Subscription based is the way to makey money online

[hashcake]

I'm sure I'm not the only one who has noticed the range of subscription based products we can now buy online,
It's obvious that a lot if companies have jumped on this bandwagon and every day it seems that something else new comes along.
My gripe is software, I want to buy it, not pay a yearly subscription.
Even lastpass have jumped on this and I've used it for well over ten years.
When Windows 8 was released, Stardock released Start 8 (which is now Start 10), it a small app that gives the look of a traditional Windows start menu.
Updating to the Windows 10 version was free as are all updates.
I would not have complained if I had to pay again for a newer edition as I think it's worth the money.
Adobe have been very clever with their liscensing model, the subscriptions for Photoshop alone must make them millions from graphics designers.
Then we comes to Lighroom which seems to be the main choice for amateur photographers.
I know there are other post processing applications that seem to be good value for money but most people I know who have used them end up going back to Lightroom and now paying for a monthly / yearly subscription.
Back in the day, I would always use a pirated copy of an application if it was being sold for a ridiculous price but as I've gotten older my attitude has changed.
I've been using Steinberg Cubase since way before the PC version was released (Atari back then) and every year they will offer me the latest version for a very good price.
They have a few versions of Cubase which makes the Elements version the cheapest and very popular for amateur home musicians
I moved back to using Norton Antivirus when they finally sorted it out some years ago and it seems like they are going to be subscription based as well.
Ring have had people by the short and curlys because you have to subscribed to their cloud service to back up any videos rather than allow storage being done via a local hard drive.
I can fully understand companies do this with the business customers I don't think it's far one the average hobbyist.
Perhaps it's my age as a few other people in my generation have said the same.

 

[Sky]

I agree with you Darran. I'm happy to pay for software I use that is sensibly priced and have done for the last thirty years or so.

Like you, in the early days when money was tight I'd use a pirate copy until I could afford to buy a genuine copy - free trials were rarely available then.

I think these companies are just going to drive people back to piracy with these subscription only tactics.

 

[hashcake]

Maybe the people that bought pirated software should take responsibility for their own actions.

I don't think it's had much effect on the market over the years, Microsoft have done very well with Windows despite every version being pirated.
The same applies to Adobe and others.

 

[ecoleman]

You steal other peoples software and then moan because they put a licensing model in to prevent it?

as for Ring, they don’t have you by the short and curly. You don’t need a door bell that connects to your phone, you just want one, so pay for it. Who else is going to pay for that storage?

£10 a month for Adobe software is nothing to spend on a hobby. Try motorsport, modelling, coin/stamp collecting and if you really can’t afford it, there are free options available.

 

[troutfisher]

£10 a month for Adobe software is nothing to spend on a hobby. Try motorsport, modelling, coin/stamp collecting and if you really can’t afford it, there are free options available.

It equates to a cup of coffee a week.
It costs a non member about a tenner to visit an NT or Eng Heritage property and more to visit places like Chatsworth or Alnwick

 

[hashcake]

You steal other peoples software and then moan because they put a licensing model in to prevent it?

as for Ring, they don’t have you by the short and curly. You don’t need a door bell that connects to your phone, you just want one, so pay for it. Who else is going to pay for that storage?

£10 a month for Adobe software is nothing to spend on a hobby. Try motorsport, modelling, coin/stamp collecting and if you really can’t afford it, there are free options available.

I'm talking about very long time ago, I've been buying software for years.
My point about Ring is that you need to have a subscription to back up to rather than local storage.

 

[john.margetts]

It equates to a cup of coffee a week.
It costs a non member about a tenner to visit an NT or Eng Heritage property and more to visit places like Chatsworth or Alnwick

But if I don't want coffee this week I am not obliged to have one. I can have tea for a change, or lemonade, or water - or I can just go without. With Adobe, you are obliged to pay for that coffee every week regardless of what you actually drink.

 

[ecoleman]

But if I don't want coffee this week I am not obliged to have one. I can have tea for a change, or lemonade, or water - or I can just go without. With Adobe, you are obliged to pay for that coffee every week regardless of what you actually drink.

you are not obligated to use Adobes software or backup your ring doorbell stuff. Plenty of free software about and a good old standard doorbell works perfectly well I’m my house to let me know when somebodies at the door. If I’m out, tough luck.

 

[ferjphoto]

Subscription is a choice. I choose to subscribe to Adobe but not to a ring doorbell. I pay to subscribe to a guitar app, Netflix and Disney. I've no issue in subscribing if it is a service or product that offers value to me or my family.

It does add up, but that's my choice. I'd have never been able to but photoshop each year at £600+ and I'll probably cancel the guitar app and move to a tutor in the future!

 

[john.margetts]

you are not obligated to use Adobes software or backup your ring doorbell stuff. Plenty of free software about and a good old standard doorbell works perfectly well I’m my house to let me know when somebodies at the door. If I’m out, tough luck.

No, I am not obliged to use Adobe products and don't. My point was regarding the subscription cost of Adobe products just being the price of a cup of coffee each week. Once I subscribe, I am committed to that cup of coffee each week for a year which is a lot more expensive than just a cup of coffee.

 

[cambsno]

Subscription has made many things affordable for many. They may not have £200 to spend on the software but do have £10 a month available. If you want it, you pay for it, no-one is forcing you to!

I did use a dodgy copy of LR in the past but the new model makes it worthwhile doing it properly.

 

[Ricardodaforce]

Apple TV+
Amazon Prime
Audible
Hello Fresh
Apple Music
Disney+
Readly

Yep, I’m a subscriber.

 

[JonathanRyan]

On the contrary I (now) like the subscription model. Tenner or so a month vs £750 initial purchase and then £250 every other year is how I remember Adobe charging. Even better there's no argument with my accountant about whether it's a capital investment or revenue spend The only bit I didn't like is when they wrote off all the money I'd ever paid them and treated me like a brand new subscriber

£90 for Office instead of eye watering every so often. Game Pass at a tenner. Spotify, Virgin Media, Prime, Netflix, Smol, Training Peaks. Now I think about it, I spend a *lot* on subscriptions....

 

[AndrewFlannigan]

Why not just use open source software? If you're reading this post, the chances are very high that it's brought to you largely or entirely by open source tools. Even Microsoft has jumped on the bandwagon, so why not you? Microsoft and open source - Wikipedia

 

[JonathanRyan]

Why not just use open source software? If you're reading this post, the chances are very high that it's brought to you largely or entirely by open source tools. Even Microsoft has jumped on the bandwagon, so why not you? Microsoft and open source - Wikipedia

Free as in "you are free to do this" or free as in beer....? For extra credit we could argue about whether VSCode (made by that money grabbing Microsoft EvilCorp) is free (it is), open source (kinda - but not the version most people use) or just an evil attempt at crushing Sublime by choking off their $80 license for some software that's actually pretty good.

BTW @hashcake - there was some troubling news in the week about tracking code within LastPass - if you're fond of it, you may find it worth paying for 1Password or swap to Keepass (which is both free and open source).

LastPass Android App Has Seven Trackers That Chase Users On Web (latesthackingnews.com) (the really troubling bit is that Lastpass have no idea what they do)

 

[hashcake]

Apple TV+
Amazon Prime
Audible
Hello Fresh
Apple Music
Disney+
Readly

Yep, I’m a subscriber.

TV based subscriptions has been the norm for a very long time but I am not talking about this.
My point was about software and hardware that requires a subscription.

 

[hashcake]

BTW @hashcake - there was some troubling news in the week about tracking code within LastPass - if you're fond of it, you may find it worth paying for 1Password or swap to Keepass (which is both free and open source).

LastPass Android App Has Seven Trackers That Chase Users On Web (latesthackingnews.com) (the really troubling bit is that Lastpass have no idea what they do)

Thanks for the heads up, I'll check them out.

 

[hashcake]

You steal other peoples software and then moan because they put a licensing model in to prevent it?

as for Ring, they don’t have you by the short and curly. You don’t need a door bell that connects to your phone, you just want one, so pay for it. Who else is going to pay for that storage?

£10 a month for Adobe software is nothing to spend on a hobby. Try motorsport, modelling, coin/stamp collecting and if you really can’t afford it, there are free options available.

Again, I was talking a long time ago with regard to pirated software.
Yet again you are missing my point, there is a difference between actually buying software rather than used a subscription based software.
With regard to Ring my point is that you have to pay a subscription to use there hardware.
I know all about the costs of other hobbies, I'm not a clueless 5 year old.

 

[gman]

I resisted Adobe subscriptions for as long as possible, but relented just recently and got the LR/PS bundle. I don't mind now as I guess it will always be up-to-date with the latest features and so long as I can get the desktop version of LR rather than the cloud based thingy then I'm happy.

For me the downside to subscriptions is that once you've become comfortable it's a bit of a bummer when they hike the price. Netflix for example, I've gone from £9.99 to £13.99 over what feels like a relatively short space of time, although I think the £9.99 to £10,99 was a while ago and then a big jump to £13.99 just recently. I've got shares in them though, so I guess you win some and lose some lol

I would assume that subscription based models must make piracy more difficult?

 

[hashcake]

I would assume that subscription based models must make piracy more difficult?

Am I correct in thinking that with the subscription it also lets you donwload the desktop version as well?
I don't and wont touch it but I know Lightroom V10 is all over the torrent sites.

 

[hashcake]

Why not just use open source software? If you're reading this post, the chances are very high that it's brought to you largely or entirely by open source tools. Even Microsoft has jumped on the bandwagon, so why not you? Microsoft and open source - Wikipedia

Again, my point is that I am happy to pay for commercial software, I just don't like the idea of it being subscipton based.

 

[hashcake]

Maybe the people that bought pirated software should take responsibility for their own actions.

How about engaging in the conversation rather than just being a troll?

 

[gman]

Am I correct in thinking that with the subscription it also lets you donwload the desktop version as well?
I don't and wont touch it but I know Lightroom V10 is all over the torrent sites.

I'm not sure, but I have to be logged in and connect to the Adobe servers to even start LR. I suppose it could be hacked and blocked or something, but then like Windows will it not do a verification check in order to get updates?

 

[hashcake]

I suppose it could be hacked and blocked or something, but then like Windows will it not do a verification check in order to get updates?

I can certainly understand as to why Lightroom wants to connect to Adobe servers for a verification check plus as you know, it will allow you to apply updates.
With Windows 10 it is a little bit odd as I have read that pirated copies of Windows 10 still allow the updates.

 

[ecoleman]

Am I correct in thinking that with the subscription it also lets you donwload the desktop version as well?
I don't and wont touch it but I know Lightroom V10 is all over the torrent sites.

Much of the software found on torrent sites are just vehicles for Viruses, Spyware and Malware. It may or may not work but the people making it available for download don't care as long as people are stupid enough to download and install it along with their dubious additions.

I'd rather pay £10/month

 

[MartynK]

Free as in "you are free to do this" or free as in beer....? For extra credit we could argue about whether VSCode (made by that money grabbing Microsoft EvilCorp) is free (it is), open source (kinda - but not the version most people use) or just an evil attempt at crushing Sublime by choking off their $80 license for some software that's actually pretty good.

BTW @hashcake - there was some troubling news in the week about tracking code within LastPass - if you're fond of it, you may find it worth paying for 1Password or swap to Keepass (which is both free and open source).

LastPass Android App Has Seven Trackers That Chase Users On Web (latesthackingnews.com) (the really troubling bit is that Lastpass have no idea what they do)

Just as a matter of interest, is this possible vulnerability restricted to the Android app?

 

[hashcake]

Much of the software found on torrent sites are just vehicles for Viruses, Spyware and Malware. It may or may not work but the people making it available for download don't care as long as people are stupid enough to download and install it along with their dubious additions.

I'd rather pay £10/month

Antivirus software can often see some code that is similiar to malware / spyware used with pirated versions of software.
A very long time ago when I did use pirated software, you knew which release groups to trust as there are unwritted rules for this.
I'm glad your happy to pay £10 per month but I would be happy to pay £100 to own the software.

 

[hashcake]

On the contrary I (now) like the subscription model. Tenner or so a month vs £750 initial purchase and then £250 every other year is how I remember Adobe charging. Even better there's no argument with my accountant about whether it's a capital investment or revenue spend The only bit I didn't like is when they wrote off all the money I'd ever paid them and treated me like a brand new subscriber

£90 for Office instead of eye watering every so often. Game Pass at a tenner. Spotify, Virgin Media, Prime, Netflix, Smol, Training Peaks. Now I think about it, I spend a *lot* on subscriptions....

I can totally understand the subscription based idea allowing people to use very expensive software such as Photoshop and I guess there are a lot more photographers using it these days.
I also pay for Amazon Prime as it's a no brainer for me because it's a 'service' just like TV streaming or online gaming.
Via my sisters Sky subscription I also have access to Netflix, again, another service.
I'm not against subscription based software, far from it but it would be also be nice to have the option to pay outright for the software.

 

[AndrewFlannigan]

Again, my point is that I am happy to pay for commercial software, I just don't like the idea of it being subscipton based.

Fair enough. By pointing out an alternative, I was hoping to help any reader who is currently unaware of the substantial library of open source material.

 

[gman]

I can certainly understand as to why Lightroom wants to connect to Adobe servers for a verification check plus as you know, it will allow you to apply updates.
With Windows 10 it is a little bit odd as I have read that pirated copies of Windows 10 still allow the updates.

I can't but wonder just how much control a piece of spyware, virus etc would have if it can be integrated within the OS via a pirate copy? Would antivirus catch it if it's already there from the beginning built into the OS?

 

[ancient_mariner]

I should be happy to pay a 1 off fee of, say, £100 or so to use LR as a standalone program that gets a few minor updates and fixes in the first year, but I don't want all the rest that makes it apparently good value. I quite see why a sub model works for some, but not for me.

To me, it makes me *feel* much more inclined towards piracy than being able to buy outright, because I would know the software wouldn't call home.

 

[hashcake]

I can't but wonder just how much control a piece of spyware, virus etc would have if it can be integrated within the OS via a pirate copy? Would antivirus catch it if it's already there from the beginning built into the OS?

A lot of people are unaware that there is tracking and phone home built into Windows 10.

Spybot Anti-Beacon - Spybot Anti-Malware and Antivirus

Spybot – Search & Destroy offers a comprehensive set of functions and tools. This one is about preventing your data being sent out without your consent.

www.safer-networking.org

 

[gman]

I should be happy to pay a 1 off fee of, say, £100 or so to use LR as a standalone program that gets a few minor updates and fixes in the first year, but I don't want all the rest that makes it apparently good value. I quite see why a sub model works for some, but not for me.

To me, it makes me *feel* much more inclined towards piracy than being able to buy outright, because I would know the software wouldn't call home.

I'd be wondering more about who the pirated software is calling! Lol

I'm not particular keen on being connected to Adobe servers all the time, and when looking at my task manager there's a lot of Adobe stuff going on. But I guess I've got lots of stuff connecting out from Windows to Xbox, Steam, Nvidia, Antivirus etc.

 

[Retune]

Subscriptions are charged simply because the companies have realised they will make more money this way. Piracy is a red herring. Adobe CC has been cracked, just as CS was. But lots of legitimate customers were skipping Adobe updates, because they didn't care about the latest 'features', which was very bad for Adobe's bottom line. The rental scheme has put an end to that. And now Adobe are cutting off their old customers by refusing to activate versions of CS before CS4, and removing the activation-free special installers they previously provided for CS2 and CS3. Think of that 'perpetual licence' for any product that requires online activation as a perishable good. Affinity doesn't require it, so you can carry on using their stuff as long as your OS supports the software. And of course in the Free and Open Source Software world nobody can take the code away from you, and if the developers decide to take the project off in some strange direction (XFree86, Gnome 3, Unity) or it's acquired by a shark like Oracle (Java, MySQL, OpenOffice) you can generally rely on someone forking the code or making something better and continuing elsewhere (Xorg, MATE, Cinnamon, OpenJDK, MariaDB, LibreOffice).

MS Office is going in the same direction as CC, but for now you can still buy a non-subscription version and re-install the old ones (if you can find the installers). MS does at least bundle competitively-priced cloud storage with their 365 package. Amazon keeps trying to shove Prime down my throat, which makes me even less keen to subscribe (though I buy so much stuff from them it might actually make sense). TV subscriptions are all very well, but the small proportion of watchable content seems to be spread across more and more services every year - there are things I'd like to see on Netflix, NowTV/Sky, Prime and Disney Plus, as well as free to air TV, but I can't subscribe to everything. There is at least a lot of overlap between the music streaming services, so you probably only need one, though I haven't signed up yet (I'm the sort of dinosaur who still buys CDs and one-off downloads).