How best to support the continued supply of film

The best way to support the continued supply of film for photographers is to:

  • Shoot double the 35mm I already shoot

    Votes: 6 60.0%

  • Same for 120mm

    Votes: 1 10.0%

  • Same for Large Format

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Go and watch movies that are filmed on film

    Votes: 3 30.0%
  • Total voters
    10
moggi1964

moggi1964

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I'm watching Mat Marrash (Large Format Friday youtube) and he was giving some insights into the provision of film stock and talking about the Cinestill crowdfunder. He expressed his views on the best way to keep a supply of film stock being available going forward. So I thought I would run some options by you and see what you think he said was the best way. The Poll questions only apply to new film not expired stock.
 
It's a difficult one. I tend to shoot the films I like, not out of any sense of need to "keep it going". I see little point in shooting a film I don't like (i.e. Cinestill) just for the sake of it. I think a lot of the (mostly colour) films are a bit gimmicky. Stuff like the Lomo variants, Street Candy, JCH and others. That's probably down to my inability to make my photos work within the constraints of the colour shifts they offer. But then, perhaps the hipster popularity of gimmicky colour films is what's helping the resurgence and allows grumpy old farts like me to continue to shoot HP5 and Tri-X in peace.

In short - I haven't really thought about it :)
 
Pray that they all follow Fuji and so maintain a fruitful profit margin to fund parties and p*** ups to ensure that film production costs are adequately covered.:exit:
 
I'll have to watch the video - or does this contravene option 4 in the poll? :D

The other three options are effectively the same - go out and buy more film. I acknowledge that I am not going to be of much use in keeping film going as:

1. I genuinely don't get on with colour. I've never learned how to handle colours - or perhaps I should say I've never learned how to control colours in the same way that I can control black and white to give an image that pleases me. I find the extra variables too difficult to control.

2. I don't like the technical quality that goes with 35mm film, given that I like to be able to produce prints at at least 12x16/A3 size.

3. I'll use 120 if I want to travel light, or photograph quickly.

4. By far my favourite formats are large format, with a preference for 5x7 for general photography, and 10x8 otherwise. I'm finding 5x4 a little small now...

Given that LF requires a little more set up time per image, I'm not going to find it easy to increase how much film I use.

I do however accept that given the costs inherent in film production, and the machinery needed to produce a mass produced product, there is a minimum usage below which film could only be produced at a loss. Makers may be happy to accept smaller profits because they genuinely love film, but it's always on the cards that smaller sales volumes will make continuation impossible (say, when an expensive machine reaches end of life and can't be repaired).

Ultimately, we may go back to the origins of photography, and manufacture our own plates, either wet or dry.

I haven't voted, because I can't see any essential difference between the first three options.
 
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I’ll attempt to double my LF film usage if an additional half dozen sheets /annually will help support the manufactures ( based on present consummation)

Every little helps I suppose.
 
I used to think that coming back from a fortnight in Scotland with 15 sheets exposed was good going...

But I accept that Edward Weston was more of a machine gun photographer.
 
Maybe buy the film that has the best chance of being around a few years from now? Fuji Superia 400 was always my favourite general purpose colour film, but I suspect Fuji are now just eking out a dwindling supply they aren't going to replace. In that case, should I be buying my colour film from Kodak, or perhaps from a company that is using InovisCoat? (assuming they survive the latest post-Agfa restructuring). B&W seems in a healthier and more diverse state, but again it might be sensible to support the companies that are likely to be in it for the long haul - Ilford looks like a good bet.
 
Can I say that there is no option to keep personal film consumption much as it is. I can't force myself to say, double, my film usage. I only take about 60 films a year, in total. Maybe when I retire I will be able to find time to shoot more.

Perhaps the best option we have is to keep using film and hope for the best.
 
I just bought another twenty rolls of HP5 - every little helps . . . ;)
 
PeterSpencer said:
Perhaps the best option we have is to keep using film and hope for the best.
Click to expand...

My plan B was to make sure I had a 10x8 camera and the necessary information downloaded to make my own wet plates if the worst happened.
 
Anybody with a film camera probably picks and chooses their shots. So doubling the amount of film you shoot isn't really going to help. It would only make you more miserable and be a good way of doubling your costs. The only thing you can do is dump the hippies and support the strongest runner. Not Kodak, they ought to be able to sort themselves out, and if they can't that's unfortunate, but companies like Ilford certainly.
 
Plain Nev said:
Anybody with a film camera probably picks and chooses their shots. So doubling the amount of film you shoot isn't really going to help. It would only make you more miserable and be a good way of doubling your costs. The only thing you can do is dump the hippies and support the strongest runner. Not Kodak, they ought to be able to sort themselves out, and if they can't that's unfortunate, but companies like Ilford certainly.
Click to expand...

Wholeheartedly agree.
 
If there is enough demand for film the manufacturers will try to supply it, but the future looks a little bleak to me. Prices will only get worse unless a lot more people start shooting a lot more film. Then there is the issue of camera repair and replacement. The future will tell.
 
I was gonna wait a few more days but b****r it. His opinion is that the best way to support the continuing supply of film is:

Go watch film based movies at the cinema because 98% of film usage is for movies and not photography. If we support films being made with film then there will be more investment in film and photographers will benefit as a result.

If film movies die, film will die.
 
moggi1964 said:
I was gonna wait a few more days but b****r it. His opinion is that the best way to support the continuing supply of film is:

Go watch film based movies at the cinema because 98% of film usage is for movies and not photography. If we support films being made with film then there will be more investment in film and photographers will benefit as a result.

If film movies die, film will die.
Click to expand...
The next TP filmie meet up will be held in the Leeds showcase cinema :p:exit:
 
moggi1964 said:
I was gonna wait a few more days but b****r it. His opinion is that the best way to support the continuing supply of film is:

Go watch film based movies at the cinema because 98% of film usage is for movies and not photography. If we support films being made with film then there will be more investment in film and photographers will benefit as a result.

If film movies die, film will die.
Click to expand...
Interesting. Not being a cinema goer, I didn't realise how many black and white films were being made.
 
I did an inventory on my stash yesterday and, if I decided to just use up what I have and not buy any more (HAHAHAHAHAAA), I've probably got enough to last me three years at my current rate of shooting.

I'm already tempted by the Kodak Gold offer thet @Peter B has posted above, despite not even having shot a roll of the pack I got from Analogue Wonderland yet! Help me!

Oddy, despite B&W being my preferred choice, I actually have much more colour film in my stash. Also, only about a third of the whole stash is in date, the rest varies from a year past it's use-by date, to... erm... 47 years past it's best. :D
 
dmb said:
Newer than what is in one of my bulk loaders, Kodak Double X cine stock, expired 1955. Has lovely fungus textures.
Click to expand...

I only have a single roll of the 1975 stuff, and it's some weird Trifca stock that I think uses some sort of extinct development process, It might be remjet-backed too!

After that I leap forward to a fresh roll of Plus-X Pan from 1988. :)
 
StephenM said:
Interesting. Not being a cinema goer, I didn't realise how many black and white films were being made.
Click to expand...
And colour too.

He calculated that one minute of movie filming (and that might not be usable action) equates to approx. 18 rolls of 35mm film. He describes photographic usage as a bucket in the Olympic swimming pool that is filled with motion picture filming. Based on my research you can estimate about 9500 equivalent rolls of 35mm film for a 2 hour movie allowing for all the multiple takes and reshoots and other stuff that goes on.

So check and see if your cinema is projecting on 35mm film (likely a small local rather than an Odeon I suspect but don't know).
 
I'll admit that I hadn't realised the figures involved. Given that I effectively only use black and white film, and my continued use of film depends on companies like Ilford, Foma and Adox I just didn't expect that most of their production goes to Hollywood or wherever film is bought for the cinema.
 
It's worth noting that even movies shot digitally will still use film for archiving, and that popular digitally shot movies will often have film prints produced for the theatres without digital projectors. On a similar note, movies shot on film will be converted to digital for distribution - as well as editing and other post processing (such as visual effect addition).
 
I'm reading that Wonder Woman 2017 was shot mostly on film but then they digitise it and send it to the cinemas on a kind of hard drive.
 
moggi1964 said:
I'm reading that Wonder Woman 2017 was shot mostly on film but then they digitise it and send it to the cinemas on a kind of hard drive.
Click to expand...
... something most people on this forum can probably relate to
 
moggi1964 said:
I'm reading that Wonder Woman 2017 was shot mostly on film but then they digitise it and send it to the cinemas on a kind of hard drive.
Click to expand...
I haven’t visited a cinema in donkeys years.

If transféréd to a digital hardrive , does it still retain the brief section where the film sprockets and numbers get shown on screen before the film actually begins or is it now edited to be perfectly boring?:rolleyes:

I guess the days when the projector spool jammed , giving us kids an excuse to buy and eat more popcorn whilst the problem was resolved, are no more.:confused:

I used to daydream at school looking forward to Saturday morning visits to the local cinema.
 
Stop it stop it!, :LOL:I can’t stop thinking about small tubs of vanilla or raspberry ripple ice-cream that we’re served with a wooden spatula type spoony thing during the interval :giggle:
 
Peter B said:
Here you go Asha :D
Click to expand...
Then again, we could change the words to "Members of the F&C" and promise to sing the song while out with our cameras? And it would be shoot the films instead of seeing them? Just a thought :film:
 
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Peter B said:
Then again, we could change the words to "Members of the F&C" and I could promise to sing the song while out with our cameras whilst you lot watch and laugh ?And it would be shoot the films instead of seeing them? Just a thought :film:
Click to expand...
:wave::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
 
StephenM said:
I'll have to watch the video - or does this contravene option 4 in the poll? :D

The other three options are effectively the same - go out and buy more film. I acknowledge that I am not going to be of much use in keeping film going as:

1. I genuinely don't get on with colour. I've never learned how to handle colours - or perhaps I should say I've never learned how to control colours in the same way that I can control black and white to give an image that pleases me. I find the extra variables too difficult to control.

2. I don't like the technical quality that goes with 35mm film, given that I like to be able to produce prints at at least 12x16/A3 size.

3. I'll use 120 if I want to travel light, or photograph quickly.

4. By far my favourite formats are large format, with a preference for 5x7 for general photography, and 10x8 otherwise. I'm finding 5x4 a little small now...

Given that LF requires a little more set up time per image, I'm not going to find it easy to increase how much film I use.

I do however accept that given the costs inherent in film production, and the machinery needed to produce a mass produced product, there is a minimum usage below which film could only be produced at a loss. Makers may be happy to accept smaller profits because they genuinely love film, but it's always on the cards that smaller sales volumes will make continuation impossible (say, when an expensive machine reaches end of life and can't be repaired).

Ultimately, we may go back to the origins of photography, and manufacture our own plates, either wet or dry.

I haven't voted, because I can't see any essential difference between the first three options.
Click to expand...
Would love Adox to fix their 120 machine!
How many A3 prints per year do you make?
 
moggi1964 said:
... Based on my research you can estimate about 9500 equivalent rolls of 35mm film for a 2 hour movie allowing for all the multiple takes and reshoots and other stuff that goes on.
Click to expand...
I was going to say, 9,500 is a surprisingly small number, probably less than the annual output of (say) 50 not very prolific film photographers... but then in a later post, someone mentioned prints (of the films, for distribution, rather than our kind of prints), and I guess the sky's the limit there...
 
ChrisR said:
I was going to say, 9,500 is a surprisingly small number, probably less than the annual output of (say) 50 not very prolific film photographers... but then in a later post, someone mentioned prints (of the films, for distribution, rather than our kind of prints), and I guess the sky's the limit there...
Click to expand...

There is a lot of film used throughout the movie making process, especially when making duplicates for distribution. See the post from Earl Dingman (scroll down the page) here: https://www.quora.com/How-much-film-is-used-in-a-2-hour-movie
 
acrobatic_Citron said:
Would love Adox to fix their 120 machine!
How many A3 prints per year do you make?
Click to expand...

Not as many as I used to, or would like to. I don't make many exposures (large format tends to make you more selective) and obviously the last two years have not been conducive to being out and about. Before then, it would probably be one or two a month - and some would be A2.
 
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