Shooting wedding group shots - advice appreciated

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Ok, so I'm doing a wedding for a friend on Saturday. I visited the hotel venue today to check out the lighting. The group shots will be in the lobby, how should I light it? I've ordered a Canon 430EX flash but that doesn't look like it's gonna turn up in time. So I've got a cheap TT520 speedlite, which I actually quite like as it's so simple. It's manual only (cost £25!).

I want to shoot at f/8 as a nice safe aperture, nothing worse than getting home and viewing your pics to find they're slightly out of focus. f/8 seems foolproof. I'm planning to put the TT520 on a lighting stand with a shoot-through brolly, triggered by a Yongnuo flash trigger. This is rated "up to" 1/250 of a second but experiments show 1/180 is the max, otherwise there's light fall-off.

Given all this, do I shoot fully manual, set my aperture to f/8, shutter speed to 1/180 and then vary the strength of the flash until it looks good? I think I'll put the ISO up to 400 or maybe 800 as the 5D mk II is pretty good for noise. I'll be going by rule of thumb as I don't have the knowledge or a light-meter to work it out properly, I'll get there early and experiment on some hapless person. I'm shooting in raw so a bit of over-exposure will be fine, better than under-exposure.

As for the ceremony itself, it's in a function room which is fairly dim even with the lights full on, so is it just a case of choose your aperture, go to AV mode and crank the ISO up? Don't think flash would be welcome there.

There's an interesting article about this in the lastest Advanced Photographer magazine, which has helped me.

Any advice?
 
A group shot, in the pressure of a wedding, with a new flash.. you must be flippin' bonkers :p

Insanity aside, how many people are you talking? If it's more than a handful you'll struggle to get even lighting from a single umbrella unless you take it a long way away, which kind of defeats the point and will push the power output of your flash.

How high / flat is the ceiling? What kind of flooring is it? You might want to keep it pretty simple and try something like this?

http://strobist.blogspot.co.uk/2007/05/on-assignment-two-speedlight-group-shot.html

Bouncing one flash straight off the ceiling as your main light, then hide the other one behind the group, set to maximum coverage, to give you a hair/separation light.

If you do decide to go the umbrella route, you might want to make sure everyone with glasses is on one side of the picture so you can control the reflections.

As for the ceremony, unless the lighting is changing a lot why not go full manual? Set a shutter speed with plenty of leeway for the focal length, set an aperture you're happy with, then get the exposure with whatever ISO you need. The last thing you want is blurry photos because the camera dropped your shutter speed too much in Av mode.

I'm sure others will wedding experience will chime in, but that's my 2p for what it's worth :)
 
I think it's just going to be half a dozen or so at most, no big groups planned, unless the bride asks for them. Bouncing off the ceiling is a no-go, it's in front of the grand staircase in the lobby so the roof is several storeys up.

Even as we speak I have acquired a second TT520. So I could put that on the mini-stand and have it behind them as a hair light as you suggest or off to the other side in front to fill in any shadows from the main flash.

As to the ceremony, I will be shooting with the 70-200, often zooming in to catch details like the rings, facial expressions etc so I need a decent shutter speed of around 1/180, at the very least 1/90 if I use my Steadipod or maybe a monopod. In order to get that I will need to crank ISO up the max so looks like it will be grain and monochrome conversions there. The grain is deliberate. :lol:

SJRobbins said:
A group shot, in the pressure of a wedding, with a new flash.. you must be flippin' bonkers :p

Insanity aside, how many people are you talking? If it's more than a handful you'll struggle to get even lighting from a single umbrella unless you take it a long way away, which kind of defeats the point and will push the power output of your flash.

How high / flat is the ceiling? What kind of flooring is it? You might want to keep it pretty simple and try something like this?

http://strobist.blogspot.co.uk/2007/05/on-assignment-two-speedlight-group-shot.html

Bouncing one flash straight off the ceiling as your main light, then hide the other one behind the group, set to maximum coverage, to give you a hair/separation light.

If you do decide to go the umbrella route, you might want to make sure everyone with glasses is on one side of the picture so you can control the reflections.

As for the ceremony, unless the lighting is changing a lot why not go full manual? Set a shutter speed with plenty of leeway for the focal length, set an aperture you're happy with, then get the exposure with whatever ISO you need. The last thing you want is blurry photos because the camera dropped your shutter speed too much in Av mode.

I'm sure others will wedding experience will chime in, but that's my 2p for what it's worth :)
Click to expand...
 
Daryl said:
multi flash guns or a few studio heads.... Simples. 4 minute set up.
Click to expand...

I have got three strobes, might take one along as insurance. I don't like them, they seem way overpowered.
 
Doesn't matter how many people. One light on a stick near you and highish.

More people = further back. Sorted.

Outdoors is more tricky but similar.

Only time I use multiple lights on group shots I stick them all together McNally style.
 
JonathanRyan said:
Doesn't matter how many people. One light on a stick near you and highish.

More people = further back. Sorted.

Outdoors is more tricky but similar.

Only time I use multiple lights on group shots I stick them all together McNally style.
Click to expand...

That's what I like to hear, keep it simple. I used that method at my first wedding shoot http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=404653

and it came out well enough. Just line em up and blast them in the face with a shedload of strobe light.

I'm booked on a studio lighting course in a couple of weeks so I shold have a more sophisticated approach for next time.
 
oh blimey. No. Not for shots like that!!!!

I'm talking about big groups.
 
I use a shoot through brolly, i like them, generally to camera right at 45 gives a nice fall off to the skin.
as your probably going to have a slow recycle time you need to make the people aware that your taking the shot for eg: i shot a wedding with a guy who counted down which i thought was bonkers but it actually really helped make people aware that you were snapping at a certain time and that they need be aware. I have a different approach but still when i need the shot and their attention i make it clear im about to snap, (not always of course) i use pixel king flash triggers on my ex580's and they are brilliant, its really pushed my shots up a notch plus they never fail to fire.
As for the ceremony, i shoot canon 5d mark ii, usually crank the iso to 6400 f2.8 or lower lens dependant then often reduce the noise in nik software or make it black and white
 
or you could just shoot it with natural light - lol
http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=422311

joking apart, there are 2 common approaches. Flashgun high above you, or 2 flashguns one left one right at about 45 degrees. depends on the size of the group

If the ceiling is right, i like to bounce the flash off the ceiling, which is IMHO is the best approach, and a variation of the 1 light above you. you need a fairly strong flash to pull this off, but the light will be softer, and the shadows more out of the way and less distinct
 
Richard, When you say the single flash high above you, how high do you mean? I would assume the larger the group the further back you would be so the flash would need to be higher. On that assumption shall we say a group of about 6 or 8 for example.
 
Right, I've managed to blag a Canon 580EX, which is awesome, and I still have two TT520s. I've been experimenting and the 580 on a stand with a brolly at half power does well for my main light at 45 degrees to the subject and I can put a 520 on the other side to lift any shadows. That leaves me one to play with so might try the hair-light thing or even try some funky coloured gel background shots once the safe ones are in the bag. And when I say coloured gels I mean Quality Street wrappers.

Don't think there'll be groups of more than about six unless the bride calls out all the men and all the women but this set up should be able to handle it. I'll have some power in reserve.
 
I had to light a group of about 90 in a VERY small room using a single speed light after a hospital pass from the castle coordinator (they refused to let me go outside). I was quite literally standing on a chair with a 14mm lens and had my assistant stand on another as far away as he could (which wasn't very far).

Most. Post. Processing. Ever.

Because of course they wanted a DPS in the album....
 
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