But that’s what it is. Mode M but with ISO set to Auto.
Exposure compensation in manual
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But that’s what it is. Mode M but with ISO set to Auto.
Phil V
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But it's not 'Manual', you use the M position on the dial, which is a bit of a red herring.
Manual means you are selecting the 3 variables for your chosen exposure.
snerkler
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It's just terminology. You are in manual mode, which is what people are referring to when saying they're shooting in manual with auto ISO
. I guess to be technically correct we should always write manual mode with auto ISO rather than manual with auto ISO but we're lazy, and besides most folk know what it means 
Phil V
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It's just terminology. You are in manual mode, which is what people are referring to when saying they're shooting in manual with auto ISO
I know it's semantics, but if it's leading people to 'believe' they're in Manual mode, it's not really helpful
john.margetts
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It is still manual exposure. If you want to be pedantic about it because ISO is automatic, you should be pedantic enough to know that ISO is not technically a part of exposure.
Best not to be silly pedantic in the first place.
Best not to be silly pedantic in the first place.
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Phil V
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It's not pedantic.
It's technically incorrect. We've had 40 years of auto modes on cameras, as opposed to 'manual', if people are selecting M but using auto ISO it's not 'Manual'.
I'm not the one who started the pedantry, I used the correct term 'semantics' for what was being described.
And it's not my beef, if newbies want to get themselves in a tizz because they can't work out what is and isn't Manual, and you're happy to help them do that, rather than correct their terminology, feel free
Bebop
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Ignoring the fact that it's not truly manual if you're using auto ISO, with some cameras you can set exposure compensation whilst in 'Manual' mode, and with others you can't.
With the Canon 5D4, I can use auto ISO and then for instance lower the exposure using compensation i.e. It always slightly underexposes even whilst using auto ISO - useful with a scenario where I have pale footballers against dark hedges for example. With the Canon 5D3 in this scenario, exposure compensation makes no difference, so I would have to set the ISO manually so that it underexposes, otherwise the footballers would be overexposed.
Personally I really appreciate being able to set Auto ISO and then compensate if necessary with the Canon 5D4. Perhaps a better example would be dark kite surfers against a bright sky!
With the Canon 5D4, I can use auto ISO and then for instance lower the exposure using compensation i.e. It always slightly underexposes even whilst using auto ISO - useful with a scenario where I have pale footballers against dark hedges for example. With the Canon 5D3 in this scenario, exposure compensation makes no difference, so I would have to set the ISO manually so that it underexposes, otherwise the footballers would be overexposed.
Personally I really appreciate being able to set Auto ISO and then compensate if necessary with the Canon 5D4. Perhaps a better example would be dark kite surfers against a bright sky!
sk66
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I almost never use manual mode with auto ISO... the only time I do that is when I'm forcing a slow SS (i.e. panning). But it's not only beginners... I can't tell you how many times I've switched into manual mode for the studio/lighting and forgotten to disable auto ISO. It usually takes me a few to realize why my exposure isn't changing like it should
.
SsSsSsSsSnake
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I used to know a lady of repute who always did manual 
Box Brownie
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DemiLion
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Ok, I'll bite. Apart from the obvious (ie being part of the exposure triangle) how do you work that out?
ISO regulates the volume of light (created by the aperture and shutter speed) that the sensor captures creating the exposure.
sk66
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Not really. With digital ISO is not "sensitivity" like it was with film, it's amplification after the fact. It's basically a brightness setting much like the one for your monitor.
With digital ISO should be replaced with available light, because it's the amount/strength of the available light recorded that determines pretty much everything about the image.
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john.margetts
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No it doesn't. ISO alters the amount of electrical amplification the sensor signal is subjected to. The amount of light - the exposure - is entirely determined by the aperture and shutter speed. Altering the ISO setting cannot alter the amount of light hitting the sensor.
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Box Brownie
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So, in this modern age of sensor photography is it not correct to describe the "electrical amplification the sensor is subjected to" the direct equivalent of ISO ratings of film. Hence as then even though with DX coding you could choose to under or over expose by adjusting the other two quotients i.e. ss or aperture. But now with digital auto ISO gives us that control missing in film.,.........with EC in the scenario discussed we are (in effect?) holding the iso at the auto selected level increasing or reducing the amplification but measured in iso stops.
DemiLion
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Read what I said again. ISO regulates the volume of light captured by the sensor. Captured being the operative word.
However you word it, ISO still has a (significant) bearing on the exposure of the resultant image and therefore a justified place in the exposure triangle.
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As there's nothing I wanted to watch on telly I had a quick look at my Canon 6D Mk1. Switching shutter speed and aperture to manual and selecting auto ISO appears to remove the exposure compensation + & - setting option. However, the exposure bracketing option remains available... but this appeared to work by changing the shutter speed not the ISO!
So, with shutter speed and aperture both set to manual and apparently 'set in stone', and the ISO set to auto and changing freely as you move the lens toward and away from light, once you select exposure bracketing the ISO appears to remain static for each shot and the shutter speed changes! I wonder if there's a way of selecting which one of the three exposure 'variables' changes to achieve exposure bracketing... if not, who though that one up... and why?!
Usual lethargic caveats apply: I haven't consulted the user manual about this and it's still on the same firmware it came with in 2014!
So, with shutter speed and aperture both set to manual and apparently 'set in stone', and the ISO set to auto and changing freely as you move the lens toward and away from light, once you select exposure bracketing the ISO appears to remain static for each shot and the shutter speed changes! I wonder if there's a way of selecting which one of the three exposure 'variables' changes to achieve exposure bracketing... if not, who though that one up... and why?!
Usual lethargic caveats apply: I haven't consulted the user manual about this and it's still on the same firmware it came with in 2014!
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sk66
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I would say that adjusting the ISO with digital is more akin to offsetting the ISO rating with film (pushing/pulling)... and it comes with very similar penalties.
MatBin
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I think you will find I said the same in my first post about my 5d3, apparently later cameras were/are different.As there's nothing I wanted to watch on telly I had a quick look at my Canon 6D Mk1. Switching shutter speed and aperture to manual and selecting auto ISO appears to remove the exposure compensation + & - setting option. However, the exposure bracketing option remains available... but this appeared to work by changing the shutter speed not the ISO!
So, with shutter speed and aperture both set to manual and apparently 'set in stone', and the ISO set to auto and changing freely as you move the lens toward and away from light, once you select exposure bracketing the ISO appears to remain static for each shot and the shutter speed changes! I wonder if there's a way of selecting which one of the three exposure 'variables' changes to achieve exposure bracketing... if not, who though that one up... and why?!
Usual lethargic caveats apply: I haven't consulted the user manual about this and it's still on the same firmware it came with in 2014!
Box Brownie
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My old grey matter i associate pushing & pulling as darkroom work as in adjusting the development process...............wracks brains as to whether I recall it 'with' in camera adjustments???
sk66
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With film, ISO specified how reactive to light the film was... which was in fact a major factor in how much light was captured/recorded, and therefore part of exposure. "Regulating" after the fact might be more akin to dodging/burning in the darkroom.
In fact, it's getting to the point where adjusting ISO is no different from adjusting the exposure in post software...
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sk66
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Yes, if you push the development process/exposure you need to underexpose the negative so that it comes out right in the end. With film cameras that had meters you typically did that by increasing the ISO/ASA setting above that of the film in use. Very much like using EC to adjust the ISO with digital.
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PINNACLE
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I have a 7Dii and you can adjust exposure compensation in M mode with auto ISO and it is very handy. You can even programme a back button to give you the change I use +1EV for birds in flight. I swap this to -1EV for motorsport when shooting in bright light.
With the 7Dii is if you are in AV or TV with say -2EV then you switch to M that setting will remain.
It is a very handy feature which I really miss when I am using my 1Dmkiv
With the 7Dii is if you are in AV or TV with say -2EV then you switch to M that setting will remain.
It is a very handy feature which I really miss when I am using my 1Dmkiv
StewartR
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I was going to say you're wrong, the Canons I use most often certainly do have this feature.
But then this:
The 5D IV also has the feature. The cameras I most often use are the 7D II, 80D and 5D IV, so that explains it!
MatBin
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Saw that answer and was mightily relieved that Canon have put the feature in place, only issue is I don't like either of the crop cameras and the price of the FF models, but that's down to me not Canon.
It's not pedantic.
It's technically incorrect. We've had 40 years of auto modes on cameras, as opposed to 'manual', if people are selecting M but using auto ISO it's not 'Manual'.
I'm not the one who started the pedantry, I used the correct term 'semantics' for what was being described.
And it's not my beef, if newbies want to get themselves in a tizz because they can't work out what is and isn't Manual, and you're happy to help them do that, rather than correct their terminology, feel free
I think theres a differentiator to be made between
Manual Mode (modern day camera setting) and Manual Exposure
Manual Exposure = Manual Mode (modern day camera setting) + Auto ISO - off (Camera Setting
Manual Mode (camera setting) in itself is NOT Manual Exposure
StewartR
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Fair point. Incidentally it seems that Canon had the idea of allowing EC in "Manual + Auto ISO" mode in 2013 and enabled it in the 1D X via a firmware upgrade. They have released 20+ EOS cameras since the 1D X, but apparently only a handful have this feature. It seems likely to me that they could easily implement this in all their cameras via a firmware upgrade, but they choose not to.....
MatBin
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I wonder if Magic Lantern have/will implement?