Bowens 500R pro equivalent?

[Dr_O]

Much as i'd like to drop 3 x 500R Pro's onto the credit card, in reality it's probably not going to happen. Just can't justify them although I think they are perfect for me not taking price into account

The 500R has too short a flash duration for me looking at the specs so looking for some alternatives. Are the BXRi's the equivalent or is it the RX range?

Any other makes with the same quality but a more card friendly price- I can't think of any others?

Still swither on the Elite Pro's now and again as Lencarta seem to position them against the likes of the 500R Pro's lights (i.e. pro spec) but I'm not totally convinced on many fronts- perhaps unfairly?

 

[Mahoneyd187]

Much as i'd like to drop 3 x 500R Pro's onto the credit card, in reality it's probably not going to happen. Just can't justify them although I think they are perfect for me not taking price into account

The 500R has too short a flash duration for me looking at the specs so looking for some alternatives. Are the BXRi's the equivalent or is it the RX range?

Any other makes with the same quality but a more card friendly price- I can't think of any others?

Still swither on the Elite Pro's now and again as Lencarta seem to position them against the likes of the 500R Pro's lights (i.e. pro spec) but I'm not totally convinced on many fronts- perhaps unfairly?

Hi mate,

I'm not too clued up on the Bowens line, but if the R pro's are Bowen top of the line, then yes they will be the RX equivalents. Elinchrom RX lights are absolutely stonking Having said that so are the BXRIs, a friend of mine just bought 4 from TFC.

How do you mean the flash duration of the 500R's are "too short" though? A short flash duration, is a fast one, which will freeze motion, I don't see any disadvantages to this?

I have owned (and sold on) Lencarta lights, I'm afraid I built myself up to believe they would be "i.e. pro spec" and was disappointed when they arrived. The technical spec isn't that bad, but I wasn't impressed with the build. Many will disagree with me on this forum, aided by the fact many members have the lights, and Lencarta are an active part of the forum, which isn't a bad thing, but is the way it is. In my honest opinion, they are good budget lights, but a competitor to a top of the line Bowens or Elinchrom, they are not, they have neither the build quality or the feature set to be a competitor in that market, again, in my opinion.

BXRI, RX, or 500R (and pro), will all be fantastic lights.

Hope that helps in some way

Regards

Danny

 

[Dr_O]

Hi mate,

I'm not too clued up on the Bowens line, but if the R pro's are Bowen top of the line, then yes they will be the RX equivalents. Elinchrom RX lights are absolutely stonking Having said that so are the BXRIs, a friend of mine just bought 4 from TFC.

How do you mean the flash duration of the 500R's are "too short" though? A short flash duration, is a fast one, which will freeze motion, I don't see any disadvantages to this?

I have owned (and sold on) Lencarta lights, I'm afraid I built myself up to believe they would be "i.e. pro spec" and was disappointed when they arrived. The technical spec isn't that bad, but I wasn't impressed with the build. Many will disagree with me on this forum, aided by the fact many members have the lights, and Lencarta are an active part of the forum, which isn't a bad thing, but is the way it is. In my honest opinion, they are good budget lights, but a competitor to a top of the line Bowens or Elinchrom, they are not, they have neither the build quality or the feature set to be a competitor in that market, again, in my opinion.

BXRI, RX, or 500R (and pro), will all be fantastic lights.

Hope that helps in some way

Regards

Danny

Thanks for that- I did mean the flash duration was too long on the 500R's- it's only 1/900th of a second- like aperture you need to think what you write otherwise there's a disconnect between what you write and what you mean

If I was using the lights every day then it would be a no-brainer and I'd go with the Bowens pro model.

The Lencarta are tempting due to the price and the fact that they might only get used 4 or 5 times a month for a year anyway. Been looking for a while which just highlights the lack of pressing need. However, if this was to change I wouldn't want them falling apart either if for example I put them in the boot a bit quicker than usual or attached softbox a bit quicker if you know what I mean.

When did you have your Lencarta lights? Was this before the Elite Pro Range?
I guess one way of looking at it would be as a budget set of lights that has a fairly short flash duration for freezing action and unless you pay double the price that's what you get.

I think my list is Bowens pro, Elinchrom BXRI (maybe RX) then Lencarta Elite Pro in that order. The solution might be to buy one good light and work with that and an SB900 for the time being, or suck it up and put more on the card or buy budget (though not necessarily cheap for 'budget' lights).
A call to Garry is probably on the cards to finalise thoughts.

cheers for the help, will let you know what wins- heart or wallet

 

[Mahoneyd187]

I had my Lencarta lights a couple of years ago now, they were indeed the elite pro 300 heads. Your best bet is to actually get your hands on them and see whether you like them, as I said before, they are a good budget buy, and I have nothing against the product AT THAT LEVEL, but....as I've said before, I dont agree with the whole Lencarta "professional everytime" thing.

I sold them and bought an Elinchrom Style 300S head to start with, to use along 2x Nikon speedlights. And I've just bought another couple of Style 300S heads.

Jonathan Ryan has a pair of elinchrom FX400 heads in the for sale section of the forum if you have a look. Would be worth it

 

[Garry Edwards]

I had my Lencarta lights a couple of years ago now, they were indeed the elite pro 300 heads. Your best bet is to actually get your hands on them and see whether you like them, as I said before, they are a good budget buy, and I have nothing against the product AT THAT LEVEL, but....as I've said before, I dont agree with the whole Lencarta "professional everytime" thing.

I sold them and bought an Elinchrom Style 300S head to start with, to use along 2x Nikon speedlights. And I've just bought another couple of Style 300S heads.

Jonathan Ryan has a pair of elinchrom FX400 heads in the for sale section of the forum if you have a look. Would be worth it

It's possible that Jonathan is selling his Elinchrom because he prefers his Lencarta...
Fact of the matter is, it's largely subjective. Some people are very happy with the cheapest Ebay lights, others complain about the build quality or features of even the most expensive lights.

I agree that it's a very good idea to see the lights for yourself and then make your decision.

 

[Mahoneyd187]

It's possible that Jonathan is selling his Elinchrom because he prefers his Lencarta...
Fact of the matter is, it's largely subjective. Some people are very happy with the cheapest Ebay lights, others complain about the build quality or features of even the most expensive lights.

I agree that it's a very good idea to see the lights for yourself and then make your decision.

I don't think it's a good idea to get Jonathans preferences involved in this conversation on his own behalf Garry.

It would make sense to me, that as he has an arrangement with Lencarta, and runs courses for them, that he should be seen to be using Lencarta equipment. Does that mean that out of all of the lighting products in the world, his preference would be Lencarta? I should doubt that. Does that mean he gets free or heavily subsibised stuff? I should have thought so

 

[Garry Edwards]

I don't think it's a good idea to get Jonathans preferences involved in this conversation on his own behalf Garry.

It would make sense to me, that as he has an arrangement with Lencarta, and runs courses for them, that he should be seen to be using Lencarta equipment. Does that mean that out of all of the lighting products in the world, his preference would be Lencarta? I should doubt that. Does that mean he gets free or heavily subsibised stuff? I should have thought so

I'm not answering on behalf of Jonathan, all I'm trying to do is to illustrate that different people have different views on different equipment for different reasons, because they have different needs and different perceptions.

Jonathan isn't an employee of Lencarta and if you read his posts here you'll find that he recommends various makes/equipment depending on what he considers to be right for the job, as do I. Jonathan's role with Lencarta, other than working on the stand at Focus last week, involves hosting lighting workshops. He is free to use whatever equipment he wishes on those lighting workshops. He probably uses the equipment that he bought, at normal retail prices, before he took on the teaching role.

 

[Mahoneyd187]

I'm not answering on behalf of Jonathan, all I'm trying to do is to illustrate that different people have different views on different equipment for different reasons, because they have different needs and different perceptions.

Jonathan isn't an employee of Lencarta and if you read his posts here you'll find that he recommends various makes/equipment depending on what he considers to be right for the job, as do I. Jonathan's role with Lencarta, other than working on the stand at Focus last week, involves hosting lighting workshops. He is free to use whatever equipment he wishes on those lighting workshops. He probably uses the equipment that he bought, at normal retail prices, before he took on the teaching role.

Well that's not how it looked to me, it looked like you were implying that he was selling his Elinchrom gear as he prefers Lencarta. I won't call him out on it, he's only in this conversation because I recommended a used Elinchrom kit to Dr O.

You can say he's not an employee all you want...the WAY he's paid doesn't make an ounce of difference to me, or anyone else. He's obviously an active part of Lencarta (payroll, or self employed, matters not). I doubt he'd last very long with Lencarta if he held their Lencarta workshops with other manufacturer's equipment.

Sorry I can't keep a straight face here....he holds Lencarta "heavily subsidised" Branded workshops....but he's not obliged to use Lencarta equipment?

 

[Garry Edwards]

Well that's not how it looked to me, it looked like you were implying that he was selling his Elinchrom gear as he prefers Lencarta. I won't call him out on it, he's only in this conversation because I recommended a used Elinchrom kit to Dr O.

You can say he's not an employee all you want...the WAY he's paid doesn't make an ounce of difference to me, or anyone else. He's obviously an active part of Lencarta (payroll, or self employed, matters not). I doubt he'd last very long with Lencarta if he held their Lencarta workshops with other manufacturer's equipment.

Sorry I can't keep a straight face here....he holds Lencarta "heavily subsidised" Branded workshops....but he's not obliged to use Lencarta equipment?

No, believe it or not, and I don't give a damn whether you do or don't.
And sooner or later, someone who has been on one of my own (Lencarta) lighting workshops will probably join in and tell you that I've used Elinchrom and/or Profoto gear as well as Lencarta. Nobody has ever told me that I must only use Lencarta, and I'm confident that nobody will have said that to Jonathan either.

 

[Mahoneyd187]

No, believe it or not, and I don't give a damn whether you do or don't.
And sooner or later, someone who has been on one of my own (Lencarta) lighting workshops will probably join in and tell you that I've used Elinchrom and/or Profoto gear as well as Lencarta. Nobody has ever told me that I must only use Lencarta, and I'm confident that nobody will have said that to Jonathan either.

Yeah, you've probably used them because they met the requirements for what you wanted to shoot, better than your own Lencarta gear.

I can go on all day Garry. You're in a thread where the OP is looking for an equivalent for a Top Spec Bowens item. Outside of this forum, you won't see Lencarta mentioned at all.

 

[Garry Edwards]

Yeah, you've probably used them because they met the requirements for what you wanted to shoot, better than your own Lencarta gear.[/B]I can go on all day Garry. You're in a thread where the OP is looking for an equivalent for a Top Spec Bowens item.

Or because they were nearer, or because I was trying to teach lighting rather than promote specific products - just accept (or not) that not everyone has an agenda.

Outside of this forum, you won't see Lencarta mentioned at all.

So you're saying that all of the 48,800 Google results for Lencarta are on this forum? I don't think so.

 

[Mahoneyd187]

Or because they were nearer, or because I was trying to teach lighting rather than promote specific products - just accept (or not) that not everyone has an agenda.
So you're saying that all of the 48,800 Google results for Lencarta are on this forum? I don't think so.

But Garry, if Lencarta are as good as all the other "professional" offerings, why do you even have Elinchrom and Profoto equipment on your persons? You are a paid advertiser on here, I do not accept that you posting on a thread relating to professional lighting equipment does not have an agenda on the end of it.

In a discussion relating specifically to professional(!) studio lighting equipment between paid photographic professionals, outside of this forum, I stand by my point, you will rarely find lencarta mentioned between profoto, broncolor, elinchrom, breisse, kino flos, bowens, HMI and so on. These are huge international brands with deserved professional reputations. Unless of course one of these professionals has something to do with lencarta hey.

I said it earlier in the thread, Lencarta lights are good budget buys, though competitors to the likes of Bowens R Pro or Elinchrom RX, they are not. And that was what this thread was about. You've taken it elsewhere.

 

[Garry Edwards]

But Garry, if Lencarta are as good as all the other "professional" offerings, why do you even have Elinchrom and Profoto equipment on your persons? You are a paid advertiser on here, I do not accept that you posting on a thread relating to professional lighting equipment does not have an agenda on the end of it.

In a discussion relating specifically to professional(!) studio lighting equipment between paid photographic professionals, outside of this forum, I stand by my point, you will rarely find lencarta mentioned between profoto, broncolor, elinchrom, breisse, kino flos, bowens, HMI and so on. These are huge international brands with deserved professional reputations. Unless of course one of these professionals has something to do with lencarta hey.

I said it earlier in the thread, Lencarta lights are good budget buys, though competitors to the likes of Bowens R Pro or Elinchrom RX, they are not. And that was what this thread was about. You've taken it elsewhere.

I don't think that it's me who has taken it elsewhere, but to get it back on track I won't take it any further off track.

I have Elinchrom etc in my studio because I bought Elinchrom in the past, and still have some of it that I use alongside Lencarta. It's pro stuff from many years ago. And, as I've said before, people who have actually been to my studio have seen other brands too. People who have met me know what I'm really like, and forming opinions through actual contact must be better than by forming them based on nothing more than interpreting internet posts

 

[Mahoneyd187]

I don't think that it's me who has taken it elsewhere, but to get it back on track I won't take it any further off track.

I have Elinchrom etc in my studio because I bought Elinchrom in the past, and still have some of it that I use alongside Lencarta. It's pro stuff from many years ago. And, as I've said before, people who have actually been to my studio have seen other brands too. People who have met me know what I'm really like, and forming opinions through actual contact must be better than by forming them based on nothing more than interpreting internet posts

Well it is, because evidently I made the immortal sin of linking Jonathan with Elinchrom gear, and you proceeded to practically announce that it was because he preferred his lencarta stuff.

I don't even see how you've constructively contributed to this thread in any way shape or form.

I gave the OP my own opinions, as an unbiased user of lighting equipment, and having had experience with some of the stuff he's thinking about getting.

Up until now I have always been happy to recommend Lencarta to any family and friends looking for a budget entry into lighting, despite my negative experiences with my own Lencarta equipment, but seeing as you are essentially the face of the company, and this is an example of your attitude, I don't foresee myself making any such recommendations again.

You can write what you want after this you won't get a response.

MODs may as well clean this thread we've probably ruined.

 

[kiteninja]

Much as i'd like to drop 3 x 500R Pro's onto the credit card, in reality it's probably not going to happen. Just can't justify them although I think they are perfect for me not taking price into account

The 500R has too short a flash duration for me looking at the specs so looking for some alternatives. Are the BXRi's the equivalent or is it the RX range?

Any other makes with the same quality but a more card friendly price- I can't think of any others?

Still swither on the Elite Pro's now and again as Lencarta seem to position them against the likes of the 500R Pro's lights (i.e. pro spec) but I'm not totally convinced on many fronts- perhaps unfairly?

One thing that hasn't been mentioned whilst both the other 2 contributers to this thread where throwing there toys around the place is,
What do you need the faster flash duration for?

If it is sports and your going to be taking them outside atall or anywhere that doesn't have a 13amp socket to hand then your pretty much set on either the Elichroms or the Bowens as the Elite pros have no simple way compared to Bowens and Eli of using the heads without a socket to hand.

Having 500Rs myself I would recommend them time and time again its built like a brick """"" house which does give it some weight but then that means it'll last (touch wood), I've not had a problem yet with the slower flash duration I'm no pro (far far from it) but that is just my opinion Oh and I've got the travelpak which is a again plug in the flash head and trundle off with it easy peasy.

Oh and customer care flash tube went on my 500R the other day, Bowens offered me a new one or to come pick up the head and replace it, being a bit clumsy and looking at the tube with the wire wrapped around I thought I'd let them do it plus not in a huge rush should get the head back tomorrow with a brand new flash tube fitted absolutely free can't say farer then that.

 

[Dr_O]

Wow- you go climbing for the first time in months and come back to this- PASSION- I like it but don't fall out over my indecisiveness

Some good points all round for me to consider- you'd be surprised what I find useful.

Kiteninja- regards the flash duration; it's partially down to having options open and means there are no excuses for not capturing a shot- of course there's always faster right enough. I do like removing the my lens/camera/lights aren't good enough arguments.
I know a few Muay Thai fighters and have some ideas though it may not happen. Perhaps the 1/2900 duration is not really needed and 1/900 would suffice.
You say you have had no probs with yours. Maybe I take my own thread off track for a bit and ask for examples of things that could be captured with 1/900 and things that couldn't and what could be captured with 1/2900 or faster? Could I live with 500R's

Outdoors would be nice but not essential at this stage- wasn't opposed to the idea of one of those innovatronix things although it seems to be purpose outdoor lights may be better- more weather resistant than taking studio lights outside. Arguments on both sides. Bowens is nicely set up for this which is good.

Back on track, good idea to check all lights out- 700mile round trip to Garry's studio is a bit far though- combing it with doing something useful when there might be more appealing- fancy a lighting extravaganza test with an independent

Anyone with Elite Pros that I could view? Edinburgh, Perth, Dundee- Glasgow's pretty miserable but ok, I'd go there

 

[Dr_O]

Found the RX400's of Jonathan's- interesting though he might not have them now. Thanks for pointing out.

One question- more an aside. Is there an issue with mixing different brands of lights- assuming they are all decent eg not a £50 look at it and it breaks job is there much of an issue with colour temp and could this happen between lights of the same brand eg individual unit differences- I assume this is where your money goes too?
If there is a difference is it just PP that fixes are light meter and adjust accordingly until they balance.

Wont ask any more after this

 

[JonathanRyan]

Found the RX400's of Jonathan's- interesting though he might not have them now. Thanks for pointing out.

I still have them - though they are FX400s - not RX400s. I should probably make more effort selling them...

As for why I'm selling them....simple. It makes no sense to me to have 2 incompatible sets of modifiers for indoors and outdoors. Since I don't like the Quadras enough to spend £1,500 on them and can't see myself lugging Rangers to every shoot I decided to standardise on Bowens fit heads. It allows me to add heads and modifiers from several other manufacturers when I find they fit my needs.

One question- more an aside. Is there an issue with mixing different brands of lights

In reality, probably not. Unless you are doing really critical work. You can probably get more colour variation by mixing a brand new softbox with a 10 year old one. Also running identical heads at different powers will produce small variations (generally better head = smaller variation). If you do get a colour mismatch you can't live with though it's a b****r to 'shop out.

 

[gman]

Glasgow's pretty miserable but ok, I'd go there

 

[Dr_O]

I still have them - though they are FX400s - not RX400s. I should probably make more effort selling them...

As for why I'm selling them....simple. It makes no sense to me to have 2 incompatible sets of modifiers for indoors and outdoors. Since I don't like the Quadras enough to spend £1,500 on them and can't see myself lugging Rangers to every shoot I decided to standardise on Bowens fit heads. It allows me to add heads and modifiers from several other manufacturers when I find they fit my needs.



In reality, probably not. Unless you are doing really critical work. You can probably get more colour variation by mixing a brand new softbox with a 10 year old one. Also running identical heads at different powers will produce small variations (generally better head = smaller variation). If you do get a colour mismatch you can't live with though it's a b****r to 'shop out.

Cheeers Jonathan. I was tempted- hence query about mixing lights but I think I'm going to go down the Bowens route all things considered. Just need to work out flash duration requirements and whether 500R or pro is the way forward.
Don't think you'll have much trouble selling them- can always sell them to someone on one of your lighting workshops- ideal for them to check them out.

 

[Dr_O]