Spot lighting

Steve

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Bit of a noob question.

I love the Hollywood glamour 1950s style portraits.

For the spot lighting with hard edges, do I really need a fresnel, or can I replicate this with something cheaper like a snood or something?

Lencarata do what seems to be a reasonably priced fresnel...has anyone any experience of using one for this kind of portraiture?

Thanks
 
...can I replicate this with something cheaper like a snood or something?

I use a Fresnel quite a lot but my shot which more often gets compared to classic Hollywood stylee was actually shot with a small gridded beauty dish:

beautydish.jpg
 
Yes, to get close to that style, you need a fresnel spot.

The thing about the fresnel is that it is bright in the centre and then becomes darker towards the edges, and the fall off of light is very even, and is adjustable.

A honeycombed reflector (of any type) produces fairly even illumination over the whole lit area, and then falls off very abruptly and unevenly
 
I use a fresnel quite often - although I use a continuos ARRI light instead of a modifier on a studio head. I think (and its only my opinion) for these sort of lights its a better option.

I do think for a budget friendly option, a gridded reflector of beauty dish is a viable option.
 
I am another that uses the ARRI for this rather than a flash one, do like it for this style, as can get nice shallow DoF :)
 
I use a Fresnel quite a lot but my shot which more often gets compared to classic Hollywood stylee was actually shot with a small gridded beauty dish:

beautydish.jpg

Keith,

This is simply beautiful.... a wonderful photo.

Was this a 3 light setup? Just trying to deconstruct it in my head to understand how it was created.
 
Thanks for the advice everyone.

I will certainly try the honeycomb reflector/beauty dish option before a fresnel.
 
Yes, to get close to that style, you need a fresnel spot.

The thing about the fresnel is that it is bright in the centre and then becomes darker towards the edges, and the fall off of light is very even, and is adjustable.

A honeycombed reflector (of any type) produces fairly even illumination over the whole lit area, and then falls off very abruptly and unevenly

Garry,

Just a bit confused about the different types of honeycombed reflectors. I have a standard MOD021 dish, but see that the honeycombs range from 10 to 40 degrees. Could you advise which one would be best?

Thanks
 
For this, any will do except for the 40 deg. Any will concentrate the light in much the same way - but as I explained earlier, a different effect to a fresnel.
 
Keith,

This is simply beautiful.... a wonderful photo.

Was this a 3 light setup? Just trying to deconstruct it in my head to understand how it was created.

Thanks Steve... To be honest it was about a year ago and I can't remember any detail of how I set it up other than the key was a small gridded beauty dish... You can get an idea of its position from the nose shadow. It looks like I may have used a rimlight (camera left) and I prolly lit the background with a small gridded reflector. Sorry I can't be more detailed... I tend to make it up as I go along! :)
 
Are you talking about a hard edge as in a spotlight effect like this?

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?..._101589039999385_427690346_n.jpg&size=600,900

This was taken in our studio by one of our customers, using our Bowens Spot Light Attachment.

The above examples (equally wonderful shots by the way) were much softer edged fresnel lights. We have the Bowens Fresnel attachment, you can vary the aperture of the spot, but it only makes it smaller or larger, not sharper at the edges by the same extent. We also have an Arri jr Fresnel continuous light, which focusses the light more by moving the bulb nearer or further away from the lens, but again, this doesn't create a sharp edge like the spot attachment does.

We also have 10, 20, 30 and 40 degree 7" grids, none of which will produce a tight edge either.

Hope that all helps!
 
I use a Fresnel quite a lot but my shot which more often gets compared to classic Hollywood stylee was actually shot with a small gridded beauty dish:

beautydish.jpg

I absolutely love this image!
 
Are you talking about a hard edge as in a spotlight effect like this?

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?..._101589039999385_427690346_n.jpg&size=600,900

This was taken in our studio by one of our customers, using our Bowens Spot Light Attachment.

The above examples (equally wonderful shots by the way) were much softer edged fresnel lights. We have the Bowens Fresnel attachment, you can vary the aperture of the spot, but it only makes it smaller or larger, not sharper at the edges by the same extent. We also have an Arri jr Fresnel continuous light, which focusses the light more by moving the bulb nearer or further away from the lens, but again, this doesn't create a sharp edge like the spot attachment does.

We also have 10, 20, 30 and 40 degree 7" grids, none of which will produce a tight edge either.

Hope that all helps!
Yes, that type of effect is only available with a focussing spotlight, nothing else comes close. Generally though, sharp-edged focussing spotlights are limited when used as subject lighting, the light source is pretty small and therefore hard. They are used mainly for lighting the background or specific, small parts of the subject, and especially things like labels on wine bottles.

There are several fresnel attachments that have an iris adjustment, which is useful - but the effect is nowhere near that of the Lencarta or Arri ones, which move the whole light closer to or further from the fresnel lens.
 
Is it possible to get a similar affect using a barn door attachment, with the light at a low setting and a honeycomb attached ? (with reference to Keiths image) i only ask, as you can direct the light more with barn doors, so wondered about the possibilities.
 
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Is it possible to get a similar affect using a barn door attachment, with the light at a low setting and a honeycomb attached ? (with reference to Keiths image) i only ask, as you can direct the light more with barn doors, so wondered about the possibilities.

Everything is possible. The more knowledgeable the photographer, the easier it becomes. And skill and experience helps too. But generally, we try to use the right tools if we can, to save time and get consistency of results.

There's no reason why you couldn't have a sheet of cinefoil, with a perfect circle cut out of it, stick it onto a piece of clear acrylic and then fill the hole with a circle of partial light-blocking material (say a neutral density gel). And then cut out the centre, so that there is no obstruction of light in the centre, producing a brighter centre, with a darker outer, just like a fresnel spot.

Then you would have to find a way of suspending it in exactly the right place, and then just shine a light through it - I'm sure it would work, but the model might just grow old and lose her looks while you're doing it:)

Or you could do it as a vignette in PS.

But barn doors wouldn't work, we're trying to produce a circle of light here...

And a honeycomb doesn't produce the same effect either, for the reasons already given.

A beauty dish, fitted with a honeycomb and again, with a circle of neutral density filter around the outside only, might work too. At least a beauty dish would have size on its side, and size is important. The old fresnel spots used in the film industry were massive. Most modern fresnels are too small to work. I used to use a Bron one, which was about 14" diameter, that was excellent. The Lencarta one is 9" and that's as small as I personally would want to go. There are some on the market that are only about 3", they may have applications for still life photography, but they aren't for photographing people.

Hope this helps
 
Is it possible to get a similar affect using a barn door attachment, with the light at a low setting and a honeycomb attached ? (with reference to Keiths image) i only ask, as you can direct the light more with barn doors, so wondered about the possibilities.

As Garry says, with a bit of photoshop then you can do anything!

However, I don't personally feel you could get the "out of camera" result from anything except the spot light attachment or something similar. We have a range of grids from 10* to 40*, none of which produce the hard edged lighting effect like the spot, in my opinion.
 
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