I have a picture selected for publication

hashcake

hashcake

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Darran, Daz or ****
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'I am writing to let you know that one of your photos has
been short-listed for inclusion in the sixth edition of our
Schmap London Guide, to be published early March 2009.'

Although there is no payment involved, I get full recognition as the photographer and a link to my flickr account.
The email came out of the blue and I am more than willing to let them publish the photo.
Fingers crossed they select it :)
 
Im not going to rant on but I know someone will. You should get money tbh. They are making money from you. Ill say no more.
 
Have to agree with both comments above.

As long as you're happy.
 
:agree: They are going to start a rant etc about how you should be getting paid for it, but don't let it take the shine of your achievement.

Just sit back and enjoy the feeling of how someone likes your image enough to want to publish it.

Congratulations.
 
Enjoy and ignore all the doom and gloom money comes before everything merchants that will be along shortly. Congrats on the recognition.
 
Moz said:
Oh well done on being picked though! lol
Link to the photo?
Click to expand...

2792792463_d8f0221f4e.jpg


Nothing special but as a newbie to photography just being chosen is nice.

I agree about the comments with regard to payment and as it's the first time I don't mind.
However, if it happens again in the future I won't agree unless there is a payment involved.
 
hashcake said:
However, if it happens again in the future I won't agree unless there is a payment involved.
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Well that's progress! Everytime you give a picture away for free you devalue your own work. If it's good enough to publish (and it is) you should insist on payment. Pointless saying more.
 
i think that the buzz of getting someone to print / recognise the pic is great. recently sold something to a colleague at work and only covered my costs because was so happy that they liked the pic enough to use it

for me personaly appreciaton first, money last


nice clean picture. Hope they print it nice and big
 
Anyone can give stuff away.....many pictures are chosen because they are free, how is that an achievment?

Competitions are different, but be careful about being duped into handing over ALL RIGHTS to the organisers...many use competitions to steal your pictures for their commercial use - the terms will tell you.
 
It must be depressing when the doom and gloom merchants come along to tell you you should be paid. And here's another!

I can understand the thrill involved when you see your picture in print. It may well be that at some stage in the future it could lead to better things.

But by giving your pictures away you do devalue your own work and that of ALL photographers.

It is a fact!

It is not a matter of being mercenary, but who else in this publication is not being paid? The writers? No. The editors? No. The design people? No. The printers? No. The distributors? No. Retail? No.

It's just crazy.
 
Congrats on getting published for the first time.. its special the first time so enjoy every minute :)
 
jerry12953 said:
But by giving your pictures away you do devalue your own work and that of ALL photographers.
Click to expand...

I can't devalue my work by giving it away for free (and I have). I don't value photo's in pounds and pence I value them in terms of what photography gives to me as a hoby and that my friend is something that cannot be bought and would be lost the instant money changed hands.

I also cannot devalue the work of another photographer, they set there own value and that is there business.
 
Wow, if I had known that this would have attracted so many comments about payment I don't think I would have started this thread.
I don't deny that they are going to make money off the back of this and I certainly don't have any intention of devaluing my work or any photographers pro or amateur
It’s a one off that gives me a good feeling that proves something special to me personally.
I’d never consider my photos to be of the standard for publishing but it proves me wrong.
It also instils confidence in me to pursue the avenue for getting paid for my photos.
If this was a high profile publication there is no chance I would have agreed to the prospect of them publishing it for free.
 
Congrats :thumbs: now you will be able to advertise yourself as a published photographer with that warm feeling inside ... it can be worth more than money for a beginner :)
 
a1ex2001 said:
I can't devalue my work by giving it away for free (and I have). I don't value photo's in pounds and pence I value them in terms of what photography gives to me as a hoby and that my friend is something that cannot be bought and would be lost the instant money changed hands.

I also cannot devalue the work of another photographer, they set there own value and that is there business.
Click to expand...

Well said, I agree 100%
 
It feel great having one of your pics selected for anything, for the first few times. Then when you look more closely at things you realise that you have been used.

If you click on the user name of the person who flickr mailed you, you will see an image with hundreds of replies. I bet that is only a tiny proportion of those that have been thrilled enough to agree without much thought. These people actively seek out gullible people, to make money from them. Using the fact that they are not a pro to give them an ego boost in order to gain without having to pay a penny.

IMO if it were a worthwhile publication to have any images in, you would surely be the one sending images to them for inclusion.

I see a person sitting searching though flickr. They type in a term for some place that they have yet to publish. Now up pops hundreds of pic of ... The London Eye, lets say. The person then proceeds to mass email those with higher quality 'snapshots' of the Eye whilst purposefully passing all the 'pro' quality ones by. They wouldn't be able to get those for free would they? If they have to pay for an image that means less revenue for them. It's a selfish exercise that uses other peoples naievity for their own gain. I hate them! Damn right I deleted the email I got from them!

Sorry to be some of the rain on your parade ... but it seems such a shame to see so many people be taken in by this carp. I'm not saying you should demand money from them, but instead I would politely decline their 'offer' if it's not too late. There is no reason for anyone else to profit from you if you don't make a profit yourself.
 
hashcake said:
Wow, if I had known that this would have attracted so many comments about payment I don't think I would have started this thread..
Click to expand...

All good news like this seems to get a simmilar response.


Personally I don think its a good idea to have a go at a man who owns a dog thats bigger than him :)
<------------------
 
hashcake said:
Wow, if I had known that this would have attracted so many comments about payment I don't think I would have started this thread.
I don't deny that they are going to make money off the back of this and I certainly don't have any intention of devaluing my work or any photographers pro or amateur
It’s a one off that gives me a good feeling that proves something special to me personally.
I’d never consider my photos to be of the standard for publishing but it proves me wrong.
It also instils confidence in me to pursue the avenue for getting paid for my photos.
If this was a high profile publication there is no chance I would have agreed to the prospect of them publishing it for free.
Click to expand...

The lack of money changing hands is not what really bothers me about these people. It's the way they go about obtaining images that really P's me off.

But if it honestly does make you feel good, then power to you, and enjoy :)
 
...aaaaaand away we go again! :rolleyes:

I wonder how many people on here take photos of friends and family, get them printed, and then give them away as presents or for no charge?

No wonder Olan Mills went out of business eh? :whistling:

For crying out loud, if they OP wants to give his picture to the publication for free, that's his look out. It doesn't make anyone else do it.

Well done on getting the picture in print hashcake :clap::thumbs:
 
Jo said:
It feel great having one of your pics selected for anything, for the first few times. Then when you look more closely at things you realise that you have been used.

If you click on the user name of the person who flickr mailed you, you will see an image with hundreds of replies. I bet that is only a tiny proportion of those that have been thrilled enough to agree without much thought. These people actively seek out gullible people, to make money from them. Using the fact that they are not a pro to give them an ego boost in order to gain without having to pay a penny.

IMO if it were a worthwhile publication to have any images in, you would surely be the one sending images to them for inclusion.

I see a person sitting searching though flickr. They type in a term for some place that they have yet to publish. Now up pops hundreds of pic of ... The London Eye, lets say. The person then proceeds to mass email those with higher quality 'snapshots' of the Eye whilst purposefully passing all the 'pro' quality ones by. They wouldn't be able to get those for free would they? If they have to pay for an image that means less revenue for them. It's a selfish exercise that uses other peoples naievity for their own gain. I hate them! Damn right I deleted the email I got from them!

Sorry to be some of the rain on your parade ... but it seems such a shame to see so many people be taken in by this carp. I'm not saying you should demand money from them, but instead I would politely decline their 'offer' if it's not too late. There is no reason for anyone else to profit from you if you don't make a profit yourself.
Click to expand...


I understand perfectly why they target people like me, I'm certainly not naive.
However, I know they wouldn't even consider publishing the photo if I asked for payment.
Does this one off bother me?
No, not in the slightest, if they do decided to publish it I will get a) a fantastic feeling of self acheivement and b) be really proud to be able to show it to friends and family.

If they had stolen the picture without seeking permission, then I would have gone hell for leather at them.

As I have previously stated, this is strictly a one off 'freebie' just so I can get my first picture published.
I know enough about business (having started 2 successful businesses in the past), to know when to draw a line.
 
Congratulations on being selected, it would be a lot better knowing yours was the best picture they chose rather than the best free one they could find. Wayne
 
KIPAX said:
Personally I don think its a good idea to have a go at a man who owns a dog thats bigger than him :)
<------------------
Click to expand...

Lol, unfortunately she was put to sleep two years ago.
Even though we currently own fantastic two dogs, she has been my favourite through my life of living with / owning dogs.
Just don’t tell the other mutts :)
 
hashcake said:
I understand perfectly why they target people like me, I'm certainly not naive.
However, I know they wouldn't even consider publishing the photo if I asked for payment.
Does this one off bother me?
No, not in the slightest, if they do decided to publish it I will get a) a fantastic feeling of self acheivement and b) be really proud to be able to show it to friends and family.

If they had stolen the picture without seeking permission, then I would have gone hell for leather at them.

As I have previously stated, this is strictly a one off 'freebie' just so I can get my first picture published.
I know enough about business (having started 2 successful businesses in the past), to know when to draw a line.
Click to expand...

I agree. I would love to get an image published. It shows that you are heading in the right direction with your photography and you can be confident in your abilities to charge in future.
Well done that man1:thumbs:
 
Is everyone looking to make money from photography? Please don't tell me I'm the last forum member left doing this for the love of it?
 
swanseamale47 said:
Congratulations on being selected, it would be a lot better knowing yours was the best picture they chose rather than the best free one they could find. Wayne
Click to expand...

Well the potential of being the best free one makes me feel I have the potential to take photos I can charge for in the future.
 
a1ex2001 said:
I can't devalue my work by giving it away for free (and I have). I don't value photo's in pounds and pence I value them in terms of what photography gives to me as a hoby and that my friend is something that cannot be bought and would be lost the instant money changed hands.

I also cannot devalue the work of another photographer, they set there own value and that is there business.
Click to expand...

There is a difference between the value that you place on your work, and the value of photography generally. Please do understand that.

Try to take away the personal aspect of this. It may seem like the moaners and groaners are just being miserable and denying the amateur of his/her moment of glory. But its not really that.

Imagine any other commodity. Not bread or potatoes or beer but something with a high intrinsic value, let's just call it gold dust.

If suddenly the market was flooded with gold-dust, available for free or minimal cost, would anyone value or even want it any more? If there was an almost unlimited amount of it around, why would they?

This is what has happened in photography in the last few years.

I sometimes give my photographs away as well, believe it or not. But only to support causes that I believe in, which can gain benefit from them at no cost to myself. It doesn't give me a warm glow to see them in print. I do it because I want to help.

a1ex, you have a very idealistic attitude and in some ways that's very commendable. But can you not see how frustrating it is for others who are trying to maintain the value of photography?
 
I was recently present when a photographer advised a "newbie" how they could break into the world of pro photography.

Offer your pictures to the ".........shire Life" magazine. You won't get paid, but it would get your foot in the door. You could then start charging. (I paraphrase)

But would they pay? I doubt it. They'd just use the next set of free photographs that were offered to them. :shake:
 
jerry12953 said:
I sometimes give my photographs away as well, believe it or not. But only to support causes that I believe in, which can gain benefit from them at no cost to myself. It doesn't give me a warm glow to see them in print. I do it because I want to help.
Click to expand...
They, presumably, make money off the back of those photographs as well?

As such, how is that any different? :shrug:
 
Congrats on being chosen hashcake :D :thumbs:

These threads always end up the same way with the same people repeating the same thing. It's a shame really in my opinion, seems some people just can't see the flip side.

I have allowed use by schmap myself a few times, as I see it it is a nice free advert for me. They link to my flickr account, allow whatever credit I like to be put below the pic and my watermark (url) is on all my photos. All they are doing is saving someone going "hmm I wonder what sites there are in *wherever* I will go look through Flickr" - instead they have a little box of thumbnails of selected photos that show off that place well (in the eyes of schmap).

In my opinion they aren't making any money directly from my photos. The photos are one very small part of their site.

I don't think it has de-valued my work at all. I have still sold prints and photos for publication. If anything I see it as showing my work to a wider audience!
 
jerry12953 said:
There is a difference between the value that you place on your work, and the value of photography generally. Please do understand that.

Try to take away the personal aspect of this. It may seem like the moaners and groaners are just being miserable and denying the amateur of his/her moment of glory. But its not really that.

Imagine any other commodity. Not bread or potatoes or beer but something with a high intrinsic value, let's just call it gold dust.

If suddenly the market was flooded with gold-dust, available for free or minimal cost, would anyone value or even want it any more? If there was an almost unlimited amount of it around, why would they?

This is what has happened in photography in the last few years.

I sometimes give my photographs away as well, believe it or not. But only to support causes that I believe in, which can gain benefit from them at no cost to myself. It doesn't give me a warm glow to see them in print. I do it because I want to help.

a1ex, you have a very idealistic attitude and in some ways that's very commendable. But can you not see how frustrating it is for others who are trying to maintain the value of photography?
Click to expand...

What you have just described is a free market economy based on supply and demand. Supply has gone through the roof in the photo industry so price has dropped like a stone, to the point in some circumstances the going rate is free. Your example with gold is spot on, it's currently worth alot because there isn't much of it however if I found an unlimited supply in my back garden tomorrow the price would drop through the floor this is the reason that iron isn't sold by the gram. If you want to sell at above market rates then you need to add value hence a good ring can be worth more than it's weight in gold, if a phtographer wants to make serious money they need to be offering products that the average weekend shooter can't match be that in terms of quality, service or any other factor that effects price. Crying on internet forums will not turn the dial back 20 years to when stock pictures could make you a living.

Photography doesn't have an intrinsic value it has a price set by the market and that has become a very cut throat low price market with the advent of cheap DSLR's and the internet. Pro togs will have to adapt and overcome as a good business pers must as stock prices are not going to increase significantly anytime soon.

I don't have an idealistic attitude I've just learn't from the mistake of turning a hobby I enjoy into a job I don't! Photography is my hiding place and long may it continue.
 
AliB said:
It's called charity Simmontino.
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I'm well aware of that Ali, but my point is the photo was given away for free to a company that will make money off the back of it.

Now whether it's a cause you believe in or not, there is no difference in both this and the OP's scenario when it comes to 'devaluing photography' by giving away images for free.

The fact it is for a cause you believe in makes no difference in that respect, and renders the (now extremely tired) argument of giving away stuff for free as being something the professionals would never do because they need to maintain the worth of an image as null and void IMO.

In fact, I'd go so far as to say is stinks of hypocricy.
 
a1ex2001 said:
What you have just described is a free market economy based on supply and demand. Supply has gone through the roof in the photo industry so price has dropped like a stone, to the point in some circumstances the going rate is free. Your example with gold is spot on, it's currently worth alot because there isn't much of it however if I found an unlimited supply in my back garden tomorrow the price would drop through the floor this is the reason that iron isn't sold by the gram. If you want to sell at above market rates then you need to add value hence a good ring can be worth more than it's weight in gold, if a phtographer wants to make serious money they need to be offering products that the average weekend shooter can't match be that in terms of quality, service or any other factor that effects price. Crying on internet forums will not turn the dial back 20 years to when stock pictures could make you a living.

Photography doesn't have an intrinsic value it has a price set by the market and that has become a very cut throat low price market with the advent of cheap DSLR's and the internet. Pro togs will have to adapt and overcome as a good business pers must as stock prices are not going to increase significantly anytime soon.

I don't have an idealistic attitude I've just learn't from the mistake of turning a hobby I enjoy into a job I don't! Photography is my hiding place and long may it continue.
Click to expand...


You are entitled to your opinions, but I do object to the word "crying".

How else does one attempt to change photographers minds?
 
So instead of giving money he gives images...............That's actually recognising that the images DO have value.

Of course the charity makes money from the images, that's the whole point. But it's what they do with the money that is different. One gives it to good causes for the benefit of others while the other makes profit for it's shareholders if it's a company.

That's a huge difference and hardly hypocritial IMHO.
 
AliB said:
So instead of giving money he gives images...............

Of course the charity makes money from the images, that's the whole point. But it's what they do with the money that is different. One gives it to good causes for the benefit of others while the other makes profit for it's shareholders if it's a company.

That's a huge difference and hardly hypocritial IMHO.
Click to expand...

Thanks.:)
 
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