In the meantime... Help us please?

Forbiddenbiker

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In the meantime, while we're being distracted by immigration waffle, knee touching or and especially listening to the cow pat maths from a mixed group who have failed to control our economy for decades .

I like loads of you to donate money to a cause which at first glance you wont fully understand, hasn't been mentioned in the press much, but in fact is vastly more important than most of us realise.
Edit: 2.57pm same day. Job now completed. The funds have been raised. The problem is solved. Info in my 3rd post down.

:D Power to the people!

..only, without the tank.

Why here.
And some info and history here.
And an example of the gagging effect here.

Many of us have been fighting this PROBLEM for near a year or so now, petition after petition, thousands of letters to our MPs, huge 100,000 plus signatures in just a few days, just last week in two days flat 160,000 of us voted by petition again on this subject. We've made good changes to this gagging law, but its all very frustrating because our hard work can be flipped and rejected at the last minute!! ...gawd knows who and how the strings are being pulled but they are not giving up easy and listening to us, that's for sure.

Please have a search and a read about this gagging order, some things are worth paying for and this is surely one of them.


This is the plan.

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Quote from email.
'Tomorrow, Lords have to decide. Will they vote to put their improvements to the gagging law back in? Or do they give up and let MPs have their way? [1]

A growing coalition of organisations threatened by the gagging law – from Oxfam to Christian Aid, the Countryside Alliance to the Salvation Army – are planning full-page ads in major newspapers for tomorrow morning. They would carry a clear message: the public wants the Lords to hold firm and protect our democratic freedoms.

If we can raise enough money to run the ads, we can be confident they’ll get noticed. The House of Lords is the kind of place where newspapers get read. They’d be the talk of parliament’s tearooms as Lords weigh up how to vote.

The other groups involved will also chip in. But donations from 38 Degrees members will mean more adverts and bigger adverts. Please can you donate now to help make it happen?
https://secure.38degrees.org.uk/chip-in


Sometimes the Lords hesitate to challenge elected MPs. But on this occasion we can remind Lords that none of us ever voted for this attack on citizens speaking up. Neither the Lib Dems nor the Conservatives had this in their last election manifesto.

Our MPs need reining in, and the reality is that the Lords are the people in a position to do it.

So, an ad like this will remind Lords that groups representing thousands and thousands of people – charities, campaigners, voluntary groups – all support their attempt to make the gagging law less bad.

Will you chip in right now to make it happen?
https://secure.38degrees.org.uk/chip-in


It’s perhaps ironic that in a campaign that is all about protecting democracy, we end up relying on the unelected House of Lords. But the reality is that unless the House of Lords holds firm, the gagging law goes through. That would mean huge new restrictions on everyone’s freedom to speak up on the issues that matter.

And whatever you think about the House of Lords, these adverts would also tell a story that has been true throughout this campaign. The threat of the gagging law has brought all kinds of different people and organisations together. [2] We don’t all agree about everything. But we do all agree that everyone has the right to get organised and speak up for what they believe in. Let’s remind the House of Lords of that.'

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I'm worried and kinda upset over this stuff as many of you know of me, so if you passionately disagree with my aims here could you be gentle or open another thread to counter rather than destroy my part n attempts to get this problem sorted.

Thanks.
 
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I haven't read into the specifics of the legislation, but any
 
Nice bit of waffle but lacking in facts. What do you think this "gagging law" is about what are the actual facts?
 
Won't somebody PLEASE think of the children :p
 
Still doesn't really tell me what you are on about, just were this group you linked to is, with some law relating to the general elections.
 
Hummmm... Many who used to slag off our upper chamber are now counting on them to challenge our MPs. Ironic or what.


Thank you for your interest. The campaign you requested does not exist, is disabled or has expired.
Link followed - not impressed.
 
Now it makes sense, with the additional links, and yes I do find it worrying. Not sure what can be done at this late stage apart from hope the HOL see sense.
 
Apologies everyone for being an idiot this morning not including any useful info first time round.

I was overrun with work and then this news arrived and I thought laters would have been too late so slapped it up in panic.

Thank you everyone for the consideration, If you have made a donation you are part of the solution. The good news is everyone emailed this morning got a bit passionate about donating and we've already managed to pay for the full page ads in all the big papers. Including the likes of. The Telegraph, The Guardian, The Independent and the i. The 38Degrees team estimates that's well over a million readers will see them tomorrow morning.

It will look something like this.
1779740_10153769052065788_1918868771_n.jpg



Fingerscrossed we will be listened too.


I haven't read into the specifics of the legislation, but any

... any restriction to free speech is bad?

Won't somebody PLEASE think of the children :p

Hilarious.

:p

Hummmm... Many who used to slag off our upper chamber are now counting on them to challenge our MPs. Ironic or what.
Link followed - not impressed.

Do we have another choice?
Ironic, hypocrite, tell me that's not how it All is nowadays. I'd suggest a polite an even playing field does not exist for them any more, so neither will it for for us when we play against them.

All the links work fine for me. but sorry about that if its my end, I don't care if you're impressed or not. ;)


Now it makes sense, with the additional links, and yes I do find it worrying. Not sure what can be done at this late stage apart from hope the HOL see sense.

(y) :)
 
Your link worked fine but it only took us to the begging page. The link from there to information about the specific campaign failed.
 
it seems it was voted on last night and came out as a draw ,so the government wins ,how convenient
 
I was 24 hours out of date when I wrote that first post, it was in fact a very late email from the afternoon Monday, but arrived yesterday morning instead.

So my donation and anyone from TP will go into the charities pot to be used another day because the ads where already funded by the time I got that email.

Presumably many of you saw the ads yesterday?

As Jeff said above they voted last night and it came out a flat draw which unfortunately means the government wins and the gagging order goes through as near original, and not with the needed improvements.

The mood of the executives at 38 degrees is very gloomy, many have spent 24/7 for years building to this point. Many now feel this is the end for democracy. It is the final nail in the coffin.

Hundreds of charities, 160,000 signatures. And now most of 38degrees members agree, the public's opinion just doesn't get heard any more, and now this gag has gone through we will never have to be heard again. The end.




Apologies for messing you all about with my late post. To be honest I'm so flipped off about this right now I would be tempted not to care.
thanks for not havin too much of a go tpers.
 
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The status quo dictates that the rich and powerful always get richer and more powerful and the poor always get poorer and lose what little power they had, it has always been so.
Any attempts to protect freedoms of the ordinary person are always doomed to failure, simply because the people who make the decisions always have a vested interest and always look after their own interests.

In the past, organised religion did their bit to keep the people in their place, and even got us to sing about it:) Here's part of "All things bright and beautiful"
The rich man in his castle,
The poor man at his gate,
God made them high and lowly,
And ordered their estate.
Now, religion has less influence and politicians, of all persuasions, have taken on the job of keeping people down.
Of course, our system has a lot of built in safeguards to prevent abuse of power - things like Judicial Reviews, the right to sue, the right to complain about injustices and official misconduct etc - but only the rich can afford the legal routes, legal aid for these kind of actions has now all but disappeared, and the 'long stop' complaints procedures are just an empty shell.

The only thing that's changed in the last 50 years or so is that those who are in power now go through the motions of actually caring.
 
Just a note, this thread does not fall foul of our "No politics" request. That rule is designed to prevent a "This party is better than your party".
Just because this discusses politicians and a political situation doesn't mean it falls foul of our rules.....
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Continue :)
 
In reality, what actually can be done?
In theory, our democracy allows us to form our own political party, become the majority in parliament and change the laws. Yeah, right...
I've had some experience of politicians over the years, years ago it was as a charity trustee, and the only politicians I found to be actually effective were also totally corrupt.
During last 18 months or so I've had contact with other politicians, one of these was actually prepared to help as long as it didn't involve making waves.
The other one - well, my son is having to sue her for libel. Her defence is in two parts, firstly that she didn't say the things that she is recorded as saying on a public broadcast and secondly that if she did say them, she wasn't acting in her official capacity. However, the fact(?) that she wasn't acting in her official capacity stopped her using public money (her department's legal department) to fund her case.
That's unlawful, so I complained to the Committee that's supposed to supervise her, their decision was to ask her to advise them on the propriety of her own actions...

So, democracy doesn't work, that leaves us with revolution. No thanks.
 
Democracy and capitalism work fine ish for years didn't it? ..Its our governments control of the reins which has been lost to an investment bankers dream of utopia...And thats pretty much all we have left right now I agree.

What can be done? ...well anything we set our minds too is how we used to answer that question.

1. Awaken everyone to the fact that investment banking type trading is sucking us, and the world dry, it must all be taken down, forever. (along with other trading middleman manipulations)
2. Ensure nobody asks what can be done and instead asks what is being done. and why isn't it done yet?
3. Find NEW ways to get our voices heard.

You can be sure I think, that changing our government will cure nothing of any real importance, we'd soon be back to square one if we didn't fix the real problem!
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Personally I believe that the whole money supply industry is evil; it's based on lending non-existent money to people who can't afford the pay the interest and who, usually, are borrowing money for things that they don't need anyway. And of course, the interest charged is the basic cause of inflation, because the amount paid in interest is the only real element of the transaction.

But, it's here to stay. Politicians the world over have made a fortune through allowing it to grow, virtually without effective regulation.

I don't believe that capatalism and democracy have ever "worked fine". It doesn't work now for the same reason that many marriages don't las t - people have much higher expectations today than in the past, and become dissatisfied when things don't work out as they expect. The entire system is grossly unfair but now, because of higher expectations, we very naively expect it to actually be fair. The entire legal and financial system is geared heavily in favour of the rich and powerful, this is inevitable partly because the people who control the systems also benefit from the way they control it, and partly because only the wealthy can afford to fight in the Courts
 
I do agree. Capitalism has become multi-national and knows no allegiance to anything but achieving more and more profit for its shareholders. The 85 richest people in the world own more wealth than the 3 billion poorest people combined, according to an Oxfam report on global inequality
It has gone too far!
 
Spot on guys.

Its not here to stay, if we all turned to look clearly at the problem itself, the news and dribble we get fed by our so called journalists would change. Why? because we're not listening anymore and they want to sell news!

For example maybe just a year ago this thread would have been filled with accusations of conspiracy theory nonsense.
Yet today we have none. :)


We can use capitalism itself to be heard, voting with our pockets, legs, hands, eyes and ears....think about it.
 
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In the past, organised religion did their bit to keep the people in their place, and even got us to sing about it:) Here's part of "All things bright and beautiful"

Ah but "the meek shall inherit the earth" :)
 
Ah but "the meek shall inherit the earth" :)

Indeed... but just not in this lifetime !

Promise them everything in the next, but keep the peasants under control in this one. :) it's worked for quite a few centuries so far...
 
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