in every situation. In short, there is no one size fits all solution.
 
TheBigYin said:
Shayne, It's pretty clear in the forum rules that moderation decisions are not open for discussion in the thread, but as you've taken the step to place them here, allow me to reciprocate.

let me make this very simple for you... USE THE IGNORE FUNCTION BECAUSE THE GENERAL CONSENSUS OF THE SITE STAFF IS THAT HE'S DONE NOTHING WRONG, AND THAT YOU NEED TO GROW A THICKER SKIN AND STOP OVER-REACTING AT EVERY PERCEIVED SLIGHT.

I have looked at many, many threads where you've over-reacted, spat your dummy out, had a childish temper tantrum and generally thrown your toys out of the pram because someone disagreed with you, or questioned your particular methods of working. I also refered to post 11, and post 12 that you decided to remove (yes, we get to see edited posts, so you cant behave like a tool, then hide it!). We HAVE read the comments in this thread (and others) and frankly, agree with them. We have also read threads where you have resulted to foul language and personal insults rather than either rational argument or reporting the transgressor.

And to be honest, we haven't made a harsh judgement yet. A harsh judgement would be to give you a couple of weeks holiday from the forum. Please don't make the situation escalate to this point. Again, I say, Use the Ignore Function, and address any further complaints about moderation decisions via the "contact us" option at the bottom of the screen.
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I deleted that comment because it was a bad reaction on my part and I thought that was a good thing. I guess not. Thanks for your help.
 
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