Recommended Square ND filters - replacing big stopper

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Been using Lee for over 10 years but just wondering if I now have any alternatives that are compatible.

Looking to replace my big stopper

About /6 years ago I did buy one of formatt hitech’s then top line of filters - I can’t recall the name but it was an 8 stopper and it was horrible. Dor want of a better word the photos were purple and green and couldn’t be colour corrected without major surgery.

Ever since that experience I’ve never bought another brand - until now (maybe)

Last year I bought one of the Lee INRD pro filters, 6 stop and using it and the big stopper on my laowa 12mm really pushed the filters to their limit especially my big stopper, so I ended up doing a few tests of the big stopper and INRD filter side by side

What i noticed vs a separate control shot without the filter was that the INRD has vertically no vinetting and little colour cast.

However the big stopper vinettes significantly at both 16mm and much more pronounced on my 12mm lens (on full frame). The colour cast I’m aware of but I wa shocked just how much vitnetting I was seeing. Maybe I’d become conditioned to it but I’d genuinely never noticed it before!!!


Anyway so options are to shell out on the Lee INRD 10 stop filter and hope it’s performance is better or to see what other hopefully cheaper(!) brands can now compete with the Lee quality?
 
check out haida if you want to look at alternatives. The 150mm square works well to about 14mmm on my canon 11-24 without vignetting, 12mm is ok with some vignetting.
 
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What are a good brand of screw in @ higher ND? I know Lee have started doing some screw in but need to do some research, in any case that may mean dispensing with my polariser, other NDs and grads, although I don’t use the grads too often anymore.
 
Haida in my experience are a good brand.
 
Thanks will have a look - especially if they do square filters as well
 
I’ve been having a look at the Haida website - looks like they have some interesting systems - trying to work out if the m7 or m10 are front filter systems a la lee etc or whether they are drop in rear filter systems but can’t find much info (so far) website or Amazon doesn’t specify. Looks interesting all the same
 
I've not used those systems. They look like front filter holder systems for square filters with the added benefit of allowing for an additional drop-in filter.
 
Surely vignetting is caused by the filter holder arrangement and not by the filter its self? The filters are the same thickness, you are also comparing a 6 stop and a 10 stop filter though.
How did the little stopper (old 6 stopper) compare to the IRND model? I would suggest that it could be underexposure on the 10 stop that makes it more noticable.

Lee are known to have a blue cast, the Formatt Hitech little to none so surprised you say yours was horrendous.

I used to use Format Hitech 85mm system but on my fuji 10-24 it would vignet at at 14mm (APSC) becuase of how thick the holder was. It was the tunnel effect of the polariser on the front that caused it not the filter itself. If I used it with 1 filter slot it was ok but that meant no grad or stacked ND's. I had no colour cast and that was with the Firecrest filters.

I have moved to the Kase 100mm system and dont have any vigneting.

I suspect that you are using the older holder? In the first instance I would try a newer style holder where the polariser sits closest to the lens, you could probably get a used Kase K9 holder and polariser for £80 and just use your current filters till they break.

If you are looking at screw on try the magnetic versions - screw on a holder ring then the filter just sticks to the holder. Kase do them but Im told Breakthrough are as good glass wise but have a better holder/magnetic lens cap combination.

Haida, Kase, Nisi are all good and there are loads that swear by Lee although everyone says cleaning IRND filters is a pain without special fluid only available through Lee at a price.
Budget end K&F, I have one of thier reverse Grads as it was half the cost of a Kase one that gets only occasional use.
 
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AgentOrange76 said:
Surely vignetting is caused by the filter holder arrangement and not by the filter its self? The filters are the same thickness, you are also comparing a 6 stop and a 10 stop filter though.
How did the little stopper (old 6 stopper) compare to the IRND model? I would suggest that it could be underexposure on the 10 stop that makes it more noticable.

Lee are known to have a blue cast, the Formatt Hitech little to none so surprised you say yours was horrendous.

I used to use Format Hitech 85mm system but on my fuji 10-24 it would vignet at at 14mm (APSC) becuase of how thick the holder was. It was the tunnel effect of the polariser on the front that caused it not the filter itself. If I used it with 1 filter slot it was ok but that meant no grad or stacked ND's. I had no colour cast and that was with the Firecrest filters.

I have moved to the Kase 100mm system and dont have any vigneting.

I suspect that you are using the older holder? In the first instance I would try a newer style holder where the polariser sits closest to the lens, you could probably get a used Kase K9 holder and polariser for £80 and just use your current filters till they break.

If you are looking at screw on try the magnetic versions - screw on a holder ring then the filter just sticks to the holder. Kase do them but Im told Breakthrough are as good glass wise but have a better holder/magnetic lens cap combination.

Haida, Kase, Nisi are all good and there are loads that swear by Lee although everyone says cleaning IRND filters is a pain without special fluid only available through Lee at a price.
Budget end K&F, I have one of thier reverse Grads as it was half the cost of a Kase one that gets only occasional use.
Click to expand...
good point, with canon 11-24 the vignetting is caused by the holder.
 
I've got the hitech firecrest big stopper and haven't noticed any excessive colour cast. I've never used a strong ND filter that has no cast whatsoever and the Firecrest has probably been the best.

As above, filters shouldn't cause vignetting but maybe they can accentuate the vignetting from a lens and/or holder?
 
Actually that’s a good point I didn’t test with the filter holder but no filter attached. I’d be surprised if it made a difference because on any other filter - I,,e the 6 stop the impact was negligible and that was with filter, holder and polariser. Note: Nisi system with rear polariser rather than lee system with ginormous front one
 
Test it by holding the filter directly to the front of the lens with out the holder mounted, if you get vignetting then its the actual filter - I very much doubt it unless your front lens diameter is is close to the same width as the filter but then that would need to be 95mm. There are some lenses that need a 150mm filter kit because of this, IIRC KASE make a holder for a particular Nikon lens to prevent this.

I really do think it is to do with the holder being too narrow for the lens front element and/or it extending too far forward.

This issue was addressed by most companies by moving the polariser close to the Lens, Lee redesigned their holder but left the polariser out front so I dont think that would change anything.

With the 85mm filters on the 10-24mm at 10mm you could see the holder in the corners, at 14mm it was shadowing caused by the holder effectively putting blinkers on the side of the lens and not enough light was getting in at the edges. This size was meant more for M43 cameras which was my intended route until the XT3 came out.

I can stack a poloriser, 10stop, 6stop and Grad filter at 10mm and have no vignetting using 100mm square filters but then the holder is only 10mm thick rather than the 20mm odd of a lee
 
Are you talking 10mm full frame or crop? Just curious as I don’t think an 85mm system would fit a 10mm full frame?

Mine is full frame 12mm laowa lens using a specific adaptor ring from nisi for this lens. However I still have the same issues but slightly less prevalent on my 16-35 using the standard nisi system with the polariser at the rear.

Anyway I’ll do the test tonight if I get chance I’ll post the images.
 
I did the tests and at this time of day at least (probably the least challenging and most consistant conditions) it doesn't seem to bad... but when you push it, i.e towards dusk is when I've noticed more of an issue. You can clearly see more of a darkening around the outer of the image though. Although interestingly enough the 6 stop produces a slightly more over exposed image. All these images are straight off the camera into lightroom no adjustments or import presets applied

Base image: 1/320s F8 ISO 100
Laowa 1-320 ISO100 F8.jpg


Now with Filter adaptor ring, polariser (rotated for sky) and filter holder no filter. 1/80 F8 ISO 100. You can see the holder induced vignette (I can't spell that word to save my life!) in the top left and right - but I know about that and its accepted this will happen)

Laowa polariser and holder1-80s ISO100 F8.jpg

next with the 6 stop IRND. 1.something seconds F8 ISO 100. no additional vignetting visible. Slightly over exposed possibly, but using photopils LE calculator to shift the exposure 6 stops

Laowa 6 stop 1s ISO100 F8.jpg

now with the 10 stop Big stopper. Set to 11 stops compensation due to my histogram calabaration (done 10 or more years ago) pointing it more towards 11 than 10. Clearly more detail lost/hiding in the shadows in the upper and lower corners both left and right. Most obvious around the red car and to the right and below that. detail also lost around the bushes at the bottom due to the vignette

25s F8 ISO 100.

Laowa 10 stop 25s ISO100 F8.jpg

To be clear the test was fair a camera meter reading taken after filter had been taken off still read at 1/80 F8, ISO 100 so conditions were as constant as I could get them throughout.
 
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The only ND filters I have used which don't appear to have any colour cast are Polarpro, prices are very high though.
 
Thanks - just a reminder this isn’t about colour cast but the vignetting
 
The 10 stop image is under exposed compared to the 6 stop so any dark areas will be darker, the sky is darker than the 6 stop, the building white is less exposed for.

The vignetting is the filter holder, its accentuated by underexposure.

Nisi seem to have a lot of dedicated holders/adaptors for wide lens in the 12-16mm range so Im guessing that its an issue, i havent had a detailed look but one option seems to suggest using 150mm filters.

Whats the front diameter of the lens?
 
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