Trigger help please

beyond the blue

beyond the blue

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Neil
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I have been doing some googling but to be honest the more I search the more confused I become. Scenario 1, I want to fire an off camera flash by radio with me pressing the camera release. Scenario 2, I want to fire both the camera and an off camera flash by radio. The distance involved won't be more than 10mtrs.
The bit I get confused over is that it seems that some can offer basic firing and some can send the camera settings to the flash for full ETTL function. Can anyone offer any advice or better still a decent make and model to look at (that won't break the bank)? I will be using a Nikon D90 and a Nissin Di622 Mk11 flash gun.
 
The cheapest way would be cheaper ettl triggers and a separate wireless cable release.

But the Pocketwizard flex system would do it all if I understand correctly, but they're pricey.
 
Your D90 can act as a commander unit to fire the Nissin with full remote TTL control. What's wrong with that? Or you can do it with cheap manual radio triggers, or expensive TTL radio triggers.

What do you want to do, and what's the budget?
 
HoppyUK said:
Your D90 can act as a commander unit to fire the Nissin with full remote TTL control.
Click to expand...

Richard
I wasn't aware that the Nissin can do that off camera!!! I know it can command it to fire via the built in flash but I thought only in a manual mode. Problem is I'm new to all this and the D90 manual doesn't tell me how to set the flash and the Nissin manual doesn't tell me how to set the D90 Now I'm really confused.
 
beyond the blue said:
Richard
I wasn't aware that the Nissin can do that off camera!!! I know it can command it to fire via the built in flash but I thought only in a manual mode. Problem is I'm new to all this and the D90 manual doesn't tell me how to set the flash and the Nissin manual doesn't tell me how to set the D90 Now I'm really confused.
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Set the camera's pop-up flash to commander mode, as per the handbook. Then just switch the flash to slave and it should do as it's told.
 
HoppyUK said:
Set the camera's pop-up flash to commander mode, as per the handbook. Then just switch the flash to slave and it should do as it's told.
Click to expand...

Try as I might I cant get it to work iTTL off camera. This is with the Nissin on the camera iTTL mode when it does it's zooming and exposure.

DSC_4279.jpg


This is with it off camera (you can see it on the cabinet) set to slave mode, it doesn't zoom in or out or ever alter the exposure.

DSC_4277.jpg
 
Well it seems to have fired and made a tolerable job of exposure where the light is falling. What did you expect it to do differently?

You need to set the zoom manually. When the flash is off-camera the zoom setting of the lens is irrelevant. Outdoors you'll find the sensor on the flash needs to have line of sight of the pop-up, especially in daylight, though it usually doesn't matter too much indoors.
 
HoppyUK said:
Well it seems to have fired and made a tolerable job of exposure where the light is falling. What did you expect it to do differently?

You need to set the zoom manually. When the flash is off-camera the zoom setting of the lens is irrelevant. Outdoors you'll find the sensor on the flash needs to have line of sight of the pop-up, especially in daylight, though it usually doesn't matter too much indoors.
Click to expand...

I expected it to work exactly as it does when it's on the camera if like you say it's recieving full TTL information albeit from a different position. Why does the zoom function of the flash not work when it's off camera the same as it does when it's on camera if it's recieving full TTL info?
 
beyond the blue said:
I expected it to work exactly as it does when it's on the camera if like you say it's recieving full TTL information albeit from a different position. Why does the zoom function of the flash not work when it's off camera the same as it does when it's on camera if it's recieving full TTL info?
Click to expand...

Because the zoom function uses the focal length to change the shape of the beam to match the lens field of view.
Once the flash is off camera that assumption can't be made. The camera would have to know the precise distance between the flash and subject. And even then it'd be assuming you had no modifier in place and you definitely wanted that shape coverage.

Bearing in mind that we take the flash off camera to control the shape of the light, the auto zooming would just be a pain in the a......
 
Forgot to mention the obvious.

Flashguns fail to auto zoom as soon as you tilt the head when camera mounted. For the same reason. ie they have no way of working out how far the beam now has to travel.
 
Being as though I can't see a way of altering the zoom angle of the flash when it's off camera, am I right in thinking I'm only ever going to get the light patern as shown in the bottom photo.
 
I don't have that flash, so I have no idea whether you can zoom it manually? Have you checked the manual?

Usually when we take the flash off camera the next step is to use a light modifier of some sort. what are your plans? what sort of light do you want to achieve? umbrella, snoot, softbox, beauty dish? at the very least I'd bounce it off a reflector, wall or ceiling.
 
beyond the blue said:
Being as though I can't see a way of altering the zoom angle of the flash when it's off camera, am I right in thinking I'm only ever going to get the light patern as shown in the bottom photo.
Click to expand...

Nissin Di622 defaults to 35mm (on full frame) lens coverage in slave mode - about 55 degrees side to side. According to the user manual ;)

Going back to the OP, you mention 10m range. That's a long way in flash terms so brightness will be low, bearing in mind the inverse square law that says when the distance is doubled, the brightness is reduced to one quarter.
 
I'll add that the lighting pattern is also all over the place on that picture due to the shadows caused by the position of the flash, you're not even close to seeing the actual beam of the flash as lots of it is up the wall and it's being eaten in the vase etc on the left. there's 2 problems with that which you should bear in mind:
1, you will always get shadows on your subject from anything between the light source and the subject.
2, if you're using ettl, having objects at all those varying distances will create nightmares for metering.

It is all really straightforward if you start simply, but you're inadvertantly making things more complicated by cutting corners. That flash on a stand bounced off the ceiling or shot through a brolly would light that chair fine. There's a 'one light only' thread here somewhere that'll show you what can be done with very basic equipment.
 
if you want the cheap method, 7dayshop do a wireless flash trigger that doubles as a camera trigger as well, but its not iTTL, but they are much cheaper than pocketwizards.
They have 16 channels and work upto ( so they say) 100m.
I have two , and can trigger the camera and flash remotly or two flashes from the camera.
I use these as a remote all the time, better than wired and IR, especially if shooting wildlife.
 
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