Lighting assistance please

donkeymusic

donkeymusic

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Carlo
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Evening,

Looking for some advice with lighting a setup in the studio.

14068376265_1274817bf1.jpg
1[/url] by Carlo Mullen, on Flickr/p/nrb78t]
14068376265_1274817bf1.jpg
[/url]1 by Carlo Mullen, on Flickr[/IMG]

In my studio space i have created a fake floor and back to try and get away from paper rolls. From the above shot i have tried lights in all positions and changing distances from the backdrop, but i still seem to getting the shows on the backdrop, i like the floor shadows so don't want to eliminate them but the backdrop ones are annoying me.

Looking to try and get setup that doesn't require a massive amount of editing

So what i would like to know, would i client buy photos if there were shadows present?
Can you suggest any better options for lighting this type of shot for families?

Thanks for any advice offered
 
Not saying I know the answer for sure, but I'll be brave and take a stab at it.

How about using a diffusing panel to turn your light into a bigger light source that will wrap the chair? It would at least make that shadow on the wall softer.

To look natural your photo is going to need a consistent light direction, ie no cross shadows, so you'd need to be really careful about lighting the wall from each side. Don't think that would work.
 
Are you able to move the props further away from the wall?
I think we have spoke before about large single light sources? A big octa box will soften the shadows but in reality with your props this close you will always get some shadow.
 
If your shooting a family group sitting casually against the wall on the floor shadow will not be a problem. Just look at the dude here in the forum called metal god - I can't think for the life of me his actual name but I follow his stuff on Facebook.
 
Stevie- said:
Are you able to move the props further away from the wall?
I think we have spoke before about large single light sources? A big octa box will soften the shadows but in reality with your props this close you will always get some shadow.
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Yeah i have about 2.5 meters of flooring from the wall.

I think the distance is the problem at the moment, so gonna have a play with that tomorrow.

Just struggling again with lighting in the studio, and not getting a consistent lighting setup so that when i look at any sessions i do they are all varied, doesn't appear to be any connection between shots so when i put them on Facebook/website they look like a load of random shots.
 
donkeymusic said:
Have looked at his work before and see similarities between his and your stevie, its a style that i like and want to try and work towards.
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looking further through Davids work there are a lot wight eh subject close to the wall, and minimal shadow
 
The props are probably not gonna be used in the session, it was just because i didn't have anything text to shoot against the backdrop
 
Shadows are good, they show things are real and exist in the same space. The light fall-off to the sides of the wall doesn't look great though.

donkeymusic said:
So what i would like to know, would i client buy photos if there were shadows present?
Click to expand...

Why wouldn't they? Good lighting doesn't mean light everything and eliminate every bit of shadow in the frame.

If you don't want shadows on the wall, the easiest thing to do would be to raise your light.
 
You can totally remove shadows on the background by lighting it separately

You can hide shadows behind the subject by raising the light so that the shadows are out of sight.

You can make shadows so soft and indistinct that they are virtually invisible by using a very large light source, as close as possible to the subject

BUT

Shadows are real, they are part of life. The only time that we don’t see shadows in real life is when we take our photos on a totally overcast, dull day – and who enjoys dull things?

It is shadows that define shapes, that add interest, that make photos 3 dimensional

Lighting needs to be placed at distances and heights that flatter the subject (whether that means making a beautiful woman breathtaking, an average person special, or a tin of baked beans appetising) and should never be placed in a certain position just to avoid a problem or, as in this case, to avoid a perceived problem
 
What is your lighting set up for this?

(Flattering though it is I'm lucky if I'm a poor mans David Calvert! - but thanks!)
 
I had two large softboxes set up to the left and to the right. The left one is the main light is causing the shadow, the left softbox is just for a bit of fill light.

but the image isnt straight is cropped to 8x10 as thats what i sell, so it leaves me as mentioned above with a lot of light fall off so anything wider than the above wont be lit.
 
Stevie- said:
Central, above camera. A nice soft angle to it. Not flat but not too down.

I use a boom so it's easier to keep stuff out of the way.
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are you using that setup a lot now? any reflectors ?
 
Garry Edwards said:
You can totally remove shadows on the background by lighting it separately

You can hide shadows behind the subject by raising the light so that the shadows are out of sight.

You can make shadows so soft and indistinct that they are virtually invisible by using a very large light source, as close as possible to the subject

BUT

Shadows are real, they are part of life. The only time that we don’t see shadows in real life is when we take our photos on a totally overcast, dull day – and who enjoys dull things?

It is shadows that define shapes, that add interest, that make photos 3 dimensional

Lighting needs to be placed at distances and heights that flatter the subject (whether that means making a beautiful woman breathtaking, an average person special, or a tin of baked beans appetising) and should never be placed in a certain position just to avoid a problem or, as in this case, to avoid a perceived problem
Click to expand...


Thanks Garry as always your help is much appreciated, on a side note sorry to see that you were attacked over your support. Its always much appreciated by myself

back to topic, if i am looking to have a subject sat against the wall what method would you advise to eliminate shadow, in the way that David Calvert lights them?

Thanks
 
This is going slighlty off topic but whilst Garry and Stevie are responding i would like to hear there views.

A portrait session in a studio, what shots should this include, im a fan of upper body shots with good eye contact from the subject. but find myself shooting full length and wonder if this is always necessary

thanks
 
a full length body shot I always find the least likely to sell.

It's also the least pleasing in the frame.

I do include a good range of sitting poses and lying down if the kids are 10 or under.

My preferred shots are 3/4 portraits and more head and shoulder style shots.

I will shoot full length to cover all bases.
 
Stevie- said:
a full length body shot I always find the least likely to sell.

It's also the least pleasing in the frame.

I do include a good range of sitting poses and lying down if the kids are 10 or under.

My preferred shots are 3/4 portraits and more head and shoulder style shots.

I will shoot full length to cover all bases.
Click to expand...

Thats pretty much what i was thinking. I do shoot full length but never really sell them and not something what i wanna be doing, the only thin is when you concentrate on the body the range of shots is limited due to the limits on poses
 
donkeymusic said:
Thanks Garry as always your help is much appreciated, on a side note sorry to see that you were attacked over your support. Its always much appreciated by myself

back to topic, if i am looking to have a subject sat against the wall what method would you advise to eliminate shadow, in the way that David Calvert lights them?

Thanks
Click to expand...

Looks as if David uses just one light to light the subject, looking at his blog
 
donkeymusic said:
Thanks Garry as always your help is much appreciated, on a side note sorry to see that you were attacked over your support. Its always much appreciated by myself

back to topic, if i am looking to have a subject sat against the wall what method would you advise to eliminate shadow, in the way that David Calvert lights them?

Thanks
Click to expand...
I didn't know that David is on this forum as "Metal God", I came across him quite a few years ago and have always liked much of his work. Inevitably, he seems to have developed a style but, like almost all good photographers, his style is little more than a concept or approach, although his lighting is almost invariably simple, it does change to suit both the subject and the required effect.

His children shots don't really catch my eye, it isn't a subject that I shoot myself or have any interest in, but I like many of his model style shots. These seem often to be lit with a single softbox directly in front of where the model is pointing her head, often with some other light source coming from below to provide some balance - this could be a reflector or a second light.
Having a light source directly in front and above is pretty flattering to most people most of the time and does tend to push shadows out of sight, if that really is what you want to do. But David does quite a lot of PP work too, and this may be why you won't find many shadows on the background.
donkeymusic said:
This is going slighlty off topic but whilst Garry and Stevie are responding i would like to hear there views.

A portrait session in a studio, what shots should this include, im a fan of upper body shots with good eye contact from the subject. but find myself shooting full length and wonder if this is always necessary

thanks
Click to expand...
Full length shots produce an odd-shaped final result and involve a lot more work in terms of both posing and lighting.
 
Garry Edwards said:
But David does quite a lot of PP work too, and this may be why you won't find many shadows on the background..
Click to expand...

I do expect that some PP work is required, im not sure of the best methods to remove the shadows though
 
Possible a little to much shadow on the left. Personal taste though as I used to shoot with even more than that! I would imagine that it's a lighting that you might struggle a bit with if the kid is too mobile? That's one of the things I found.
Also I either chop the head or a I don't (I always shoot both) not just a wee bit and I try and keep yes on the thirds.

Could be the phone but it looks like it needs to be a bit punchier?
 
This is shot with one light above and centre 140 octa, she is leaning against the studio wall. no shadows to speak of.

1498797_558916990850654_8504766_o.jpg
 
Some of you have mentioned my work and how I don't get shadows on the wall - as shown here: http://www.calvert.biz/blog/page/7/

Firstly, I hardly ever PP them out - its a straight shot and contrary to belief there is very little PP. I do a bit of skin retouching and burn the floor in a bit.

Its very simply done. That setup is done with one flash head (on a boom arm) with a softbox - a bog standard 50" softbox I bought from Calumet about 10 years ago. Its positioned directly in front of the subject at a fairly high level. That is why you don't see any shadows. I occasionally use a large silver reflector which is flat on the floor in front of the subjects to give a little lift under the chin and to give the eyes a bit more of a twinkle.

TBH I don't mind shadows, and often on this setup I will use attachments to bring them out - like in this shot http://www.calvert.biz/blog/childrens-headshot-photography-in-hertfordshire/. It anchors the subjects and gives a little bit more punch to the shot.

I always keep my lighting setups simple. I really can't be ar$ed to faff about all day playing with lights. I normally have one light on the subject and that is it.

Hope this helps! :-)
 
Just then usual Lightroom boosts.

I'm pretty sure I would have brushed her jeans and hair (never skin!) with a brush upping the clarity (exp plus a little too)
 
okay had a few tests shot today to try and achieve what i was after, thanks to every support and to David for chipping in with his methods, although not trying to copy its a style i like and want to aim towards.

So setup was large sot box up high and just to left of camera and had a smaller soft box to the right feathering across the subject to just add a bit of fill.

Looking for feedback, I have added three shots, the first is with minimal editing, second is a preset i have been applying but not sure how much i like it, and the third is just a mono version. so was looking for feedback on the lighting of the first, which looks better 1 or 2 and which is the preferred image of the three.

Thank you
 
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