Lenses for Low Light/Indoor?

N

Netvyper

Suspended / Banned
Messages
30
Name
Ashley Young
Edit My Images
Yes
Mods; if this is the wrong place, I'd be most obliged if you could correct me :).

In a couple of weeks time, is my grandparents 50th Wedding Anniversary; and for the first time in a while, the entire family will be together. I suspect a lot of the time will be in poorly lit rooms, with very little outdoors, weather depending of course. Now I'd like to hire a couple of lenses to go with my 350D for this purpose, as I've only got the 18-55 kit lens, and 70-300 telephoto.

My initial thoughts are the 50mm F1.4 & the 17-50 F2.8 IS. Do you think this will be the right sort of kit for group shots, and generally snapping some good memories of the event?
 
17-50 will be better for groups indoors. the IS will help with the fact you'll need slow shutter speeds. But you'll need to pose people as your shutter speeds may be too slow to stop movement.
 
I'd be seriously tempted to get a flash, the 50 1.4 will work really well in the low light but you'll stuggle to fit more than one or two people in the frame on your crop body, the shallow dof also makes getting a group of people in focus a challenge. Think if it was me I'd go with the 17-50 you've listed and a decent flash to bounce.
 
a1ex2001 said:
I'd be seriously tempted to get a flash, the 50 1.4 will work really well in the low light but you'll stuggle to fit more than one or two people in the frame on you crop body. think if it was me I'd go with the 17-50 you've listed and a decent flash to bounce.
Click to expand...

He didn't ask about flash

I presumed he'd either have one already, or have no idea how to use one if hired either?

:shrug:

DD
 
DiddyDave said:
He didn't ask about flash

I presumed he'd either have one already, or have no idea how to use one if hired either?

:shrug:

DD
Click to expand...

I realise there was no mention of flash in the op, the question was however do you think this will be the right kit and I'd rather have a standard zoom and a flash for this scenario than a 50 1.4 for the greater flexibility it offers in posing group shots etc. So in my opinion the kit in the op wasn't the right kit and the kit I would advise would be the 17-50 and a flash.
 
Thanks for the input so far folks;

DiddyDave: you are correct in the asumption I dont have a clue about using a flash :( aA1ex2001: Maybe looking at a flash would be a good idea... In all honesty though; i've never really liked them; they are so intrusive... when a flash goes off, whatever im doing, I stop to have a look.... so I'd prefer some good shots with natural light... Will have a poke around & do some reading, see what I can come up with.


Would grabbing the 24mm 1.4L be a better idea than the 50mm then, bearing in mind the crop body... its a bit more cash, but its not like my grandparents will be doing this again :p
 
Netvyper said:
Thanks for the input so far folks;

DiddyDave: you are correct in the asumption I dont have a clue about using a flash :( aA1ex2001: Maybe looking at a flash would be a good idea... In all honesty though; i've never really liked them; they are so intrusive... when a flash goes off, whatever im doing, I stop to have a look.... so I'd prefer some good shots with natural light... Will have a poke around & do some reading, see what I can come up with.


Would grabbing the 24mm 1.4L be a better idea than the 50mm then, bearing in mind the crop body... its a bit more cash, but its not like my grandparents will be doing this again :p
Click to expand...


24mm 1.4 would be a good choice too as you are even less likely to noticeably suffer camera shake with wider lenses

I agree that if you're not used the them 'hoping' to get good results with a flashgun could be a bit risky on a one-off occasion

Any chance you can check out the venue beforehand with your current set-up? If you set your ISO to 800 your lens to f4 and then post what the shutter speeds are, it'll be easy enough to work out if those lenses will do the job okay for you - or indeed you HAVE to use flash

:thumbs:

DD
 
if you're hiring then why not go for 50/1.2 from www.lensesforhire.co.uk
it's a great lens and lets in half as much light again as 1.4
 
Netvyper said:
Im quite likely to have Issues with the limited DoF indoors with this one arent I?
Click to expand...

Hence a 50 1.8 / 1.4 is handy!

Check out my flicker set 'Anniversary' (on the right)

http://www.flickr.com/photos/rossharvey/

Like yourself, they were taken in a single dark room with no flash. The 50/1.8 was a life saver (even on my crop sensor). Be careful with the DoF though, 1.8 is great when people are level, but when there is more than a single 'layer' of people you'll need to stop it down to retain detail at the back.
 
Hmmm the f1.4 glass will enable you to focus more easily, but to actually take photos wide open is going to make for some nasty DOF problems.

If you had a different body, I'd suggest a high ISO, but thats not gonna float on a 350D really.

Flash is the way to do this to be honest. Not your pop-up flash, but a proper external flash. Don't imagine this will yield whited out results like some mickey mouse pocket camera either - it is perfectly possible to capture a true to life image using fill flash bounced onto the subject.
 
rdh said:
Hence a 50 1.8 / 1.4 is handy!

Check out my flicker set 'Anniversary' (on the right)

http://www.flickr.com/photos/rossharvey/

Like yourself, they were taken in a single dark room with no flash. The 50/1.8 was a life saver (even on my crop sensor). Be careful with the DoF though, 1.8 is great when people are level, but when there is more than a single 'layer' of people you'll need to stop it down to retain detail at the back.
Click to expand...

Some really ace photos there; I think I'll have to try a 50mm 1.4 for the weekend... at £13.75 it'd be criminal not to :p

desantnik said:
Hmmm the f1.4 glass will enable you to focus more easily, but to actually take photos wide open is going to make for some nasty DOF problems.

If you had a different body, I'd suggest a high ISO, but thats not gonna float on a 350D really.

Flash is the way to do this to be honest. Not your pop-up flash, but a proper external flash. Don't imagine this will yield whited out results like some mickey mouse pocket camera either - it is perfectly possible to capture a true to life image using fill flash bounced onto the subject.
Click to expand...

Ahh yeah, I didnt think of this... focusing with a F1.2/F1.4 would be easier; but certainly going to want to be lower for the majority of shots....

ISO; anything above 400 becomes really grainy... 800 perhaps in a push, if I dont mind spending ages touching up...

Ok, so if I include a flash in my thoughts; any tips/recommendations? Any way I can make it less intrusive?
 
Two things you can use to make the light softer and not nasty white outs...

1) Bounce it - a proper flash gun used in a "normal" room (ie house height white painted ceilings) you want to point it up and bounce the light off of the ceiling.

2) Diffuse it - either the flip down diffuser on the Canon Speedlight or a slip on diffuser.

Maybe use both of those techniques.

Might take a little mucking around to get the result you want, so allow for some muck about time before you start.

You might also want to read up on flash lighting... its not as easy as Canon's ETTL would suggest... but you will learn some valuable skills!
 
Netvyper said:
..

Ok, so if I include a flash in my thoughts; any tips/recommendations? Any way I can make it less intrusive?
Click to expand...

Bounced flash really isn't that intusive as your not shinning a bright light directly into peoples faces your illuminating them with the reflected light. I'm sure at a family event there will be plenty of people with compacts set on red eye reduction getting far more attention!

Definately worth getting one early to have a practice allthouhg it's not really that difficult to get to grips with the basics (more advanced stuff can be a whole different story!)
 
Go as high as you need to on the ISO- Yes, there will be some noise but there's plenty of NR software available and the sofness it can introduce can be kind to skin (reducing wrinkles, zits etc!). Indoors, I would concentrate on individual or couples shots - if there's any sign of decent weather, get everyone outside for the group shots, set the camera up on a tripod with a timer or a remote control and be in the shot - after all, you ARE their grandchild!
 
Nod said:
Go as high as you need to on the ISO- Yes, there will be some noise but there's plenty of NR software available and the sofness it can introduce can be kind to skin (reducing wrinkles, zits etc!). Indoors, I would concentrate on individual or couples shots - if there's any sign of decent weather, get everyone outside for the group shots, set the camera up on a tripod with a timer or a remote control and be in the shot - after all, you ARE their grandchild!
Click to expand...

That's a good call, i'll have to poke round ebay & see if I cant find a cheap ir remote :)

Good input folks; many thanks... keep it coming ***! :thumbs:
 
Okay then - if flash it is... then use the 17-50 but still at the f2.8 end and use ISO 400 - this will give a much less harsh flash look (even where bounced of ceilings etc. or the wall behind you & the ceiling at the same time)

DD
 
DiddyDave said:
24mm 1.4 would be a good choice too as you are even less likely to noticeably suffer camera shake with wider lenses

I agree that if you're not used the them 'hoping' to get good results with a flashgun could be a bit risky on a one-off occasion

Any chance you can check out the venue beforehand with your current set-up? If you set your ISO to 800 your lens to f4 and then post what the shutter speeds are, it'll be easy enough to work out if those lenses will do the job okay for you - or indeed you HAVE to use flash

:thumbs:

DD
Click to expand...

Im afraid I wont be able to get to the venue before hand nope :s If I can borrow a flash this weekend to get some practice I think I'll consider it; otherwise its a no go... not sure if i've stated before; but the event is w/e of 17th Oct... so i've not really left myself alot of time :p
 
I have just been on holidays and I took a lot of photos of the shows at night.
I used a 50mm 1.4 iso 400/800 depending on the lighting on the show all taken at the 1.4 end of the aperture. I did not use flash as it washed out some of the colours from the lighting. I did try all kind of settings to try this but found higher iso to work better.
 
Netvyper, if you are gonna go down the route of flash (which IMHO would be the best option) you will have to think about the ceiling in the venue. If it is too high the flash will be severely lacking (as the light has to reach the ceiling then bounce of that to illuminate the subject). Its difficult to say what kind of height would be the maximum but I would be wary of anything higher than 12-15 feet. Also, you should take into account the colour of the ceiling, if it some bizarre colour this could affect the image colours.

It is something to take into account, also, you can bounce flash from walls if the ceilings are not suitable.
 
There may be better choices than the 17-50 as I don't believe it provides distance information to the flash......a lens which does may be safer for novice use ?

Bob
 
Bounce it off anything you like or can for a wide spread of light - so long as you shoot in raw and know what is supposed to be white you're fine

Shoot the flash behind you onto a red wall if you have to, it'll soften the light and obviously change it's colour but is easy to sort (as a batch) later

A light bounced off a red wall will be much softer and more pleasant than a direct 'white' flash will be - and it's only a matter of a click or two to sort

DD
 
Canon Bob said:
There may be better choices than the 17-50 as I don't believe it provides distance information to the flash......a lens which does may be safer for novice use ?

Bob
Click to expand...



Oh - I didn't take the crap 'Canon' effect into account and assumed (as a Nikon user) that all the gear would talk to all the other gear !!!!!

:D:D:D

DD
 
DiddyDave said:
Oh - I didn't take the crap 'Canon' effect into account and assumed (as a Nikon user) that all the gear would talk to all the other gear !!!!!

:D:D:D

DD
Click to expand...

DD.....I'm assuming the lens is the Tamron as Canon don't make a 17-50. If it's the EF17-55 then distance info is sent.

Bob
 
Canon Bob said:
DD.....I'm assuming the lens is the Tamron as Canon don't make a 17-50. If it's the EF17-55 then distance info is sent.

Bob
Click to expand...

Damn !!!

A misplaced Canon insult

What a waste of a post

:lol:

DD
 
Canon Bob said:
DD.....I'm assuming the lens is the Tamron as Canon don't make a 17-50. If it's the EF17-55 then distance info is sent.

Bob
Click to expand...

My Mistake;

Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM - is the one im looking at on lensesforhire.co.uk :)

Thanks for the advice so far folks... always willing to absorb more *** :)
 
Hey again folks,

Had a poke around my mother's old kit and found this flash:

flash1.jpg

flash2.jpg


It certainly makes a huge difference, I spent an hour or so annoying everyone who was watching tv :p

The only downside, I need to learn how to control it, I find it basically trial & error to work out what settings on the flash I need... the manual is there; but I think I need to understand more about it

So, with a 17-55 F2.8, and one of these... do you think i'll be ok?
 
rdh said:
Hence a 50 1.8 / 1.4 is handy!

Check out my flicker set 'Anniversary' (on the right)

http://www.flickr.com/photos/rossharvey/

Like yourself, they were taken in a single dark room with no flash. The 50/1.8 was a life saver (even on my crop sensor). Be careful with the DoF though, 1.8 is great when people are level, but when there is more than a single 'layer' of people you'll need to stop it down to retain detail at the back.
Click to expand...

Good advice, I wish I had read that a week or 2 ago. I spent a whole evening without flash in a very dark marquee. On the useable ones I did balls up the DOF on a couple. I have looked at your images in the anniversery folder. how do you get your black and whites to look so good? Mine tend to be a bit too grey!!:help:
 
trigger said:
how do you get your black and whites to look so good? Mine tend to be a bit too grey!!:help:
Click to expand...

Make sure you take them in colour and use CS3 for the B&W conversion...
 
trigger said:
Good advice, I wish I had read that a week or 2 ago. I spent a whole evening without flash in a very dark marquee. On the useable ones I did balls up the DOF on a couple. I have looked at your images in the anniversery folder. how do you get your black and whites to look so good? Mine tend to be a bit too grey!!:help:
Click to expand...

I learnt that the hard way too. Also, the 350D has an A-DEP (auto depth of field) mode, which Canon recommend for group shots.

Post processing helps here trig; using either contrast or highlight/shadow manipulation. Shoot in RAW and have a play with the white balance and tint also, as when in grey scale this can give higher contrast straight off the bat.

This book is excellent: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Black-White-Photography-Digital-Age/dp/0715325620/

It assumes you have Photoshop/Elements. You can download a Photoshop clone version of The Gimp for free if you don't own either. Lightroom is excellent too.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top