Selling your work as art ..?? advice sought

Forbiddenbiker

Forbiddenbiker

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Adam
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Guidance, advice and thoughts please guys.. this is what I’m upto at the mo.

Ok, firstly, I took about 6k images last year+ their are perhaps 50- sellable arty ones...special ones, not the usual, IMO. :thinking: :shrug: :D

I got given an A3 printer recently and have been showing my A3 prints to various peoples, especially those owning cafes or similar...everyone want my images, :eek: (I like them, you like them, but its still a surprise when others like them as well...isn't it. )....mounted and framed and used to cover their cafe walls...grrreat. But, what price?

I am of the opinion that the cafe owners must make a certain percentage out of my images as well, they have overheads too, and it’s an important hook to keep them showing my images I feel... what do you think about that… any experiences?

Some of the cafes are in trendy areas and the owner has suggested a £100 each is not very much. :eek: :thumbs: Ok then.
Other owners in less trendy areas, stress and frown at £40 which barley covers the full costs (time as well)

I realise only I can really tell how much I can get for them, especially after some trail and error....like never selling any.lol. But I'm very tempted to stand my ground and try for the £100+ mark ...it’s my art, my take on things...if you like it, pay the money...or don't kinda thing.

...doomed to failer right...ha-ha :shrug:


---

Also… And at the same time..

I’m building a professional gallery and website...linked to Photobox couk
So that they can do all my gallery printing and posting etc.

Firstly...what do you guys think of the Photobox service?

Secondly...what’s the quality like?...is it as good or way better than my home printing and mounting ...I’m extremely particular of quality, my new printer is an Epsom Stylus Photo 2100....genuine everything, thick paper….what about fading over time etc…same either way..??.
I use nice thick colour toned card for mounting and special cut edges... I haven’t found a god supplier of reasonable frames yet...hopefully someone local soon...or farm out the lot if things start moving..?..to photobox or similar..? Difficult questions I know.

I'll stop their :D

Thoughts please guys.
 
I would sell the A3 framed prints for between £125.00 and £200.00, Those who said £40.00 forget. Try some more up-market bars and restuarants as well.
 
If you're printing A3 yourself with the epson AND mounting and framing i'd suggest £100 is your starting point. What percentage would you offer to the cafe owner? Charging £130, you could afford to let the establishment have 20% and still keep your cut over £100.

Stick to the trendy areas - they're frequented by people with higher disposable incomes (and maybe a touch of the bohemian ;)). When £130 is an hours 'work' instead of a couple of days pay its easier to part with.

Good luck Adam - hope you make some sales - your work is good enough!!
 
Jonnyreb said:
If you're printing A3 yourself with the epson AND mounting and framing i'd suggest £100 is your starting point. What percentage would you offer to the cafe owner? Charging £130, you could afford to let the establishment have 20% and still keep your cut over £100.
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I was thinking a 10% or something..I am decorating their walls I can argue. ;)

making me re-think guys... :thumbs:
 
I sell A3 mounted limited edition prints at £50. I add £15 for the frame if they want it. Its a fair price imho but its a limited edition run of 200 per print. If you were selling just 1 single print to a cafe then you could get away with £100 maybe. The reason why I sell at £50 is because its a nice small number that won't break the bank. Someone can go into the gallery I work with and walk off with a print without feeling like they've spent a lot of money. No-one has bought any of my £260 priced 30x20'' prints yet. Someone did at an auction for £70 and this was at a place were the minimum salary was £300,000. What I would say is don't sell them at a price that sounds great for you. Sell at a price you can sell at. £50 x 200 = 10,000 and after the galleries comission and production I stand to earn £3k off it. That'll do me. I have larger prints at a higher price if I want to make more money.

For the prints I use photobox and love it when they have a sale on :D
 
c £100-£150 seems fair to me also, I would have also thought 20-25% commision should keep them sweet, as others have said go for the upper end of the market, but you could always "adjust" your prices downwards for some of the less trendy places, if you felt inclined to get rid of some of the less popular peices, but also adjust their commision % accordingly.
I guess initially its a case of suck it and see 90% of £40 is better than 25% of zilch. But obviously don't sell your self short!
Just my thoughts on the subject
 
Forbiddenbiker said:
I was thinking a 10% or something..I am decorating their walls I can argue. ;)

making me re-think guys... :thumbs:
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I think conditional on 20% is they keep them clean and tidy (cafe's / bars are not the cleanest places). This will be invaluable when you want to rotate your stock across venues - sensible to do as a; you might find different clientele have different tastes if prints aren't shifting and b; it looks like you're shifting stock which.. well.... helps to shift stock ;)
 
The gallery I work with takes 35%, as do other local galleries. If you live in London its 50%.
 
Very different for non-gallery commission though Pete. For galleries its their reason d'etre. For Cafes etc its a lucrative sideline at 20% with, as Adam says, tateful wall decoration thrown in.
 
Yeah I'm just saying that maybe 10% is too little? Haven't worked with cafe's so I can't say :)
 
If you aren't relying on the income from the print sales, I would recommend going with at least 125 depending on how your work will be printed. I cringe a bit when I see photographers asking a huge price for something obviously printed at home, and not well. Inversely, I see quite a few film photogs selling archival selenium-toned fiber prints at a price that can only be a massive loss to the artist. It's strange.

- CJ
 
cykey. I did some work and managed to shift a few 30x20s at my full price when they were 5.99 a print :P

Hot dang im cheeky!
 
I recently went through a similar thought process. I've just sold 4 images to a local caravan park here in North Wales for them to use in their brochures - I sold them for £100 each.

Whilst this isn't exactly comparable to your situation my final reasoning regarding price was based on:

-- I don't earn my living from photography so any cash earned is "pocket money"

-- Small businesses are very particular when spending their cash so whilst you might want £300/£400 etc for an image it's not always realistic

-- If the sales are your first then selling at perhaps less than you wanted might actually result in follow-on business / good word of mouth


I'm very happy with the £400 I recieved for the 4 shots, others wouldn't be - think you need to decide on your priorities, an initial lowish price will at least guarantee you get some work in prominent positions, too high prices will more than likely mean no sales

Good luck with your venture BTW

simon
 
I'd say if you're charging that sort of money for prints then you really should get them printed by a pro lab - you wont match their quality on a home printer.

As for fading - it's not so long back that it was anticipated that ink jet prints would start to fade after 3 years, but I have some hanging in the hall that are probably 6 years old and still look fine.

The things which kill prints over time are ultra violet light and airborn pollutants. It's the former which causes fading. The best way to keep a print is in an album in a dark drawer where no-one sees them. ;) Failing that get it properly framed with the back properly sealed against the ingress of dust and pollutants and hang it well away from a window where it might get direct sunlight. This applies equally to traditional prints and digital prints. I used to stick an advisory note along the lines above an the back of framed prints for customers info.

Just to confuse the issue, Epsons top end printers now use dye based prints rather than ink, similar to the dye sublimation used in film printing. Incredibly they claim the archival life of prints on their compatible papers to be 100 years for glossy and 200 years for matt -out of doors in Western European light. Assuming it doesn't rain I suppose? :lol:
 
Great info guys, food for thought indeed, all of you have suggested that to agree a fair price for both parties is the way to go, no need to go higher than that just for greed’s sake. :thumbs:

CT. So that’s the crux of it then...I can't match their quality... Blimey it must be fab, :) ...cos it’s not bad already. My printer makes the house smell like a print shop, way stronger and more pungent than my A4 one...perhaps It’s a dye based one, dunno.

...It’s probably the way I'll go, to get the pros doing the lot...possibly all my framing as well... I got loads of research to do in that area and I'm still hopeful that I'll find some local craftsmen/picture framers who will do me a forward thinking, trade type price.


petemc said:
I sell A3 mounted limited edition prints at £50. I add £15 for the frame if they want it. Its a fair price imho but its a limited edition run of 200 per print. If you were selling just 1 single print to a cafe then you could get away with £100 maybe. The reason why I sell at £50 is because its a nice small number that won't break the bank. Someone can go into the gallery I work with and walk off with a print without feeling like they've spent a lot of money. No-one has bought any of my £260 priced 30x20'' prints yet. Someone did at an auction for £70 and this was at a place were the minimum salary was £300,000. What I would say is don't sell them at a price that sounds great for you. Sell at a price you can sell at. £50 x 200 = 10,000 and after the galleries comission and production I stand to earn £3k off it. That'll do me. I have larger prints at a higher price if I want to make more money.

For the prints I use photobox and love it when they have a sale on :D
Click to expand...

Very interesting thoughts Pete...especially the bit about the large salaries...Tight ***rds eh, lol.

Your £50 Plus a frame is about £75... I think I’d have to add London inflation to that, making the £100+ choice exactly the same amount if you get my reasoning.
It'll cost me a tenner just to travel, park and hang each of them... and that statements not too far from the truth. ;)

Your limited edition idea is bang on...the way to go indeed, nice one. :thumbs:


Jonnyreb said:
I think conditional on 20% is they keep them clean and tidy (cafe's / bars are not the cleanest places). This will be invaluable when you want to rotate your stock across venues - sensible to do as a; you might find different clientele have different tastes if prints aren't shifting and b; it looks like you're shifting stock which.. Well.... helps to shift stock ;)
Click to expand...


That’s a good Idea Jonny, I'm sold on the 20% comisiontion now, including dusting cleaning and looking after my product e.g., not bashing it and damaging the frame etc.

Ok, So I'll try and go in about the £120-130 mark...depending on framing etc...I've read on here before about the cost of printing professionally, not that far from my own costs really...and as CT say's the qualities better.. So that’s set as well....nearly.. Cos I've got a bit of a quandary about the twenty or so images that I've printed and framed up now.. A lower price I guess.... I need to start testing the market somewhere. :rules:

Good stuff thanks guys.
 
Forbiddenbiker said:
Very interesting thoughts Pete...especially the bit about the large salaries...Tight ***rds eh, lol.
Click to expand...

I know! Crazy world. The thing is, I was chatting to a guy yesterday who knows a guy who sold a print for £8k. Not sure if it was a photo or a painting but it clearly works. Its just about finding the right buyers. If people don't buy my work I know its either out their price range or they don't like it. Fair enough really as I know plenty of people who do like it so I'm not doing anything stupidly wrong. Just gotta get lucky.

Your £50 Plus a frame is about £75... I think I’d have to add London inflation to that, making the £100+ choice exactly the same amount if you get my reasoning.
It'll cost me a tenner just to travel, park and hang each of them... and that statements not too far from the truth. ;)
Click to expand...

Ahhh London eh. Yeah £100 seems fine for there.
 
Lol @ swPete

Good links guys, Thanks. :thumbs: ....very interesting read that second one Druid, more of a life story than a business view point, very rewarding nonetheless... follow your dreams and don't give a damn was one of the messages that came across... lol ... I'll read more of that guy, inspiring words, nice images too. Ta for that.


petemc said:
I know! Crazy world. The thing is, I was chatting to a guy yesterday who knows a guy who sold a print for £8k. Not sure if it was a photo or a painting but it clearly works. Its just about finding the right buyers. If people don't buy my work I know its either out their price range or they don't like it. Fair enough really as I know plenty of people who do like it so I'm not doing anything stupidly wrong. Just gotta get lucky.
Click to expand...

Yeah, luck or just hard work Pete, I guess all you can do is your best, and either appeal to the general or possibly find ..That you only appeal to a few, either way it all comes down to a passion for the image....so who’s to say really. In the words similar to Alan Briot ...better to keep improving at what you love doing than excel at stuff you couldn’t really careless about.

It had quite an effect on me that article.

...which is nice.
 
milou said:
Meant to say congrats on the sales. Shows that it's worth putting the leg-work in.
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Hi David , long time no speak mate. Hope your good.

Thanks for that but actually You've speed read it all a bit to quick...I haven't sold any yet...just had an ok on displaying them at various places... nice that you assumed I had though. lol. :thumbs:
 
Alex Novak is a photography dealer who produces what is probably the best free news letter information on the web on the fine art photograph market.
Many of you will probably not think its relevant being as its high end stuff but its good info to know.

http://www.iphotocentral.com/news/news.php
 
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