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Eddzz!!

Eddzz!!

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Eddy
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I've been pondering for the past few years the idea of joining the Police force. My local force here in North Wales are recruiting soon and I've been weighing up my options. I'm a graduate that finished University two years ago and have been employed working for that same University ever since (I stayed in the same area after graduating). I have a fair bit of experience when it comes to dealing with the public and had a brief stint working for a security company (unlicenced) at various UK festivals. Aside from that the whole "joining the Police" thing is just an interest I've held for a number of years. As well as recruiting PCs the local force are also recruiting Special Constables. The appeal of the Special Constable is the "try before you buy" notion, though I have heard of individuals getting 'stuck' as a Special Constable for years before they have been able to make the transition to a paid officer... Any advice you would be able to offer me would be much appreciated! :) Thanks in advance.
 
As much as you can I would find out everything before you join, my Son in Law (no pun) wanted to join the Police for years, joined and decided he hated it almost immediately, stuck at it for 5 years and called it a day this year. He made Seargent but never was officially promoted after he passed his exams, tbh i think his career took a nose dive when he decided he didnt want to become a Mason, coincidence possibly and compounded by moving from City of London to the Met.
I personally would hate being a Bobby and having to deal with teh public, especially drunk public at that.
On a brighter not a friend's husband loves the Police, joined CID and made Seargent, cant see him leaving until they force him out.
So I am sure some love it, others dont, just make sure your research is solid.

Best wishes though as I'm old enough to still regard the Police with respect and extremely greatful we have them.

Matt
 
MatBin said:
joined and decided he hated it almost immediately, stuck at it for 5 years
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What a complete and utter waste of 5 yrs..

I spoke to a lorry driver once.. I wanted to be one.. he spent the next 10 minutes telling me what a horrible job it was and why he hated it so much.. listed all manner of things.... how long you been doing it I asked... 30 years he said..... what a plonker :)
 
I'm not surprised he wasn't made substantive PS after only 5 years!
especially in the City, where the total force is less than 1000. Transferring to the Met would have speeded things up, there's plenty of skippers there who are still on colouring books.

Back to the question.

If you want to risk your life and liberty for pee poor pay, have your life ruined by bad shift patterns, constantly being messed about and led by idiots, being judged with the benefit of hindsight by those who have the luxury of taking days to second guess the decisions you had fractions of seconds to take then do it.

The Police Force is going through changes that are not good for anyone except the accountants, it will change back again, but not soon.

You'll probably find that most people who get accepted are former Specials or PCSO's, and very few off the streets. So if you really want to do it, then go for one of those 2 first. Apart from as you say try before you buy, you'll make your chances much better.
 
Some polar opposite opinions on here! I know it's a job that requires dedication, but having my life and liberty stolen away - is it that bad?
 
Anything for the Civ side is a waste now, I came out of the RAF because of higher powers being absolutely intolerable, I then worked for the DWP which was even worse, I also then thought about joining the police force but was persuaded at the interview stage because of what Bernie has basically stated above, it's not what it once used to be unfortunately. My uncle has just retired at 55 after 37 years service, he had grey hair before he was 40 (first in the family to have such at a young age!) - he became a traffic cop and saw such atrocities that it would turn a brain surgeons stomach inside out. Eddy, unfortunately it is only you who can make the decision, I'm pretty sure you already know it's not like the scenes in 'Hot Fuzz' ;)
 
My son has pondered this also. Hes discovered that the old school police officers all complain the force isn't like it used to be, but all the young officers think its absolulty fine and look forward to building a good career. ...and that fits with all the chats Ive had with my customers who are also officers.

Follow your heart. (y)
 
but all the young officers think its absolulty fine
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You spoke to all of them did you?

In all seriousness, since the beginning of time, most very young or new Police Officers are keen and enthusiastic.
It takes a few years to grow up and realise it isn't as rosy as it first appeared.
Good luck to your son and the career bit of it though.

Lets see what happens when he gets expensive, with the new conditions of service. Force short of cash? Simples, goodbye all those on the top rate of pay. Employment Tribunal? Noooooo....Police Forces are exempt, unless you can prove race or sexual discrimination.
Get injured on duty...Bye. Pension? No chance, or if you do it's worth peanuts.
Mr Slag accuses you of telling him to Foxtrot Oscar(evidence? Why would we need that????), bye.
Want promotion? Oh you are so funny.......
Saturday off to see your kids for the first time in 3 weeks? Nah.......you don't need to see your kids.
Pay rise? Good grief! How do you expect the force to pay for BMW's for Ch Supt's and above. We are all in this together!
Yes, we know you were beaten up last week, and its the middle of winter and you have flu, and can hardly stand let alone walk the streets, but you are clearly taking mickey, so come in or we will discipline you on the attendance policy.
You were trying to arrest someone driving a stolen car? How dare you, have this summons for dangerous driving. Yes, we know YOU were driving safely, and the driver of the nicked car was driving like a dick, but it is clearly your fault.
Yes, you acted entirely properly, and the complainant is clearly lying, according to 30 witnesses, but we will appologise to him for something you didn't do.
You want to use social media and tell the truth? Discipline board is the day after tomorrow, oh and we wont bother with any evidence, you'll just be sacked.
Chance of public disorder? Everyone back in the station! We don't want to spark anything, the Ch. Supt might be criticised!

With the exception of number one, which has only just be put into the regulations, all the other things now happen......Often.

So you'll have to forgive me for not thinking the Brave New Police Service is anything but a bad career move when compared against the old Police Force.
 
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Mrs Frac retired 10 years ago, after 19 years service, retiring was the best thing she ever did for reasons outlined above by Bernie.
 
Bernie174 said:
.....

So you'll have to forgive me for not thinking the Brave New Police Service is anything but a bad career move when compared against the old Police Force.
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lol, I can do that, no prob.

So okay not all, no need to be picky ...so you guys, ex guys? ... are you saying their are non or little officers happy with their career choice in the force right now? (standard ranking type officers I mean)

My sons gone onto do a science degree in programming instead, thanks anyway. ;) He was researching 2-3 years ago, he'd thought it was the modernised policing system that had alienated the traditional officers and methods. Because officers who arrived after the brave new shadow had passed on, where not so influenced and so readily accepted the methods as normal and just got on with it.
 
@Bernie174 How long have you been in the force for? Are you retired now? You sound like you had very problematic stint in there. Where were you based?
 
Bernie174 said:
You spoke to all of them did you?

In all seriousness, since the beginning of time, most very young or new Police Officers are keen and enthusiastic.
It takes a few years to grow up and realise it isn't as rosy as it first appeared.
Good luck to your son and the career bit of it though.

Lets see what happens when he gets expensive, with the new conditions of service. Force short of cash? Simples, goodbye all those on the top rate of pay. Employment Tribunal? Noooooo....Police Forces are exempt, unless you can prove race or sexual discrimination.
Get injured on duty...Bye. Pension? No chance, or if you do it's worth peanuts.
Mr Slag accuses you of telling him to Foxtrot Oscar(evidence? Why would we need that????), bye.
Want promotion? Oh you are so funny.......
Saturday off to see your kids for the first time in 3 weeks? Nah.......you don't need to see your kids.
Pay rise? Good grief! How do you expect the force to pay for BMW's for Ch Supt's and above. We are all in this together!
Yes, we know you were beaten up last week, and its the middle of winter and you have flu, and can hardly stand let alone walk the streets, but you are clearly taking mickey, so come in or we will discipline you on the attendance policy.
You were trying to arrest someone driving a stolen car? How dare you, have this summons for dangerous driving. Yes, we know YOU were driving safely, and the driver of the nicked car was driving like a schwingschwong, but it is clearly your fault.
Yes, you acted entirely properly, and the complainant is clearly lying, according to 30 witnesses, but we will appologise to him for something you didn't do.
You want to use social media and tell the truth? Discipline board is the day after tomorrow, oh and we wont bother with any evidence, you'll just be sacked.
Chance of public disorder? Everyone back in the station! We don't want to spark anything, the Ch. Supt might be criticised!

With the exception of number one, which has only just be put into the regulations, all the other things now happen......Often.

So you'll have to forgive me for not thinking the Brave New Police Service is anything but a bad career move when compared against the old Police Force.
Click to expand...

Crikey! Sounds like you are/were a frustrated Detective mate. Did you do all your Policing in the canteen of the Police Federation?
 
Adam
He made a sensible choice, I am now a developer, and although it's not what I call exciting, I get paid slightly more, without the agro factors.
I am not sure what you mean by 'just got on' with it. But whats changed greatly is the changes in things like discretion. A good example is in the main forum there's yet another "Should he have been nicked for defending his property" topic.
Now, Police have zero options. In the past, it would have been up to the PC who arrived first. Provided the 'defender' said the right things, albeit after perhaps the second time he was asked, then that would have been it. No longer. Now there are those who see that as an improvement. Me? no, I don't.

In the past, we thought for ourselves, now, you police by process, that cannot be right, there cannot be one size fits all in police which is an infinite shades of gray game, not something you can do to a script.

Mike, no, I have never been in the Fed Canteen, probably because they call it a restaurant, and have a grazing menu. Then again, I didn't do my time reading the Daily Mail. See the above comment, about thinking for myself, not having a pile of half truths and fiction planted in my mind by tomorrow's chip paper.

Eddy
I was in the Met, at a number of Stations in South and West London. Bad stint? No, I got out before the silliness started to take hold too much and got into another career, much to the envy of many of my friends still in the Job.

The above are all examples of what does happen nowadays, OK, we were messed about in the past, but not anywhere like the level the boys and girls are now.
 
Bernie174 said:
Adam
In the past, we thought for ourselves, now, you police by process, that cannot be right, there cannot be one size fits all in police which is an infinite shades of gray game, not something you can do to a script.
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I'd agree that it should be that way Bernie, however it replies on the public being able to trust that all officers will make the right decision. As soon as there's even one story in the paper about a 'bent copper' then the public stop trusting each individual to make the right call and therefore demand a process which ensures everyone acts the same. It would be better the original way as long as the recruitment process proved to the public that only trust worthy and honourable people were accepted, but with the reduction in pay and conditions the police are probably grateful for any applications!
 
TopBanana said:
I'd agree that it should be that way Bernie, however it replies on the public being able to trust that all officers will make the right decision. As soon as there's even one story in the paper about a 'bent copper' then the public stop trusting each individual to make the right call and therefore demand a process which ensures everyone acts the same. It would be better the original way as long as the recruitment process proved to the public that only trust worthy and honourable people were accepted, but with the reduction in pay and conditions the police are probably grateful for any applications!
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Whatever police (and ex police) say about their terms and conditions, my understanding of the situation is that whenever any force advertises vacancies, they are literally swamped with applicants, so - in the mind of would be police officers at least, it's still a wonderful job to have.

I have no personal experience, but do have quite a few friends who are serving officers. They all moan, but none of them ever leave...
 
Tim
It depends on your point of view.
Is it right that for example that everyone who drives at 34MPH should go in the book? Or is it better the Police Officer decides based on all the circumstances? His opinion is always going to be second guessed, and the result would depend on where you stand. Jeremy Clarkson would doubtless say speeding convictions are never right. The Head of BRAKE on the other hand would probably have a polar opposite view. The wife of a driver would hold the opinion a summons is wrong, the wife of someone killed by a speeding driver would say otherwise.
But is speeding on an empty motorway at 3.30am the same as speeding on a road outside a school at 3.30pm? Should you prescribe a course of action for both? Or, having employed a group of people because you, the public abdicate your responsibility (which is why Police exist!), should you not trust them to do as they think right. The majority of us did just that, fully aware that 50% of the world was never going to agree. Oddly the opposite 50% were not going to agree had things been dealt with he other way.
The right decision is often a 'bent' decision, if you don't agree with it.

Garry, that is certainly true of the past, and may be for a while longer. But then the notion of huge gold plated pensions (which now come at a cost of 14% of your pay and are not gold plated!) attracted a lot of people, along with security of employment. Neither of these are there any more, and the conditions of service are being degraded to the point where it really is no longer worth the risk. It will take a while for those who think the police is a good career option to realise that it is no longer and we'll be back to the 70's situation.
 
I'm a Sergeant with 15 years service in a large urban force.
The job is certainly not what it was, pension, pay, lack of political support, bad image in most media.
That said its still a great job and those joining now won't have experienced the 'good old days'.
Do I hate shifts, yes. Do I like days off in the week, 4 days off in a row and not travelling in rush hour, yes. Would I like to see my family more...... sometimes!
 
My friend Iain is a police officer in London, and he's on very long hours gets messed about, normally ends up with tasks to do no one else wants. But he enjoys it some of the time. He wants to move to traffic and become a bike cop with him being a biker. But I think it's one off them marmite jobs your either going to love it or hate it depending on what area you wish to be in. I was going to join myself at one stage but ill health put paid to it.
 
Think I might sign up as a Special Constable... Do the job for a couple of years and see how I feel by the end of it! At the moment, I really want to do this, but I don't want to rush into when really I have no idea what may come of things. I'll have scrub up on my Welsh a bit as well if I'm to sign up around here! :help:
 
If you join watch out for OAP's in FFRR - they are a growing menace and are difficult to handle;)
 
Diolch yn fawr guys, appreciate the support! :)
 
Apologies to revive an old thread, but just thought I'd post an update! After much deliberation I took the plunge and applied to become a Special Constable in North Wales back in April. Long story short, I took the tests, had the interview and passed them all! I shall be a Constable in training as of October :) Can't wait!
 
Good luck with it Eddy I hope it goes well
 
Hope all goes well for you :)
 
Best of luck Eddy!!! :-)
 
Good luck with it Ed - also take heart that the wales police may be a very different kettle of fish to the Met - rural policing is different (both good and bad points i'd imagine) but the cops i know down here (who are all sergeant and down) seem to love it
 
big soft moose said:
Good luck with it Ed - also take heart that the wales police may be a very different kettle of fish to the Met - rural policing is different (both good and bad points i'd imagine) but the cops i know down here (who are all sergeant and down) seem to love it
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I shall be primarily based in the more urban areas of North Wales, though rural policing sounds interesting! Who knows where I might go :)

Thanks for the wishes everybody!
 
Know 3 coppers, 2 are relatives and one was a neighbour, 1 was a traffic officer and the others beat officers, all 3 enjoyed it except for the hours/shifts and damage it does to relationships, traffic officer is now retired and younger ones still on the beat although one has just had a year out after having a baby
 
Bernie174 said:
You spoke to all of them did you?

In all seriousness, since the beginning of time, most very young or new Police Officers are keen and enthusiastic.
It takes a few years to grow up and realise it isn't as rosy as it first appeared.
Good luck to your son and the career bit of it though.

Lets see what happens when he gets expensive, with the new conditions of service. Force short of cash? Simples, goodbye all those on the top rate of pay. Employment Tribunal? Noooooo....Police Forces are exempt, unless you can prove race or sexual discrimination.
Get injured on duty...Bye. Pension? No chance, or if you do it's worth peanuts.
Mr Slag accuses you of telling him to Foxtrot Oscar(evidence? Why would we need that????), bye.
Want promotion? Oh you are so funny.......
Saturday off to see your kids for the first time in 3 weeks? Nah.......you don't need to see your kids.
Pay rise? Good grief! How do you expect the force to pay for BMW's for Ch Supt's and above. We are all in this together!
Yes, we know you were beaten up last week, and its the middle of winter and you have flu, and can hardly stand let alone walk the streets, but you are clearly taking mickey, so come in or we will discipline you on the attendance policy.
You were trying to arrest someone driving a stolen car? How dare you, have this summons for dangerous driving. Yes, we know YOU were driving safely, and the driver of the nicked car was driving like a d***, but it is clearly your fault.
Yes, you acted entirely properly, and the complainant is clearly lying, according to 30 witnesses, but we will appologise to him for something you didn't do.
You want to use social media and tell the truth? Discipline board is the day after tomorrow, oh and we wont bother with any evidence, you'll just be sacked.
Chance of public disorder? Everyone back in the station! We don't want to spark anything, the Ch. Supt might be criticised!

With the exception of number one, which has only just be put into the regulations, all the other things now happen......Often.

So you'll have to forgive me for not thinking the Brave New Police Service is anything but a bad career move when compared against the old Police Force.
Click to expand...


As stated by Bernie174

Not worth the hassle in my opinion but then again you can always try it out and see how you go..... Its not for everyone......it is a tough job with lots of internal politics.......
 
The advantage of specials is you can 'try before you buy'.
But the training takes forever, and (in London, which probably isn't the same as the rest of the World), it's pretty crap.
We used ours for pony dull and unskilled tasks like standing on cordons, or guarding insecure premises while waiting for the keyholder to turn up. But in my experience of specials they are pretty useless for most police work.
 
Specials is a way in though, one of my relatives tried and failed to even get an interview so went the specials route for 2 years and was then accepted full time after proving herself.
 
Bernie174 said:
The advantage of specials is you can 'try before you buy'.
But the training takes forever, and (in London, which probably isn't the same as the rest of the World), it's pretty crap.
We used ours for pony dull and unskilled tasks like standing on cordons, or guarding insecure premises while waiting for the keyholder to turn up. But in my experience of specials they are pretty useless for most police work.
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That's quite sad to hear, and certainly not necessarily the same for all forces. In the force I work for the Specials are very active, well respected and involved in all sorts of activities, from scene guard through to operating with the Roads Policing Unit..and everything in-between.
 
Quite possibly, but I did qualify what I said with thats how they were used in the Met. Like everything there were good and bad., but too many wanted the buzz of the role without the responsibility. One in particular gave the rest a bad name, he expected to be driven about all night, but wouldn't put pen to paper. I refused to have him with me, he was useless and a liability. I didn't mind the ones that tried, but mostly failed, to them reporting a crime was a big thing, to me it was mundane, so if they wanted to do one and take 2 hours over it it was fine by me, even though it would take me 5 minutes. Trouble is in London those were few and far between.
Mostly though they tried, and we ended up doing most of it for them.
 
Bernie174 said:
Quite possibly, but I did qualify what I said with thats how they were used in the Met. Like everything there were good and bad., but too many wanted the buzz of the role without the responsibility. One in particular gave the rest a bad name, he expected to be driven about all night, but wouldn't put pen to paper. I refused to have him with me, he was useless and a liability. I didn't mind the ones that tried, but mostly failed, to them reporting a crime was a big thing, to me it was mundane, so if they wanted to do one and take 2 hours over it it was fine by me, even though it would take me 5 minutes. Trouble is in London those were few and far between.
Mostly though they tried, and we ended up doing most of it for them.
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Well perhaps they should just do away with the Specials all together then! Sounds like you had it all covered, Bernie! :meh: :indifferent:
 
My first station, we had no specials, we managed fine.
My second, they were mostly uniform carriers, we saw them some friday nights (most were long gone by pub kicking out time). My third station, they used to disappear from the station at about 8pm on a friday night. Never saw them the rest of the week.

Whether we wanted them or not, we HAD to have it covered without them.

Yes there were some OK ones. I never met a very good Special. There were others that had their uses. As I said, go stand on a broken window, or a cordon, better to use them for that than a properly trained Police Officer who knows what he's doing.

Do away with them? yes, I think they should. There is a cost attached to Specials, and apart from a community relations exercise they really aren't that productive.
 
It's unfortunate that you've had those experiences when working with them. Again, that view is certainly not mirrored in the force I work in where they are used effectively and complement the regulars well, not forgetting that many bring their own professional experiences to assist the police.
 
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