compact system

urban_muppet

urban_muppet

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Anyone got any advice on compact system cameras, something to handle low light and wide angle stuff, brand not important, price is :naughty:
 
Hi,

I suppose your options include Panasonic, Olympus, Sony, Fuji, Samsung, Canon and Nikon and possibly one or two more I've forgotten :D

It might help to narrow the field a bit by deciding on some spec...

Do you want a rangefinder style camera or a SLR style camera?
Is a VF important to you or are you happy with just the back screen?
Do you care about sensor size? Micro Four Thirds? APS-C?
How wide angle do you want to go?

If price is an issue would you be willing to buy used and either way what's the budget?
 
woof woof said:
Hi,

I suppose your options include Panasonic, Olympus, Sony, Fuji, Samsung, Canon and Nikon and possibly one or two more I've forgotten :D

It might help to narrow the field a bit by deciding on some spec...

Do you want a rangefinder style camera or a SLR style camera?
Is a VF important to you or are you happy with just the back screen?
Do you care about sensor size? Micro Four Thirds? APS-C?
How wide angle do you want to go?

If price is an issue would you be willing to buy used and either way what's the budget?
Click to expand...

All valid points.

If you are after a camera that will handle low light situations and wide angle better then you really need to go for an APS-C size sensor, so Fuji, Sony or Canon. Personally, I don't recommend the Canon system as its not as good as the other 2. Fuji is the more expensive option out of the three.
 
architectfadi said:
All valid points.

If you are after a camera that will handle low light situations and wide angle better then you really need to go for an APS-C size sensor, so Fuji, Sony or Canon.
Click to expand...

Is there that much in the noise/low light shooting these days?

If cost is a real issue then the Fuji and Sony will be the most expensive options as regardless of body price their wide lenses aren't cheap. The cheapest options could be earlier generation MFT cameras from Panasonic or Olympus or the APS-C Samsungs that seem to go really cheap second hand. I don't know about the Samsungs but the 12mp MFT cameras can be used at ISO 1600 with care and even at 3200 if you're a smartypants.

Going wide could be an issue and is seldom cheap. Legacy lenses wont get you wide on the smaller formats and a bargain at the wide end could be hard to find.

If a FF FoV of 42 or 56mm could be considered wide then the cheapest option could be a MFT or APS-C body plus a 28mm legacy lens via adapter. That's a combination I use and find it good enough.
 
Another option is a look at the new Canon 100D , Although its a dslr its the smallest dslr on the market and is only slightly bigger than a compact system camera.
 
Or Park Cameras are doing 'Grade A' stock Panasonic G3 with 14-42mm lens kits for £249 here.
 
arrrgh....now andywest and applemint have got me thinking again !
 
Yep, used Nex's can be cheap and can now combine with cheap (and not too nasty) Sigma lenses (19, 30 and 60 2.8) for them at £100ish
 
Sony Nex F3 is available for £199.95, and the Sigma lenses 30mm and the 19mm for £99 each.
I have both lenses, really good kit.
 
really need to visit a good camera retailer i think, seems to be a wider range of options than i thought !
 
Depends what your priorities are - disadvantages of Nex (vs micro four thirds or dslr) are less choice of lenses, slower AF, no viewfinder (unless going for the more expensive 6 and 7 series models), Micro four thirds eg G3 (or G5/G6) gives you fast AF for static shots but slower (than a dslr) for action/sports/wildlife and low light (high iso) performance not quite as good as a dslr or Nex. Reasonable choice of lenses but they can be expensive.

A dslr gives you better ergonomics and (along with the Nex) better low light performance at the cost of size and weight. Although the dinky little Canon negates this to some extent but then also gives up a bit in terms of ergonomics (smaller size and smaller grip etc).

So everything is a compromise to some extent and only you can decide what works best for you. :) Think about what lenses you will buy now and in the future as well and also what you will take pictures of and what your main priorities are.
 
Yep, these first world problems are a nightmare :)
 
You're on a roll, Chris. :)

Mark, how can you say there is a lack of lenses for the Nex system?

I use Sony, and Sigma (mainly Sigma) lenses for Nex, Olympus, Nikon, Pentax K, M42 and Minolta mount lenses with adapters.
 
They are catching up but compared to m43 and dslr systems there are a lack of lenses and some of those that are available are either very expensive (Zeiss) or very average. Most are also bulky compared to the tiny body but that situation has also improved with the new power zoom and pancake lenses. The 2 (soon 3) Sigma ones are all excellent for the price though. The Sony 30mm and 50mm 1.8 lenses are decent but twice the price of their dslr equivalents.

Of course there is no lack of lenses if you use an adapter and the Nex makes a great digital back for 'legacy' lenses. But of course not everyone likes manual focus (even with peaking) and it's hardly ideal for moving subjects. I have a about half a dozen legacy lenses for my Nex but the initial novelty of manual focus has worn off for me. :)
 
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I love using the Sigmas, but I find legacy lenses so much fun.
 
Just been to check out some of the cameras suggested, I now have a headache :gag:
 
I am absolutely delighted with the Fuji x-pro 1, that I often take out instead of the D800 due to the huge weight saving.

The Fuji is even better now I have the new Fuji 55-200mm lens, which is way better than I expected.
 
urban_muppet said:
Just been to check out some of the cameras suggested, I now have a headache :gag:
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You said price was important so what is the budget. That will help you rule out some of the options put forward, i.e. X-Pro1
 
urban_muppet said:
Panasonic g1, back to the camera shop I suppose lol
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You won't find one there unless it is a second-hand camera shop - the G1 came out in 2008. :)

For £200 I would go for a (used) Nex 3 or 5 and a 50mm 1.8 legacy lens if low light is a priority as the Nex cameras have the edge in low light and also have focus peaking to help with manual focusing. Or a G1 or G3 (body only G3 £200 new with 3 year Panasonic warranty) if having a viewfinder is a priority.

Or you could look at used dslrs but I am not sure what you would get for that budget and how it would compare with the above suggestions. It would be larger obviously. :)
 
urban_muppet said:
Budget is around £200 ish, probably looking at second hand I reckon
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There's a well used and scratched Nex 5 on MPBPhotographic at the moment for £79 delivered. And a kit lens for £47. Then spend the rest on a few manual focus lenses and adapters, maybe? Would be a good start for a great price.

EDIT ; links

http://www.mpbphotographic.co.uk/us...-sony-compact-system-cameras/sony-nex-5-body/

http://www.mpbphotographic.co.uk/used-equipment/used-lenses/sony-e18-55mm-f3.5-5.6-oss/
 
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urban_muppet said:
Panasonic g1, back to the camera shop I suppose lol
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http://www.ffordes.com/product/13051614471581

:D

http://www.rockycameras.com/-28mm--28mm-28-minolta-md-prime-wide-angle-lens--1799-48680-p.asp

:D

http://www.rockycameras.com/-50mm-17-50mm-minolta-md-rokkor-prime-standard-lens-1499-48723-p.asp

So, that would be G1 £130, 28mm f2.8 £18 and 50mm f1.7 £15 + an adapter off ebay, £10 + postage = a total of ... under budget :D If you can cope with manual focus which is easy on these cameras.
 
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I would suggest you save a extra £100 to take your budget to £300 and then go for a GF1(£100) and the lumix 20mm 1.7(£200). This would give you a great combo that fits in a big pocket.
 
matt b said:
I would suggest you save a extra £100 to take your budget to £300 and then go for a GF1(£100) and the lumix 20mm 1.7(£200). This would give you a great combo that fits in a big pocket.
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That's a great combo and it's one that I had and loved but the honeymoon ended badly when I realised that with even a half way serious camera back screen shooting wasn't for me and neither was a flimsy add on VF. A built in VF is vital for me and it's something that we all need to decide on before buying.
 
A G1 is not the most compact of compact system cameras is it and requirement for a viewfinder has not been mentioned?

Agree that getting something that can use the 20/1.7 would be good but would stretch the budget.

I am rather liking my knocked about Nex 5 and surprisingly really making use of the tilting screen (something I have never had as a requirement at all) and although there are now some cheap Sigma primes they are all f2.8 so not the best low light option (even if the iso 1600 IQ is good enough for me)
 
I've had an nex-5 for the last 18 months which I bought to replace the GF1 I had before it. Main reasons for the swap were the considerably better high ISO performance of the Sony sensor over the older generation Panasonic, focus peaking and the Flip screen. I tend to use manual lenses over the 18-55 and the focus peaking is invaluable for those (normally an OM Zuiko 50/1.4). However, to be fair, the kit lens is stabilised so great for videos and general 'point and shoot' shots.

I've had both the Panasonic 20/1.7 as well as the Sigma 30mm on both the GF1 and Nex and have to say I was underwhelmed by the 20mm in the condition I was shooting in (anything that moves) because the focus speed is pretty slow. However, the sigma lenses are pretty much the same although they all deliver good results when focussed and have the benefit of small size.

Overall, you won't really go wrong with any of the CSC brands, they all deliver and have manual control available if you need it. The biggest difference is handling so buy whichever feels right to you and comes in within your budget.

Cheers
Steve
 
ernesto said:
A G1 is not the most compact of compact system cameras is it and requirement for a viewfinder has not been mentioned?
Click to expand...

VF or not is such a biggie and such a basic question that I thought it needed asking.
 
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