canon 600ex flash with pocketwizard questions

quango2k

quango2k

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Rick
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hi all,

I am buying myself a new toy (fuji X-T1) and want to use my existing setups for flash.

I currently use a lastolite softbox with 2 x 600ex flash with the canon remote trigger which I am not sure if the remote wil work on the Fuji..

if not I will get some pocketwizards. can someone tell me if you can trigger 2 x flashguns from a single pocketwizard? I've never used pocketwizards before so have no idea.
 
•
There are many ways one can trigger several flashes through a single
remote radio impulse: parallel /serial connections, multiple hot shoes
and, of course, flash own sensor among others!
 
so can I use a 'Y' cable going from 1 x pocketwizard to 2 x 600EX flashguns? :)
 
•
Visit the PW site for all the connecting solutions!
 
Forget the pocketwizards, buy cheaper triggers and you can afford spares.

PW have gone from being the only game in town to being just overpriced with no competitive advantage.
 
Phil V said:
with no competitive advantage.
Click to expand...
•
Maybe not for most consumers, in this you may be very well right. These
represent quite a business investment for studio or location works.

My experience is…
• all my PW are supported and updatable
• though built quite strong, it did happened that on a job up to 2 units
were rendered unusable because of a mishap. They were replaced at
no charge by PW (not by the reseller).
• The range is very important for my work and at this point I know none
to reach and operate so far.
 
Phil V said:
Forget the pocketwizards, buy cheaper triggers and you can afford spares.

PW have gone from being the only game in town to being just overpriced with no competitive advantage.
Click to expand...

Sadly true.

Kodiak Qc said:
•
Maybe not for most consumers, in this you may be very well right. These
represent quite a business investment for studio or location works.

My experience is…
• all my PW are supported and updatable
• though built quite strong, it did happened that on a job up to 2 units
were rendered unusable because of a mishap. They were replaced at
no charge by PW (not by the reseller).
• The range is very important for my work and at this point I know none
to reach and operate so far.
Click to expand...

Not if you're a Canon user - unreliable, with dramatically reduced range when Flex units are used with most Canon guns, plus a talent for burning out guns in HSS mode. Two things have contributed to PW's demise - insistence on reverse-compatibility, meaning they've stuck with an old radio frequency that's prone to RF interference, particularly from from the flash gun itself, and high manufacturing costs in the USA. Basically self-inflicted and a great shame as PW has some very advanced, useful and unique features. Clever technology.

For the OP, I think Canon 600 guns are not on PW's list of flashes with RF interference problems. Also google Cactus V6 triggers. Though I've not used them, they have a lot of compatibility options.
 
HoppyUK said:
Not if you're a Canon user
Click to expand...
•
As I admitted very openly, elsewhere, that I know only Nikon.
I am surprised to learn that there could be bugs with other brands!

I trust you on that.
 
Kodiak Qc said:
•
As I admitted very openly, elsewhere, that I know only Nikon.
I am surprised to learn that there could be bugs with other brands!

I trust you on that.
Click to expand...

It's extensively documented, including on the PW website.

But it sounds like you're only using the PW Plus triggers, not the auto-TTL Flex system that is the problem area, and only with Canon guns. PW Plus are basically simple triggers, known as dumb-triggers, same as 101 other brands nowadays. How much more than 100m range do you need?!
 
Not sure how relevant this is, but here goes.
I have Canon 580 II flash units, so a bit older than yours.
I used to use them on my 5D3 with Yongnuo triggers. 622C TX on the hotshoe and 622s under the flash units. Worked well.
I also have a pair of 603IIC triggers that I used mainly as remote shutter triggers but I have used them as flash triggers with one on the hotshoe and one under a flash. If I wanted more than one flash then I set them up as master/slave.
I'm now largely Fuji - X-T1, like you - and have found that they all work just as well with the fooj as they did with the Canon. Only thing they don't do is ETTL, but as I nearly always use flash in manual mode this isn't a problem for me. That's where the 622 system scores - I can change individual settings from the camera.
I'm not sure what you mean by the Canon remote trigger, but my understanding of things (I'm not very techy so beware!) is that Canon/Canon compatible triggers will work from the Fuji hotshoe on centre pin firing. Manual only, but as I've said that ain't a problem for me.
Unfortunately you are in Portsmouth and I'm in the frozen north or you could have had a play.
 
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HoppyUK said:
But it sounds like you're only using the…
Click to expand...
•
I have and use more than the 4x PW PlusIII,
As I also have and use 4X Flex TTL5, and 2x AC3.

As of yet, any PW product that went wrong was caused by location
work accidents. I must recognize that the level of satisfaction is high,
specially their service.
 
Kodiak Qc said:
•
I have and use more than the 4x PW PlusIII,
As I also have and use 4X Flex TTL5, and 2x AC3.

As of yet, any PW product that went wrong was caused by location
work accidents. I must recognize that the level of satisfaction is high,
specially their service.
Click to expand...
The only issue I had with my Flex triggers was also due yo location, unfortunately it's a location I spend quite a bit of time at. So having very expensive triggers that I couldn't use there is not acceptable (ref interferance).

Whilst I appreciate its not PW's 'fault' that we had the issue, swapping brands cured the problem, and it's not like I could ask the venue to replace all their entertainment system instead.
 
mickledore said:
Not sure how relevant this is, but here goes.
I have Canon 580 II flash units, so a bit older than yours.
I used to use them on my 5D3 with Yongnuo triggers. 622C TX on the hotshoe and 622s under the flash units. Worked well.
I also have a pair of 603IIC triggers that I used mainly as remote shutter triggers but I have used them as flash triggers with one on the hotshoe and one under a flash. If I wanted more than one flash then I set them up as master/slave.
I'm now largely Fuji - X-T1, like you - and have found that they all work just as well with the fooj as they did with the Canon. Only thing they don't do is ETTL, but as I nearly always use flash in manual mode this isn't a problem for me. That's where the 622 system scores - I can change individual settings from the camera.
I'm not sure what you mean by the Canon remote trigger, but my understanding of things (I'm not very techy so beware!) is that Canon/Canon compatible triggers will work from the Fuji hotshoe on centre pin firing. Manual only, but as I've said that ain't a problem for me.
Unfortunately you are in Portsmouth and I'm in the frozen north or you could have had a play.
Click to expand...

Thanks...well, my X-T1 with the 16-55 f2.8 LM WR lens will be delivered Monday so I will just stick on my Canon ST-E3-RT trigger and see how that works. I only use manual anyway. if that works fine then no need for the triggers.

out of interest. have you always shot Fuji? if not what did you move from? I'm a Canon man (5diii, 2x 1dx, 7dii etc etc) and just wanted something smaller and lighter for those days where I just cant be bothered to lug huge bodies about. I have been watching and reading a lot of reviews and the X-T1 looks amazing...just wondering if it will make me move to mirrorless full time.
 
Phil V said:
Forget the pocketwizards, buy cheaper triggers and you can afford spares.

PW have gone from being the only game in town to being just overpriced with no competitive advantage.
Click to expand...

Thanks Phil, I've never really used any triggers apart from the Canon system or studio kit , and PW is the only other brand I ever hear of.

PS...I bought those rotolight Neos, bloody good bit of kit! I'm doing a street shoot tonight using nothing but two of them with barn doors..I'll let you know how I get on :)
 
quango2k said:
out of interest. have you always shot Fuji? if not what did you move from? I'm a Canon man (5diii, 2x 1dx, 7dii etc etc) and just wanted something smaller and lighter for those days where I just cant be bothered to lug huge bodies about
Click to expand...
Hi. I was A Canon man too. Still got the 5D3 but like you, I started jibbing at the weight and bulk to carry on a full day out. Also needed a more robust tripod which is even more weight.
Picked up the Fuji from our classifieds as a second camera but it's just taken over and it's now my go to camera. I'll keep the Canon plus a couple of lenses because there are odd occasions when it will be the best option.
As someone said elsewhere on here the Fuji does 80% of what a DSLR will do so if you can plan ahead for the other 20% then why lug all that weight if it's not needed.
Hope you enjoy the Fooj. There's a massive thread on here about it. Any problems then just holler in there.
 
Interesting comments on the pocket wizards and canon flash guns. Wish I knew that before I bought a mini tt1 and a flex unit last week. And I have a 580ex II. Wanted the yongnuo triggers but there seemed to be conflicting advice on whether they were compatible with a 1DX. Some said yes some no and this was on yongnuo web pages.

I don't need to use the flash more than approx 50 feet away and it seems to work reliably so hopefully no bother.
 
Gaz J said:
…it seems to work reliably so hopefully no bother.
Click to expand...
•
A colleague from another town came to the studio this morning to borrow
some extra stands.

As much as I am on the Nikon side of life, he is on the Canon's. He had a
bit of time for a coffee so I brought this PW/Canon point on the table, and
the laptop too, so he may have a look at the issues expressed here.

We both were "bragging childishly" on the performance of our PWs and it
seems he experienced none of the problem but enjoys the products.

So I don't know, are the issues related to some models of Canon only?
I do not know Nikon users around here having any dissatisfaction.
 
Kodiak Qc said:
•
A colleague from another town came to the studio this morning to borrow
some extra stands.

As much as I am on the Nikon side of life, he is on the Canon's. He had a
bit of time for a coffee so I brought this PW/Canon point on the table, and
the laptop too, so he may have a look at the issues expressed here.

We both were "bragging childishly" on the performance of our PWs and it
seems he experienced none of the problem but enjoys the products.

So I don't know, are the issues related to some models of Canon only?
I do not know Nikon users around here having any dissatisfaction.
Click to expand...
There's a few 'known' issues
The 580exII is known to interfere, PW even sell socks to put on the flash to cure the issue.
Interferance from other wireless devices, the frequency used by PW is also used by lots of other devices,Mim no expert on radio frequencies, but one of my local wedding venues rendered my PW's useless, which was worse than inconvenient. However, even before that, the inconvenience of having to switch everything on in a specific order to get them working was a PITA, particularly when problems arose and it all needed rebooting.

I know there are plenty of happy users though.
 
Phil V said:
There's a few 'known' issues
The 580exII is known to interfere, PW even sell socks to put on the flash to cure the issue.
Interferance from other wireless devices, the frequency used by PW is also used by lots of other devices,Mim no expert on radio frequencies, but one of my local wedding venues rendered my PW's useless, which was worse than inconvenient. However, even before that, the inconvenience of having to switch everything on in a specific order to get them working was a PITA, particularly when problems arose and it all needed rebooting.

I know there are plenty of happy users though.
Click to expand...


Yes I've seen the socks Phil. I've also read the comments about how to minimise interferance on their site. Doesn't instill confidence if you've got one of the affected flashes. Mine are unlikely to be used anywhere other than outside so hopefully I will not have a problem. Not really had any issues regarding which order I switch them on though. I usually do mini tt on camera first then flex unit then flash. Flash gives a burst which I assume is the units hooking up and away to go. I have switched them on the other way round without any issues either.
 
Kodiak Qc said:
•
…but isn't that their top flash?
Click to expand...

The newer 600EX-RT is the latest Canon gun, and that doesn't seem to have any problem with PW (perhaps Canon fixed them) though it was the 580EX-II when PW launched the Mini/Flex system and that was prone to RF problems and burning out with hard use in HSS mode. Ironically, many people bought the PW's precisely for the enhanced HSS performance so that didn't go down well. PW has been very open about these problems, and TBF it's all spelled out on their website, eg http://wiki.pocketwizard.com/index.php?title=Canon_Compatibility Two seconds on google will bring up hours of reading on all this as it was a big topic at the time, but now PW hardly gets mentioned.

It's a great shame. PW's technology is very clever, useful, and unique - eg optimised HSS that can deliver one stop or more brightness, optimised second-curtain sync, and optimised peak-hypersync for faster x-sync speeds with no banding or light loss. That's pretty smart stuff (y) I rather hoped that Canon or Nikon would acquire PW to get their patents and implement the whole thing properly (PW's can be a bit clunky). I guess there's still time for Nikon ;)
 
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HoppyUK said:
PW's technology is very clever, useful, and unique
Click to expand...
•
I use PW every where with everything!
With the SB9xx and even with all 7 Profoto heads as, though the later
has super great remotes, I sometimes have elaborate setups where the
PW are great solutions.
 
Kodiak Qc said:
•
I use PW every where with everything!
With the SB9xx and even with all 7 Profoto heads as, though the later
has super great remotes, I sometimes have elaborate setups where the
PW are great solutions.
Click to expand...

But unless you're using some of those unique PW features mentioned above* then PW is just a more expensive way of doing things.

*Optimised HSS works differently for Nikon, and it's not so beneficial. Instead of extra brightness, you get faster recharge times.
 
HoppyUK said:
But unless you're using some of those unique PW features mentioned above* then PW is just a more expensive way of doing things.

*Optimised HSS works differently for Nikon, and it's not so beneficial. Instead of extra brightness, you get faster recharge times.
Click to expand...
:plus1:
When problems occur with compatibility/efficiency, there are always rumours all over the web, started and spread by people who don't know - the people who do know, don't say.
But, based on problems that I have personally come across, the cause seems to be with specific models of Canon camera - this has happened many times over the years. The camera, or maybe the flashgun, or maybe a bit of each, seems to have very poor shielding and interferes with the radio trigger. The only people who really know what the problem is is the manufacturer, Canon, and they either say nothing or deny that they are in any way responsible. The problem then disappears on later models (Canon seem to like discontinuing products, fixing bugs and then bringing out a model that fixes a fault that they denied exists) and there are then a lot of forum posts saying that the problem is with this, that or the other, and then a lot of posts from other people saying that there's no problem at all:)

Which maybe explains why I use Nikon...
 
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