Do people buy photos online...

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tomanthony

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Hi

I would just like to know if people are buying photos online from photographer, if not could you give me some feedback on why this is

I would very much value your comments
__________________
Sheffield Photographer, Tom Anthony - www.tomanthonyphotography.co.uk
 
I don't. I generally don't buy photos because I don't have the habit of putting stuff on my walls.
 
interesting, I thought about setting a site up.

How do you go about marketing your sites to get the sales?
 
i've got lots of prints in most local tourist shops so not only online
 
we sell a few...
 
This is a really pendantic point here, but the word 'photograph' - surely this in it's real sense means a physical item. Otherwise it is an image.

Yes, sure shoot me down and call my a so and so, but things are moving on with terminolgy - for example photo libraries generally refer to themselves as image libraries.
It's a moot point , and you can say what you like, but I thought it worth raising.

;)
 
simple answer is I would not pay those prices

£12 for a 7x5 which can cost as little as 10p and then a further £11 to mount it in card worth about 50p
 
Uneducated_Rick said:
simple answer is I would not pay those prices

£12 for a 7x5 which can cost as little as 10p and then a further £11 to mount it in card worth about 50p
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Your maths are a little out. It costs a lot more than that.. Camera (depreciation) lens (Depreciation) other assorted kit. Fuel, mem cards, insurance, web site and of course time and expertise.

Theres probably a lot more I cant remeber off top of my head but its deffo more than 60p to produce a 7x5 mounted
 
I have never bought on line...
some sellers don't own the pictures they sell.

But then I don't buy photographs at all, I prefer to take them.
 
Uneducated_Rick said:
simple answer is I would not pay those prices

£12 for a 7x5 which can cost as little as 10p and then a further £11 to mount it in card worth about 50p
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Everyone (maybe not you) knows its whats on the paper (in this case the image) that has the value not the paper. Try telling a solicitor or accountant you are not paying £85 for a sheet of A4 paper.

In answer to the OP question yes they do and its an on-line shop thats open 24/7 for orders. :thumbs:
 
KIPAX said:
Your maths are a little out. It costs a lot more than that.. Camera (depreciation) lens (Depreciation) other assorted kit. Fuel, mem cards, insurance, web site and of course time and expertise.

Theres probably a lot more I cant remeber off top of my head but its deffo more than 60p to produce a 7x5 mounted
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Given people like to bang the drum about 200,000 actuations let's work it out for an average of 50K actuations on a £500 camera and £1000 of lens and accessories - that's a whopping extra 3p each assuming £0.00 resell value, add more on for fuel and round it up to an extra 10p a photo shall we?

Camerabox (I know are not the best but I was talking about minimum price) produce a 7x5 at 10p each and mounts cost as little as 55p from picturelizard.

So maybe 60p was a little low, can be produced from maybe 75p, £1 maximum



snapzz said:
Everyone (maybe not you) knows its whats on the paper (in this case the image) that has the value not the paper. Try telling a solicitor or accountant you are not paying £85 for a sheet of A4 paper.
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Ignoring the personal attack which is against the forum rules:

a solitor or accountant can (should?) only sell their time once, a photograph can sell a print many times over so the comparison is irrelevant

for an unknown photographer so is trying to gain exposure the mark up (10p->£12 and £1->23) is too high in my opinion
 
Uneducated_Rick said:
Given people like to bang the drum about 200,000 actuations let's work it out for an average of 50K actuations on a £500 camera and £1000 of lens and accessories
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I have arund 17 thousand pounds worth of kit and my wish list only has a dent in it. Like I say.. your maths are out :)
 
KIPAX said:
I have arund 17 thousand pounds worth of kit and my wish list only has a dent in it. Like I say.. your maths are out :)
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again a personal attack - this post has been reported

£17k/50k is still only 34p

Unless there is a specific market, which from the variety of shots on the website I don't think there is, there won't be sales at that price IN MY OPINION - you can't say my opinion is wrong
 
Uneducated_Rick said:
again a personal attack - this post has been reported

£17k/50k is still only 34p
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where the time, expertise, car, fuel, insurance, web fees and many other bits and bats ?

personal attack? nagh.. just my opinion on how apt your name is re this subject.. thats all .. :)
 
KIPAX said:
where the time, expertise, car, fuel, insurance, web fees and many other bits and bats ?
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You don't have to make all of those back on one print though ;)

KIPAX said:
just my opinion on how apt your name is re this subject
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What is your experience of making sales for non-even photography, where you are not virtually guaranteed sales by being only the only, or 1 of very few, photographers taking photos for a very specific market?

I don't think landscapes and nature shots have friends and family who are all queuing up to buy a copy and other good photographers can go along and take another landscape or nature photo. People cannot easily recreate the photos you take, especially not a particular grudge match.

Some people only charge £3 for a 7x5, although I don't know if they come mounted or not (you may want to state if they do on your website)
 
Ask a plumber to change a tap washer and he won't charge you 20p will he? He'll charge you £50, 20p for the washer and £49.80 for knowing how.
 
To answer the original question, events stuff definitely sells. Other stuff, no idea.

snapzz/Kipax your comments are designed to be insulting and do at least border on personal attacks.

Rick, you're entitled to your opinion but simply to say you wouldn't buy at those prices and base it on the cost of a print isn't really that relevant. There are plenty of photographers out there advertising prints at a LOT more than £12 for a 5X7. As snapzz says, it's not the print, it's what's on it that counts. If you're saying you don't think the images the OP's advertising will sell at those prices feel free to say so and why, i.e. critique them.
 
Sorry.. you lost me in this debate when you went crying to the moderators..


Uneducated_Rick said:
You don't have to make all of those back on one print though ;)



What is your experience of making sales for non-even photography, where you are not virtually guaranteed sales by being only the only, or 1 of very few, photographers taking photos for a very specific market?

I don't think landscapes and nature shots have friends and family who are all queuing up to buy a copy and other good photographers can go along and take another landscape or nature photo. People cannot easily recreate the photos you take, especially not a particular grudge match.

Some people only charge £3 for a 7x5, although I don't know if they come mounted or not (you may want to state if they do on your website)
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dod said:
Rick, you're entitled to your opinion but simply to say you wouldn't buy at those prices and base it on the cost of a print isn't really that relevant.
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Sorry dod but it is very relevant. The images are very good but they could be recreated relatively easily and there are millions of good landscape shots out there - many of which would be cheaper for a 5x7 (and as you said just as many are more expensive). They are no better and no worse than a lot of other prints which are cheaper


dod said:
As snapzz says, it's not the print, it's what's on it that counts. If you're saying you don't think the images the OP's advertising will sell at those prices feel free to say so and why, i.e. critique them.
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Fair enough - I think the OP has a great variety of different shots which are good for stock work but they are not targetting a specific audience enough for private sales and are too easily recreated (especially the flower shots in the nature section)
 
Uneducated_Rick said:
Sorry dod but it is very relevant. The images are very good but they could be recreated relatively easily and there are millions of good landscape shots out there - many of which would be cheaper for a 5x7 (and as you said just as many are more expensive). They are no better and no worse than a lot of other prints which are cheaper
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That's a different reason for not buying them though, you're original point was that it might cost 50p to produce. It doesn't matter how much it costs, the basis of any trade is that both the seller and buyer are happy with the final price.
 
One thing that i cant get my head round is this. .... when an artist sells an oil painting it is an original and is expensive....and any prints of it are just that.... second class copies that sell very cheaply,

i find it difficult to comprehend that we are selling an original artical but it is a "print"........ if we print 5 of them, then is the first one worth more than the other 4?

anyone understand what i mean?
 
Janice said:
One thing that i cant get my head round is this. .... when an artist sells an oil painting it is an original and is expensive....and any prints of it are just that.... second class copies that sell very cheaply,

i find it difficult to comprehend that we are selling an original artical but it is a "print"........ if we print 5 of them, then is the first one worth more than the other 4?

anyone understand what i mean?
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In the example above only 1 is an oil painting and as such it attracts a premium rate, the others are copies that are not oil.

With a photograph if the original is in any way different than the others - ie premium paper, better printer, maybe a larger print and all subsequent prints are guaranteed to be significantly smaller - then it can be branded as such.

Essentially though a lot prints are identical or replicated without any variation (other than size) and as such none attract a 'premium' price tag
 
Uneducated_Rick said:
In the example above only 1 is an oil painting and as such it attracts a premium rate, the others are copies that are not oil.

With a photograph if the original is in any way different than the others - ie premium paper, better printer, maybe a larger print and all subsequent prints are guaranteed to be significantly smaller - then it can be branded as such.

Essentially though a lot prints are identical or replicated without any variation (other than size) and as such none attract a 'premium' price tag
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Exactly! so we shouldnt be able to charge a large sum if we can knock out one the same as the original at the push of a button.

Whereas "a print" is usually a second rate sounding article... if someone asks of your photo hanging on the wall, "Is it a print"? we have to say yes, because the original is a print!!!
 
KIPAX said:
I have arund 17 thousand pounds worth of kit and my wish list only has a dent in it. Like I say.. your maths are out :)
Click to expand...

Uneducated_Rick said:
again a personal attack - this post has been reported
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Firstly chaps how the above constitues a "personal attack" I don't know......:thinking::help::shrug::bang::rules: Rather than keep it sensible folks, just keep it adult and that includes running for the report button any time someone questions your post..........

Anyway back on topic.

I keep getting told that some of my racing shots are "superb", "excellent", "amazing" to quote people who've seen them, yet I haven't sold a BSB print in over a year off my website (1 the year before that and 3 the year before that), and that's on the back of other people saying on another website I found during a referrer check ".....and his prices aint bad either"..........

Compare that to the 6k average unique vistors I'm getitng a month and it doesn't quite stack up.

I admit my website galleries and format aren't exactly the best but that's what you get for £200. I can't invest in the kit I do AND pay someone a hefty fee to build a site that looks as though it wouldn't pay for itself.

I do the best I can with the resources I have but that's obviously not enough.

The main Paypal button hitting action I get through my site is like the others have said, via my event photography activities.

Guy
 
Someone emailed me last week asking where their photos were as they "had ordered them a few days before and they weren't cheap". This was the reply I drafted (but did not send as thought better of it)

"Thank you for your order, I posted the photographs first class yesterday so they should be with you today.

Actually the images are very reasonably priced :-). Two of us spent the whole of Sunday taking them, then I spent the next three days going through, checking them and putting them on the web site so that everyone can view them, this is five working days, plus the time spent on each order cropping them to the size ordered, preparing them for the printer and when received checking them and packing and taking to post office. Then take into account the outlay on equipment, insurance, travelling expenses and photographic experience. At the end of this I do not know how many, if any, orders I will receive. As I do not currently charge for postage I only place an order once a week. I think, when you take all this into account you will probably find that the real cost to me, of the photographs ordered to date from this show in order to cover costs let alone earn a living would be closer to £90 each rather than their current price - I may have to rethink my prices :-)"
 
If any of you have ever thought about buying a print from Bailey, Carlos Clarke et al you would know that it is not the cost of the material that determines the price.

As for buying prints from oil paintings, I've done that. There is a Belgian artist called Christine Comyn and a UK artist called Mark Spain and I've seen the original oils that both produced and they are stunning. Their prints sell for £600. Again it's the content, not the cost of production that you pay for.
 
dod said:
snapzz/Kipax your comments are designed to be insulting and do at least border on personal attacks.
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Sorry but I dissagree. However I see you have deleted my comment regarding his username. If you felt that was insulting I appologise but just felt he chose a very apt name!
 
Janice said:
One thing that i cant get my head round is this. .... when an artist sells an oil painting it is an original and is expensive....and any prints of it are just that.... second class copies that sell very cheaply,

i find it difficult to comprehend that we are selling an original artical but it is a "print"........ if we print 5 of them, then is the first one worth more than the other 4?

anyone understand what i mean?
Click to expand...

I understand what you are trying to say but its slightly incorrect. An artist selling prints from an original are in effect selling 2nd generation copies. Prints from a digital file or even a negative are all 1st generation therefore all original.
 
Uneducated_Rick said:
a solitor or accountant can (should?) only sell their time once, a photograph can sell a print many times over so the comparison is irrelevant

for an unknown photographer so is trying to gain exposure the mark up (10p->£12 and £1->23) is too high in my opinion
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Think your missing the point and edited out the main bit. If you visit a solicitor or accountant (as examples only) they will charge the same hourly rate regardless of visits. If you as a photographer as commissioned for a portrait sitting, wedding,event or visit a location you will charge a fee(unless for whatever reason you choose not too).

Prints or the supply of images from that session/shoot will be charged at your current print/digital file rate. If the client comes back for more then they will be charged the same print/digital file rate as nothing has changed ie costs/time etc. The reason they come back is simply the value of the image. The cost of the paper is irrelevant provided it is printed on quality (not Tesco) paper.

As professional photographers continually try to improve the quality of the original we have to invest in the best professional equipment. The one thing you cannot buy is creativity and what the "eye sees". With professional camera bodies (Canon d series starting around £3k) and pro L series lens £1k up wards this is quite an investment. You simply cannot get the same quality from a 400d and a kit lens (no offence intended).

What gets my back up is uneducated people who no nothing about earing a living from photography constantly moaning, chipping and posting on forums about our price structure. We work very long hours, spend thousands of pounds on equipment give loads of advice for free on forums such as this just to be criticised and accused of ripping people off.

If all the pro's on every forum stopped giving advice where would all the amateurs and wannabees get help from? When I first started forums didn't exist and my knowledge came prom attending paid for seminars and joining Professional bodies.

I joined this forum as I recognised a few people and thought if it was ok for them it would be ok for me but now after reading a few posts similar to this I'm not so sure. Continually criticising anyones business beit semi or full time will only end with those who have the knowledge not bothering or leaving.

End.
 
I've been selling Scottish Landscape prints since the first signs of the worldwide credit crunch.
I get a steady trickle which is fine as it isn't my main source of income.
This week alone, I've sold two 18"x12" and a 29" panoramic.
I set my own website up and did a lot of research before and during.

I bought a DVD by Scott Bourne called 'Secrets to selling and publishing your photography' which was very useful.

I probably picked the worst area of photography for sales (Landscapes) but kept it focused on that subject alone and made them limited editions of 100, accompanied by a certificate of authencitity, purely as a marketing tool.
Over time, I've discovered my niche market, which is sales to the USA and discovered the main sales are print only (not many biters for the mounted option) and colour. I now need to trim the website down to remove the options that or not moving.

There's a saying that a 'picture with a heartbeat' ie; images containing people or animals, are 8 times more likely to sell.
The website is focused on selling to my target audience, no blogs or gear lists or family pics...people are just not interested in all that, you are solving a problem for them, they want a print of particular subject and you can supply it.
I sell an equal amount through local word of mouth and this is an important area...contact local outlets, get a stall in local art & craft fayres etc.
Also, 'gifting' prints to local worthy causes helps to spread your name and can even get you local press coverage.

I pondered for some time over pricing, and as Scott Bourne mentions in his DVD and as previous posters have indicated, you need to factor in all costs: equipment costs, travelling costs, post processing time and all the rest.
I still think mine are too expensive, but they do sell and those are the pricing structures I was advised to adhere to.

Sorry for the lengthy post, but I thought I would share my experience, as I didn't think my images were that good, so if I can do it, anyone can.
It can take a little of the fun out of it, but ask any pro and they'll tell you, it's 10% photography and 90% marketing!
 
The price you charge has almost nothing to do with how much it costs to produce the product; it's based on the reputation of the photographer coupled with being able to get away with charging the prices they do. I could not sell a small photo for £200 any more than the next amateur photographer, but a professional photographer with a proven track record has a much better chance of achieving this. If the photographer becomes good enough it will become an investment by the purchaser, not just a photo for their wall.

To the OP I do not have an online image gallery as I am well aware my photos are not yet at a high enough standard.
 
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