1DX2/5DM4/Other weddings/live music? Perfect AF in any situation?

D

dancook

Suspended / Banned
Messages
6,800
Name
Dan
Edit My Images
No
So I've been using the Leica SL since November last year, I've used it second shooting at weddings and it can be frustrating at times.

I love the image quality, the shutter sound, the design and handling of the camera
It's the autofocus where I'm sometimes having to compromise my ideals, I have been spoilt by the 5dM3 and D750 which I do not remember this much hunting or struggle with backlit subjects.
It would be with a heavy heart that I would ever see it go, but I just don't think I'd want the stress of not knowing whether it was going to focus properly when the shot mattered - if I ever decided to full time pro.

I've started to think about the 5d Mark IV and the 1DX2 - I preferred the ergonomics of the 5DM3 to the D750 so I'm drawn to the Canon.

Other than weddings, I'm shooting live music and you can see what I've done with the SL and Q here
https://danielcook.com/

Whilst the 1DX2 might seem overkill, it might give me that peace of mind to be able to 'instantly' get any shot I wanted - regardless of low light, back-lighting, movement of subject.
I am however concerned about the noise of the shutter for both wedding ceremonies and live music.

I don't know much about the latest Nikon alternatives, so feel free to educate me.

If only I could have it all...
 
How about a 6d? Very quiet shutter (even quieter on silent mode) centre point AF very sensitive and accurate even in very low light, and of course Canon's best low light sensor.

You'd be giving up loads of AF points and FPS but no-one should shoot a wedding machine gun style :)

Otherwise I'd say the 5dmk4 or wait for the 6d2, whenever that might be.
 
odd jim said:
How about a 6d? Very quiet shutter (even quieter on silent mode) centre point AF very sensitive and accurate even in very low light, and of course Canon's best low light sensor.

You'd be giving up loads of AF points and FPS but no-one should shoot a wedding machine gun style :)

Otherwise I'd say the 5dmk4 or wait for the 6d2, whenever that might be.
Click to expand...

Thanks,

With the DSLRs I use back-button C-AF, and the AF point which puts their eye/face/head where I want to keep it in the frame which is probably never in the centre. More AF points helps significantly with this because then I'm not constricted if there are too few AF points.

If the 6D is only really at it's best for centre recompose, then it won't work for me. I want to be able to follow people as they move around, and using wide apertures like 1.2 / 1.4 maybe 1.8 .. focus recompose creates room for error.

I manually shoot bursts, I still like to choose from (seemingly) minor differences in facial expressions, only use continuous shutter for bouquet throw - as long as the buffer doesn't fill up and stop me shooting to quickly.
 
Last edited:
dancook said:
Thanks,

With the DSLRs I use back-button C-AF, and the AF point which puts their eye/face/head where I want to keep it in the frame which is probably never in the centre. More AF points helps significantly with this because then I'm not constricted if there are too few AF points.

If the 6D is only really at it's best for centre recompose, then it won't work for me. I want to be able to follow people as they move around, and using wide apertures like 1.2 / 1.4 maybe 1.8 .. focus recompose creates room for error.

I manually shoot bursts, I still like to choose from (seemingly) minor differences in facial expressions, only use continuous shutter for bouquet throw - as long as the buffer doesn't fill up and stop me shooting to quickly.
Click to expand...

You shoot the same way I do Dan, dont get the 6D. The D750/5Dx is waaay better for this style.
 
Last edited:
.... Id say, if you can take the weight get the 1dx2 otherwise the 5div as you prefer the Canon ergos, the sensor is much improved over the 5d3 in terms of DR.

The 6D no longer has Canons best sensor, the 5div and 1dxii outperform it by a good margin.
 
Last edited:
twist said:
.... Id say, if you can take the weight get the 1dx2 otherwise the 5div as you prefer the Canon ergos, the sensor is much improved over the 5d3 in terms of DR.
Click to expand...

I could take on the world with the 1DX2 :) I haven't explored enough of what the 5DIV lacks by comparison - but if the 1dx2 is even more reliable with autofocus then it might be worth it.

Also I should explore what weather sealing each of the cameras offer. the Leica SL is pretty good for this.
 
dancook said:
Thanks,

With the DSLRs I use back-button C-AF, and the AF point which puts their eye/face/head where I want to keep it in the frame which is probably never in the centre. More AF points helps significantly with this because then I'm not constricted if there are too few AF points.

If the 6D is only really at it's best for centre recompose, then it won't work for me. I want to be able to follow people as they move around, and using wide apertures like 1.2 / 1.4 maybe 1.8 .. focus recompose creates room for error.

I manually shoot bursts, I still like to choose from (seemingly) minor differences in facial expressions, only use continuous shutter for bouquet throw - as long as the buffer doesn't fill up and stop me shooting to quickly.
Click to expand...

Indeed, your style would probably better suit something like the 5d3/4 where you have extra that flexibility.
 
dancook said:
I could take on the world with the 1DX2 :) I haven't explored enough of what the 5DIV lacks by comparison - but if the 1dx2 is even more reliable with autofocus then it might be worth it.

Also I should explore what weather sealing each of the cameras offer. the Leica SL is pretty good for this.
Click to expand...

Youre a what if guy, just get the 1dx2, as long as you feel you can carry it all day. :D
 
twist said:
View attachment 101359
Click to expand...

This is a very odd test though, why would you push 100 ISO by 6 stops? That would only happen if you totally, completely ballsed up and forgot to change your settings or went from a phone cam to a DSLR overnight [emoji3]. Wouldn't the test be better pushing a 1600 ISO shot? I'd be interested to see that.

(Not saying the tests wouldn't come out in that order, but that would be more of a real world scenario).
 
odd jim said:
This is a very odd test though, why would you push 100 ISO by 6 stops? That would only happen if you totally, completely ballsed up and forgot to change your settings or went from a phone cam to a DSLR overnight [emoji3]. Wouldn't the test be better pushing a 1600 ISO shot? I'd be interested to see that.

(Not saying the tests wouldn't come out in that order, but that would be more of a real world scenario).
Click to expand...

Not really, because huge DR is great to have in post. You can recover so much more, especially shooting fast lenses wide open, pull back highlights, pick up shadows to add depth without noise etc. Its very useful.
 
Last edited:
twist said:
Not really, because huge DR is great to have in post. You can recover so much more, especially shooting fast lenses wide open, pull back highlights, pick up shadows to add depth without noise etc. Its very useful.
Click to expand...

Oh I agree, but surely seeing the results you'd likely see if you were to shoot as you would, pushing an ISO 1600 by 1 or 2 stops would be better? The noise handling would be slightly different, and it's what you or I would utilise, rather than a massive boost from base ISO.
 
Last edited:
twist said:
Not really, because huge DR is great to have in post. You can recover so much more, especially shooting fast lenses wide open, pull back highlights, pick up shadows to add depth without noise etc. Its very useful.
Click to expand...

I saw in a review earlier about shooting ISO 100 and pushing to match exposure of 1600, and retaining the highlights
 
odd jim said:
Oh I agree, but surely seeing the results you'd likely see if you were to shoot as you would, pushing an ISO 1600 by 1 or 2 stops? The noise handling would be slightly different, and it's what you or I would utilise, rather than a massive boost from base ISO.
Click to expand...

Depends on the scenario but I play with exposure a lot in post and I keep my ISO as low as possible as with fast lenses on a good day SS goes through the roof fast, that highlight recovery is awesome, so is the shadow recover if I need it... Ive just gotten used to this way of working and Id take as much DR as I can get.

Think about it, you expose for land or sky, ones going to be underexposed the other blown (sky) with a fast lens, expose for sky at base to keep it from blowing out, pull up shadows in ground in post or vice versa.


Capture 2.JPG
 
Last edited:
4 stop push in post, had I exposed 'correctly' I couldnt do this in post without introducing noise in the shadows as I would be at a higher ISO, higher ISO less DR, the lower the ISO, the more I could push as I had all that latitude in post... and the window wouldve been long gone at higher ISO.

This is not a straight flat exposure increase across the image, I chose areas to highlight, I like the fact I can do that with lots of DR.

Capture3.JPG

 
Last edited:
And if you are interested... heres a straight 4 stop push.

Capture4.JPG
 
Last edited:
twist said:
Yes aka ISOless as you now know :D

https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canon-eos-5d-mark-iv/11

Im surprised youre not interested in the newer medium format stuff. I thought youd be all over that.
Click to expand...

Yes I wanted the X1D, but I still wanted to shoot weddings, so I bought the the Leica SL as my more versatile alternative to the Hasselblad X1D - the 50SL on it is lovely.. no AA filter etc..

just it's not as versatile as I had hoped..
 
dancook said:
Yes I wanted the X1D, but I still wanted to shoot weddings, so I bought the the Leica SL as my more versatile alternative to the Hasselblad X1D - the 50SL on it is lovely.. no AA filter etc..

just it's not as versatile as I had hoped..
Click to expand...

You should get a 5div and gfx50s :naughty:
 
Last edited:
dancook said:
Something like this setup?

Although I'd consider some primes instead of the 24-70 (which I'm not familiar with)... and remember I have a 28mm 1.7 in the Q. Optimal image quality that will be fast to AF with.


View attachment 101370
Click to expand...

latest
 
Hi there... I seem to remember at about the same time that you bought the Leica, you had a new dog. how's the dog going? I find the 24-70 hardly ever comes off my FF Canons. Although I am going to try an OLYMPUS OMD EM1 Mk2 next week as I want to run a parallel system for travel. Maybe!
 
Chipper said:
Hi there... I seem to remember at about the same time that you bought the Leica, you had a new dog. how's the dog going? I find the 24-70 hardly ever comes off my FF Canons. Although I am going to try an OLYMPUS OMD EM1 Mk2 next week as I want to run a parallel system for travel. Maybe!
Click to expand...

Might have been a mate's dog, I don't have a dog... yet.. despite my wife's best efforts!
 
dancook said:
it's not a bad shout, I will look into it :)
Click to expand...

Having tried the GFX I think you would struggle to shoot a wedding with it, the AF is good but its not great, I'm sure it'll get improved over time but it is restricted to contract detect only which seems to struggle compared to phase detect AF systems. That said the IQ is mind-blowing and I'll have one in a heartbeat once I have a bit more cash!
 
chrism_scotland said:
Having tried the GFX I think you would struggle to shoot a wedding with it, the AF is good but its not great, I'm sure it'll get improved over time but it is restricted to contract detect only which seems to struggle compared to phase detect AF systems. That said the IQ is mind-blowing and I'll have one in a heartbeat once I have a bit more cash!
Click to expand...

The plan was to use a mirrorless medium format camera for travel and portraits, and a DSLR for weddings and events.

However I'm going to continue using the SL for now, I just can't let it go.
 
dancook said:
The plan was to use a mirrorless medium format camera for travel and portraits, and a DSLR for weddings and events.

However I'm going to continue using the SL for now, I just can't let it go.
Click to expand...

The GFX would be amazing for that, its big but not noticeably bigger than a full-frame DSLR and its actually lighter, god I need to stop thinking about one before the wife finds out!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top