Suggestions for tackling scenes with a wide dynamic range

[martin.]

Tldr: see attached photos, Bride and groom will be at the window, very wide dynamic range - any suggestions ?
;-)

Hi,
My cousin and his fiance are getting married and having a small, intimate ceremony and dinner at the village hall near where they live. It's got a nice view, but its quite a challenging venue for a relative newbie like myself.
They've asked me as they are working to a very tight budget (and I'm free of charge), and they know I'm a keen photographer, but I did make it very very clear to them that there is a massive difference between someone who likes to take photos and a professional photographer who makes a living out of coping with, and moreso exploiting challenging light conditions. They responded that they want to keep this very informal. I initially thought I'd feel less pressure as its only family (about 35 people or so), but that's certainly not how I am feeling now as the weight of their expectations (and my own) weigh down on me, I really don't want to mess this up.

I visited the venue this week to see what it looked like, and it triggered some alarm bells in my head.
Here’s the setup - I had a few mins to take some photos earlier this week while the B&G talked to the caterers. During the ceremony itself, the bride and groom will be towards the front of the room, near the window (see photos).
Photo 1 is taken from the back of room without any flash, exposing for the scenery outside. (Obviously, it looks dark, as I've exposed for outside.
Photo 2 is taken from the back of the room, increasing the ISO, but with no flash
Photo 3 is taken from the back of the room, with a flash bounced off a wall/ceiling near the front left (see next photo for context). Stupidly, I left the ISO quite high so its too bright outside. But more worryingly, I am getting reflections on the glass from the bounced flashlight.
Photo 4 is looking from the front window back into the room, and where the "aisle" will be on the day… (and you can see the wall on the camera-right side, where I bounced the speedlight off). The room obviously won't look like this on the wedding day itself.

Thankfully, there should be enough room for me to stand near the window and take photos of the groom waiting at the front, and the bridal party as they walk up the aisle. The room is relatively bright, and I shouldn’t have a problem shifting ISO in order to expose correctly for the bridal party as they walk up the aisle.

However, I think it's going to be v challenging to take any photos from the back of the room without blowing out the background, or converting my b&g into a silhouette. I'll obviously take one of each as I like those effects, but I am also thinking that I should add off camera flash for some shots (crucially, as the married couple walk back down the aisle together) in order to reduce the dynamic range. But reflections from the glass windows then come into play.

Available equipment: Godox AD360ii, Aperlite speedlights (2), yongnuo triggers (2),a 60x60cm softbox, a 109cm reflective white umbrella, a 120cm cheapo octabox, and a flash bender with diffusion panel (+ lightstands with counterweights). NB The gear list suggests I am way more competent than I actually am as a photographer.

I don't plan on taking all this gear, but thankfully, once we're in the venue, we're there for the rest of the day, so I don't have to lug anything anywhere. And I have some time to set things up before guests arrive (theoretically, anyway).

Questions
Q1. What lighting setup would you recommend in order to properly illuminate the bride and groom, when taking a shot from the back of the room ? (light placement, and preferred modifier(s)?
Q2. What gels should i use on the flashes if we get late afternoon sunshine coming in the window ? I'm guessing I should use, say 1/2 CTO or full CTO gels on any flashes, and switch the camera white balance to sunny. Does that seem a smart assumption? (FYI - The venue has ceiling downlighters, but I'm going to ask them to switch them off as its perfectly bright enough in the room. And i'm also practicing for a rainy day as well)

Q3. Dinner is going to be served in the adjacent conservatory - with almost exactly the same lighting challenges, but now there's no ceiling to reliably bounce light off, as its all glass.The bride and groom will be sat nearest the window, looking into the room towards their family (I didn’t choose the seating plan!). They've hinted that they would like a photo of them sat at the table at sunset. I told them it was outwith my capabilities as I'm definitely NOT a professional.
That said, I'd like to at least try.
My initial thought was to use a softbox at 45 degrees or so (in order to try to reduce reflections). Then I thought, perhaps I should ditch the flash altogether, and instead ask the couple to sit perfectly still and try a bracketed exposure and sort out in lightroom. I'm not at all sure. So....
So, my question is. …for the dinner table shots, what lighting setup (or not), would you recommend ?

I'm going to practice this weekend in my brother's conservatory (glass windows in a south facing garden), but I’d love to hear your thoughts.

I apologise for the longest post ever.

Thanks,

Martin.

 

[Scirocco_09]

It's difficult to answer all your questions but photos 2,3 and 4 are fairly well exposed so that's all they can ask if they aren't paying you. You may not be able to use flash during the ceremony so be ready to shoot wide open at high ISO depending on light. I'm not a wedding photographer but I've not seen any using off camera flash for the B&G walking down the isle, although that's not to say it can't be done, but best keep it simple and people may rearrange your gear if it's in the way. It's hard to get a feel of the place from these but a 24-70mm f2.8 lens could be useful as it looks a small venue - wide aperture, shutter speed of 1/250, auto ISO and a flash on TTL mode with a Garry Fong type diffuser may light things ok. But honestly I think you should back out, you clearly aren't skilled enough at this stage to handle it and you're going to feel under a lot of pressure especially when you have to arrange group photos, big mistakes can happen with nerves. I just hope you haven't bought any equipment for this as so often happens when asked to shoot for free

 

[martin.]

Hi scirocco, thanks for the advice and comments.
I have to agree with you - i'm definitely not skilled enough at this stage, but i also can't really back out - it's only a couple of weeks away and they don't have it in their budget for a professional photographer (you can see from the photos that its not an extravagant venue).
If i backed out now, i think it would be excommunicated from the family (admittedly, no bad thing at times, haha) but that's assuming the bride-to-be left me in possession of my genitals.
Also, i've been brutally honest with them in my photographic limitations. When they first asked me, I tried to persuade them to use a couple of photographers who i know can do far better work...But we are where we are.

Re: flash. Its an informal setup, and i've checked there is no issue. Personally, I have no desire to use flash as they walk back down the aisle, but i just think the other two options are not ideal (ie silhouette or blown out background), but then again, i'm probably overcomplicating things - they'd likely be happy with either.
I also like the point about people rearranging my gear - i hadnt considered it , so will plant my girlfriend at its side.

thanks,
m.

 

[Scirocco_09]

Fair enough, just remember all you can do is your best and don't overthink it - what you plan to happen often won't so you'll need to go with the flow and be prepared to react. I shoot conferences and other events and once you're up to speed settings are a doddle - the correct exposure for the couple is the main thing, and maybe this will help a bit: http://expertphotography.com/how-to-fill-flash/

I suppose if they are wanting you to do it and you've told them not to expect much they can't value photography highly anyway. Try and enjoy as best as you can and don't spend hours editing, remember you're getting nothing out of this but stress. You could pretend your camera has broken if you really want to get out of it

 

[martin.]

@Scirocco_09 thanks for the link - that's a good one. In fact, as you can see from my third photo (with flash) I stupidly left the ISO high, which blew out the background a bit (which was the main thing i was trying to avoid, in using flash). I'm guessing its precisely the type of mistake an amateur makes, as they are simply incapable of reacting quickly enough to different lighting conditions as they have no acquired "memory muscle" (or whatever the term is) that they've built up over time.

tbh, i think you're right in your assessment about the couple - they're the least bridezilla people you can imagine, and they don't seem to really value photography, which is a plus for me. I think its likely my own expectations and ego that's causing me grief as i enjoy photography, and always want to be better (who doesnt, i guess?). And i genuinely to do want to the very best i can for them as we have a small family.

On the plus side, i know i will not be repeating this type of situation - its just a wee bit too stressful to be fun.

thanks for your help,
m.

 

[HoppyUK]

Just some quick comments, having glanced at the venue pics.

Flash-in flash is the obvious answer and that ceiling looks good for bouncing. You could use a Stofen (diffuser cap) or a simple bounce-card for a combination of soft bounce light and also a direct-fill component to lift shadows under eyes and chins (and hats!) and put a sparkle in the eyes. To avoid reflections off the glass, don't shoot square-on to it.

Having said that, the view outside doesn't do much for me, from what what we can see of it. I just see a wire fence and a rather ordinary looking gate. But on the other hand, with the windows over-exposed I can just image a rather attractive shot of a back-lit bride Maybe a dash of fill-in flash to taste. Or use a reflector - one of those cheap white/silver fold-up ones, held by an assistant/guest.

Try and get along there again, and take a model with you or get a member of staff to stand in. Try a few options. Check time of day, position of the sun through windows etc.

As wedding venues go, it looks fairly benign to me Good luck!

 

[martin.]

hi, i just wanted to thank you both for talking some sense into me.
i realise i've blown this out of proportion.
i) there's no need to make this complicated by introducing different modifiers and god knows what else
ii) even if i do screw up, no one can say i didnt warn them

cheers for the wakeup call.

m.

PS @HoppyUK Most venues probably look benign to a jedi master, but sadly, to me, the venue looks a bit different. I dunno if you can make it out in the photo, but under the sofa, there's a man with a baseball bat growling at me. ;-)

 

[HoppyUK]

hi, i just wanted to thank you both for talking some sense into me.
i realise i've blown this out of proportion.
i) there's no need to make this complicated by introducing different modifiers and god knows what else
ii) even if i do screw up, no one can say i didnt warn them

cheers for the wakeup call.

m.

PS @HoppyUK Most venues probably look benign to a jedi master, but sadly, to me, the venue looks a bit different. I dunno if you can make it out in the photo, but under the sofa, there's a man with a baseball bat growling at me. ;-)

I don't do weddings, even though I'd rather like to. The pressure would do me in too, even though they're quite an easy job photographically speaking, on a decent day - at least to get a passable set of memories. The professionals that manage to pull out some amazing shots in difficult conditions with big time pressures have my enduring respect. I'm going to a wedding tomorrow as it happens and though the church and reception venue are both beautiful, the forecast is horrible all day. I shall be spectating from a safe distance and counting my blessings.

If you're the anxious type, do go along there again, as suggested above, and scout some good locations, note the techniques to use and settings that will work in all conditions - at this time of year the light will be fading by late afternoon. Nail half a dozen set pieces and you're golden Then when the pressure's off, you can fill in the gaps at your own pace.

ps I know it's only a small do, but if you don't know all the guests, find someone who does and get them to help you with the herding (before they get to the bar).

 

[metroman]

Hello Martin and I feel your anxiety! I get myself worked up at the prospect of "delivering" when being asked to do a shoot or an event. If this helps, I generally shoot on location and cart a stand and softbox around with me but last weekend I stuck my SB800 flash on top of my Nikon D700 and used the swivel / bounce method and it gave me some pleasing results. Have another "dry run", take someone with you so that at least you have someone in the frame. I'm off on another shoot today and have every intention of using the same method.


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