Fuji RAW processing?

Lensflare

Lensflare

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Simon Everett
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I have been looking - for weeks. I can't seem to find anything that helps with my very basic knowledge of the process of RAW editing - I use the NX2 for Nikon conversions and it works as well as I need it to - plus it is simple for a dunce like me to use (I did buy a book on how to use it years ago, and I still refer to it from time to time when I have a mental block and can't remember what I am supposed to do).

If I were to change to the Fuji system, is there a RAW program with the camera that is any good (like the Nikon one is), and if not, what would be the sort of thing to consider for sorting out the RAWs please?

The google thing just wants to sell me anything and everything.

What would you recommend to a complete start up guy?
 
Bit of a mine field that one when it comes to Fuji raws!

You get a version of SilkyPix with the camera - I've not even installed it though as I've always used Lightroom to process Fuji raws. Perhaps start with that as it's free and see if you hit any limitations?

If you do want to branch out - therein lies the open can of worms. There's a lot of people who say Lightroom is terrible at processing Fuji raw files. You'll get a lot of people saying Capture One is the way to go, and a lot saying Irident developer / transformer is the way to go.

Even within the group who do support Lightroom, you'll find micro factions that support low sharpening setting, max detail and those who suggest the opposite.

The reality is there is no one set of settings what work for all types of images - you need to tune your approach accordingly and any of the tools will work, but this does give rise to massively conflicting opinions out there on the 'tinterweb if you're looking for a simple starting point.

As a standalone developer Iridient Developer is powerful and well regarded. If you're used to doing conversions via a specific converter (as you appear to be), you could do worse than start there perhaps?
If you want the integrated catalogue experience then LR / Capture One?
 
This is a real minefield and a field day for the pixel peepers.

There are lots of RAW conversion engines, some claim better results from one or another, but most people are fairly in agreement that compared with Lightroom their interfaces are pants.

To add confusion to the fire there are differences between RAW processing and the various X-Trans sensors

X-Trans 1: X-Pro 1, X-E1
X-Trans 2: X-T1, X-T10, X-E2, X-E2S
X-Trans 3: X-Pro2, X-T2, X-T20

Complaints range from worms in landscapes to waxy skin.

I've had all three X-Trans sensors, and currently shoot with an X-T2. I've used Lightroom all this time and have no complaints (I have used techniques described by Peter Bridgewater - search on web, to get the best out of the files within Lightroom)

On the whole there are less complaints about the X-Trans 3 sensors (the current generation)

I know this post doesn't really help, but the only way to try this out is to get some Fuji RAW files of the sort of stuff you shoot and process them (I understand that Fuji may be lending you some equipment so there is your chance!). That way you'll know if Fuji works for you.
 
I would start with the Fuji version of Silkypix and see what you think - it's a free download:
http://www.fujifilm.com/support/digital_cameras/software/myfinepix_studio/rfc/
There are plenty of raw Fuji sample files around to try with it. It's comparable in features to Nikon's software and is compatible with Fuji's film simulations.

Incidentally, Nikon now has better options than NX2, also free:
http://imaging.nikon.com/lineup/microsite/capturenxd/
http://imaging.nikon.com/lineup/software/viewnx-i/
 
Unless you are a masochist I would steer clear of Silkipix it is both complex and confusing.
Lightroom and photoshop work very well now. and are easy to use.
You can always convert them to DNG with the Adobe free DNG converter, and then they will open in anything with raw capability.
 
Thanks so far - what is DNG please? I have never heard of it...
 
GreenNinja67 said:
Digital negative.

JFGI
Click to expand...

Hahaha - that is ironic, because ever since I moved to digital capture, and not knowing a thing about altering them I always told people I shot DIGITAL TRANSPARENCIES - as in, you get it how it comes out of the camera, if you want to b****r about with it, that's up to you! No editing time for me and the picture editor / designer had to earn their corn. :D For the last (when did the D2X come out, that was when I first got digital camera) that is exactly how I have shot all my work - the odd job on RAW, but more for me than for the client - jpegs, straight out of the camera untouched. Where's me money....!! :banana:
 
my friend is a pro semi retired now and thats what he does, med jpeg, give us me money lol.
 
Lensflare said:
Thanks so far - what is DNG please? I have never heard of it...
Click to expand...

as has been said ...a DNG is a standard adobe digital negative... but it still needs tinkering with.and converting to a jpeg or tiff. for other people
 
I can't say I find Silkypix any more or less confusing than other raw developers. The only issue I've found is that it struggles with very large image directories on my system. DNG isn't normally necessary for up to date raw developers, which will read Fuji raws directly, though it provides compatibility with (e.g.) older versions of PS or LR that stopped being updated before your camera was released. The unusual non-Bayer format of Fuji files seems to be a bit of a challenge for third party developers - Iridient generally scores higher than Adobe in comparisons, though the full version is only available for Mac; for Windows they have a specialised Fuji-specific tool in beta that spits out DNG and is presumably designed to be used in combination with a traditional raw developer.
 
Best quality for me is capture one pro.

Very very good quality
 
Lensflare said:
I have been looking - for weeks. I can't seem to find anything that helps with my very basic knowledge of the process of RAW editing - I use the NX2 for Nikon conversions and it works as well as I need it to - plus it is simple for a dunce like me to use (I did buy a book on how to use it years ago, and I still refer to it from time to time when I have a mental block and can't remember what I am supposed to do).

If I were to change to the Fuji system, is there a RAW program with the camera that is any good (like the Nikon one is), and if not, what would be the sort of thing to consider for sorting out the RAWs please?

The google thing just wants to sell me anything and everything.

What would you recommend to a complete start up guy?
Click to expand...


Beta 4 now available with LR plugin

The Iridient X-Transformer 1.0 beta 4 update is now available for download! Iridient X-Transformer beta 4 is supported on both macOS 10.7 or later and 64-bit editions of Windows 7 or later.

The new version can be downloaded here:
http://www.iridientdigital.com/products/xtransformer_download.html

This release includes bug fixes, performance improvements and several new features. New feature highlights include:

1) An all new Lightroom scripting plug-in which for most users will likely be the preferred way of transferring images from Lightroom to X-Transformer and back as quickly and efficiently as possible. The plug-in requires no additional Preferences setup and avoids some of the limitations and unnecessary intermediate image processing applied by Lightroom when using "Edit In" . This plug-in also provides a quick and easy option to launch X-Transformer and bring it to front for settings adjustments prior to processing images.

To install the plug-in choose "Install Lightroom Plug-in" from the Help menu in Iridient X-Transformer.

2) The in-camera Fujifilm film style presets can now automatically be translated into Lightroom adjustment metadata such that the film style chosen in camera is also the initial Camera Profile selected when the DNG is opened into Lightroom/ACR. This feature is specific currently to Lightroom/ACR only and will not translate the film styles over to other RAW processors. This option currently is not turned on by default and can be found on the "DNG Options" panel.

3) The camera's star rating values are now translated into standard XMP metadata fields such that they will be loaded by Lightroom/ACR/Bridge and other programs that support standard star rating metadata.

4) There is now an option to embed an Iridient specific camera profile into the DNG. This "Iridient Standard" camera profile should be a slightly better match to the default camera profile used by Iridient Developer. However, due to inherent differences in the default profile formats used (ICC versus Adobe DCP) the match will not be exact. Lightroom also insists on defaulting to its own "Adobe Standard" camera profile regardless of what's embedded in the DNG so use of this profile in Lightroom requires manually selecting it after opening into Lightroom. For now the "Adobe Standard" camera profile remains the default.

If you encounter any issues with this beta please let me know at <support@iridientdigital.com> as soon as possible.

The full Iridient X-Transformer version history including detailed release notes for version 1.0 beta 4 can be viewed at my web site here:
http://www.iridientdigital.com/products/xtransformer_history.html

-----------------------------------------------------------

Brian Griffith
Iridient Digital, Inc.
http://www.iridientdigital.com/
 
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Blimey - thank you for posting all that. I am sure it is brilliant, but I have to admit, I don't have a clue what it all means. Is someone able to condense it into words that I might understand please?

What is a Beta 4
I think it means I need a new computer, mine is Windows 7, but about 5 or 6 years old now so probably too old? This is my NEW computer as well. I had hoped it would last me another 5 or 6 years yet.

With one of these 'downloads' (I have never downloaded anything in my life, not that I know of anyway) does that mean you have to pay a monthly fee and download it every month? I can't be doing with that. This computer was loaded with CD instructions for what is in it (NO gaming or any of that crap stuff on it, just my work stuff)

Will it work with my Capture NX2? Or have I got to buy Lightroom as well to make it all work?

It sounds as though changing camera is very much more complicated and involved than simply changing cameras!
Any and all help greatfully received (but not in the techy jargon like above, because I won't understand it).
Thanks.
 
Lensflare said:
Blimey - thank you for posting all that. I am sure it is brilliant, but I have to admit, I don't have a clue what it all means. Is someone able to condense it into words that I might understand please?

What is a Beta 4
I think it means I need a new computer, mine is Windows 7, but about 5 or 6 years old now so probably too old? This is my NEW computer as well. I had hoped it would last me another 5 or 6 years yet.

With one of these 'downloads' (I have never downloaded anything in my life, not that I know of anyway) does that mean you have to pay a monthly fee and download it every month? I can't be doing with that. This computer was loaded with CD instructions for what is in it (NO gaming or any of that crap stuff on it, just my work stuff)

Will it work with my Capture NX2? Or have I got to buy Lightroom as well to make it all work?

It sounds as though changing camera is very much more complicated and involved than simply changing cameras!
Any and all help greatfully received (but not in the techy jargon like above, because I won't understand it).
Thanks.
Click to expand...

Perhaps tell us in your own words what steps you currently take with your current setup from camera to finished photo and we can play back the options in similar terms / steps?
 
Furtim said:
Perhaps tell us in your own words what steps you currently take with your current setup from camera to finished photo and we can play back the options in similar terms / steps?
Click to expand...

Lensflare said:
jpegs, straight out of the camera untouched. Where's me money....!! :banana:
Click to expand...
 
I think it looks complicated because there are lots of different options! One of the simplest options is to click on the first link in my first post above, and follow the instructions. An installer for Fuji's own free Raw File Converter will be downloaded to your computer. Then you just have to run the installer. We can talk you through this process if you're uncertain about it. There is no charge or subscription to pay. The Fuji Raw File Converter is based on a well-known package called Silkypix (Fuji have contracted with the Silkypix developers to write it for them), but it's more limited - you can only use it to process Fuji raw files, not (e.g.) Nikon raw files. Similarly, your NX2 can't process Fuji files. So with this free option, you'll need two separate converters - Fuji Raw File Converter and Nikon NX2 - if you keep your Nikon. This is more or less what I do, except that I use a more recent (and free) Nikon converter, Capture NX-D. Both the Fuji and Nikon packages are complete - you don't need anything else to make a jpeg or a tiff.

Lots of other third party raw converters are available. Most of them, including Adobe Lightroom, will work on just about any raw file format, which can make things simpler for photographers with more than one system. Lightroom is available either for a single payment, or as part of a subscription from Adobe, and is a slick package that's also a good image file manager. But some people think Adobe doesn't do a great job on Fuji files, and prefer raw converters like Iridient. Since Iridient hasn't yet properly released any of their software for Windows, that isn't an option for you right now. You don't need to bother with DNG either, since this just adds an extra step - you'd still need to use a raw converter after DNG conversion.
 
Thank you Retune.....so what is the point of a DNG step in the entire process, just makes it more convoluted!

Yes, for the most part (98%) I shoot jpegs straight out of camera - I don't touch them because my computer is not calibrated to each different publishers system (and they probably don't calibrate across designers either - just each designer will calibrate their own screen to their own preference) - so if I fiddle, they are more than likely going to have to fiddle it back again, a total waste of time and if they get yellowish grass, it doesn't reflect well on me, so I leave it alone, that way you can't make mistakes - having cut my teeth on E6 film and handing it in (so you never saw what you shot unless you went and looked over the art editor's shoulder anyway) what came out of the camera HAD to be right - there was no second chance and DR was in the order of 6 or 7 stops. Getting it right in camera was critical - if you got it wrong with focus, timing or exposure - you got nothing. I have simply carried those skills over into the digital film and that is why I describe my shooting as 'digital trannies' - the Fuji film replication jpegs sound awefully like what I was doing for 20 odd years, that is another reason I like the sound of the Fuji rather than the Sony or Olympus.

For those few occassions I will try a RAW and have a play, I need something to do it with - but I am not going to spend hours editing and processing pictures.

My RAW to jpeg/TIFF system:
Load picture, it just shows up on the screen as a picture.
Assess highlights on graph and by eye - adjust exposure slider to suit if necessary.
Assess shadows having buggered everything up by sliding exposure!
Slide shadow recovery slider to suit.
Maybe tweek a bit on the contrast slider
Maybe tweek the saturation on the saturation slider
Add some focus using the low pass filter method that I copy step-by-step from the book because I can't remember it without looking!
Save As....to jpeg, choose folder, hit save!
 
If you get a Fuji, you might want to start out by shooting raw+jpeg, so you can compare. I find that the tiffs and jpegs that are produced by Raw File Converter (RFC) are close but not absolutely identical to the in-camera jpegs from my X100T. With RFC, Fuji also supports the film simulations in raw - by default, RFC will use the 'film' you set in-camera, but you can change it at raw development time.

Although it won't help you with RFC, DNG does have its uses, e.g.:

- Some cameras (Leica etc.) use it as their native format. Adobe was hoping everyone would do this, but it hasn't caught on that widely with camera manufacturers, who usually don't support in in their cameras or in their software (Nikon, Canon and Fuji don't). It's pretty widely supported by third party raw converters, though.

- If you have, say, a camera released in 2017 with a proprietary raw format but own an old copy of Lightroom that Adobe stopped updating in 2015, you wouldn't normally be able to process the raw files. But Adobe keeps the free DNG converter up to date, so you can just convert your raw file to DNG (which still contains raw image data) and then process it in the old software. If you subscribe to Adobe's cloud service this isn't an issue, of course, since Lightroom and Photoshop will always be the latest version.

- DNG lets you store reversible raw image edits etc. in the file itself. Nikon used to do something similar with their NEF format (in which case the edits are only visible to Nikon software), but their latest packages work differently, and store the edits separately.

- Iridient uses DNG files in an interesting way - one of their packages, X-transformer (still in beta), takes a Fuji raw, does their special raw processing steps, then spits out a DNG so you can finish processing it in something like Lightroom. I suppose the idea is to combine the quality of their raw development algorithms with the ease of use and additional adjustments available in packages like Lightroom. If you have Lightroom, you'd only go to the trouble of doing this extra pre-processing step if you weren't satisfied with Lightroom's native handling of Fuji raws (some people aren't).
 
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Lensflare said:
Thank you Retune.....so what is the point of a DNG step in the entire process, just makes it more convoluted!

Yes, for the most part (98%) I shoot jpegs straight out of camera - I don't touch them because my computer is not calibrated to each different publishers system (and they probably don't calibrate across designers either - just each designer will calibrate their own screen to their own preference) - so if I fiddle, they are more than likely going to have to fiddle it back again, a total waste of time and if they get yellowish grass, it doesn't reflect well on me, so I leave it alone, that way you can't make mistakes - having cut my teeth on E6 film and handing it in (so you never saw what you shot unless you went and looked over the art editor's shoulder anyway) what came out of the camera HAD to be right - there was no second chance and DR was in the order of 6 or 7 stops. Getting it right in camera was critical - if you got it wrong with focus, timing or exposure - you got nothing. I have simply carried those skills over into the digital film and that is why I describe my shooting as 'digital trannies' - the Fuji film replication jpegs sound awefully like what I was doing for 20 odd years, that is another reason I like the sound of the Fuji rather than the Sony or Olympus.

For those few occassions I will try a RAW and have a play, I need something to do it with - but I am not going to spend hours editing and processing pictures.

My RAW to jpeg/TIFF system:
Load picture, it just shows up on the screen as a picture.
Assess highlights on graph and by eye - adjust exposure slider to suit if necessary.
Assess shadows having buggered everything up by sliding exposure!
Slide shadow recovery slider to suit.
Maybe tweek a bit on the contrast slider
Maybe tweek the saturation on the saturation slider
Add some focus using the low pass filter method that I copy step-by-step from the book because I can't remember it without looking!
Save As....to jpeg, choose folder, hit save!
Click to expand...

I'd say the solution is quite simple for you then. For the odd time you do need to shoot in raw, the Fuji cameras let you tweak that raw file in camera to adjust those settings and create another new jpeg file. You can do this as many times as you want to produce new jpeg files from the original raw.

Then for the very very occasional time you want to do more, just use the supplier silkypix software to do the same as you do now.

No real need to change your workflow.
 
Furtim said:
I'd say the solution is quite simple for you then. For the odd time you do need to shoot in raw, the Fuji cameras let you tweak that raw file in camera to adjust those settings and create another new jpeg file. You can do this as many times as you want to produce new jpeg files from the original raw.

Then for the very very occasional time you want to do more, just use the supplier silkypix software to do the same as you do now.

No real need to change your workflow.
Click to expand...

That is th emost positive outlook I have been fed - thank you. I think most people on here, from the way they have been talking (not just this topic) they LIKE to spend hours at the computer processing pictures and they know the difference (or think they do) between one output and another - well, if they do, they are far better than me. I jut look at a finished picture and I either like it, or I don't. As you never have the other versions that MIGHT HAVE BEEN had it been processed a different way to compare alongside, it seems pointless to me.
 
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good point Simon,though in my own case I have tried about 6 of the so called best for Fuji RAW converters with not massive differences in output, since I've sold the fuji I don't use any lol.enjoy
 
Lensflare said:
That is th emost positive outlook I have been fed - thank you. I think most people on here, from the way they have been talking (not just this topic) they LIKE to spend hours at the computer processing pictures and they know the difference (or think they do) between one output and another - well, if they do, they are far better than me. I jut look at a finished picture and I either like it, or I don't. As you never have the other versions that MIGHT HAVE BEEN had it been processed a different way to compare alongside, it seems pointless to me.
Click to expand...


Having come through from film like you, I'm much the same. I've played extensively with raw files but for me, the sitting in front of a computer to get a result that's very rarely any better than the camera's own attempt is a waste of time. Sure, there are situations that make the extra fiddle room available in a raw file useful but since I don't do weddings or black dogs in the snow, these situations aren't something I encounter too often. When I do, I make the same decision I used to in film days - save the shadows or the highlights and with bracketing being close to instant, I can do both (if necessary) at the touch of a few buttons.
 
Or reduce the lighting ratio by adding light to lift the dark holes.
 
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Read the thread, Simon explains what he means a few posts up. Far from being a beginner, he's been shooting (and being published) for many years.
 
Yes, Kodiak knows - we have spoken on the phone a few times. Nice chap that he is.....

by start up I mean I have no knowledge of Fuji or these other programs. So as far as I am concerned, I will be starting from scratch again - all new buttons to push to learn!
 
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Another Iridient X-Transformer convert here. Convert the RAW to DNG and then import into Lightroom.

Gives great results for all pictures and none of the mushy'ness when lots of foliage present.
 
PCPhil said:
Another Iridient X-Transformer convert here. Convert the RAW to DNG and then import into Lightroom.

Gives great results for all pictures and none of the mushy'ness when lots of foliage present.
Click to expand...

+1
 
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